Karate or Kung Fu
- Thread starter Noodles03
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From dabbling in both, I've preferred kung fu, I like the low stances for isometric exercise and I think it could probably be used in place of a lot of the movement training a lot of people do today. My experience in both is pretty limited though, but @Frode Falch is the guy you want
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Comparing two very traditional and classical styres like this, is more easy then doing MMA vs TMA.
In my personal opinion, kung fu is way better because kung fu is fluid. Where karate tries to make you into Robocop.
That being said: there are more bad/useless kung fu styles out there then karate styles.
And outside china, its more easy to find a good karate gym, then a legit kung fu.
But IMO kung fu is not a finished fighting system, ready to use for live fighting. But it gives you some very good attributes you can use to become a very good fighting.
But if fighting skills is your main priority: seek out the "fast food" systems like boxing, wrestling, MMA, or thai/kickboxing.
In my personal opinion, kung fu is way better because kung fu is fluid. Where karate tries to make you into Robocop.
That being said: there are more bad/useless kung fu styles out there then karate styles.
And outside china, its more easy to find a good karate gym, then a legit kung fu.
But IMO kung fu is not a finished fighting system, ready to use for live fighting. But it gives you some very good attributes you can use to become a very good fighting.
But if fighting skills is your main priority: seek out the "fast food" systems like boxing, wrestling, MMA, or thai/kickboxing.
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Kung fu is prettier
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Kung fu by miles and miles. Way more patterns and moves, way more agility and flexibility and grace and beauty. Probably not as effective for fighting.
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Answer yourself first how far you want to go in regards to fighting. Full or Semi Contact . If you want to go full contact its Sanda or Seido / Kyukushin (maybe more styles).
Enshin Karate I have only seen crappy performances of their so called champs. Wouldnt recommend. Semi there are lots of styles and really depends on what kind of movement you like.
One more way to select is if a gym has kind of local world champions in a association with only a few gyms. These are 99% loudmouths and money grabbers without skill.
Personally I only tried out Kung Fu and been years in Karate. Kung Fu was fancier with lots of (useless) stuff like hand edge , open palm, wrist punches...etc, . If you like that its fine. Big problem is that Kung Fu guys were I come from dont have competitions (because ideology says its bad) so they only spar in their gym which can lead to delusional ideas about what technique works. That maybe different in your area. Semi contact Shotokan Karate was more straight forward but over time felt robotic and I missed fluidity of movement.. You really have to try it out. Its not about better / worse but personal preference.
That depends on your coaches and your own dedication. Flexibility/agility at a high level is the same.
I agree it has a more artistic feel to it but imo grace and beauty for me not at all. HIghly subjectice sure. I thought it looked silly attacking like a crane etc . Grace and Beauty I find in Ballet and boxing. Its really in the beholders eye
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i dont know man. just look at karate forms compared to kung fu forms. there are vastly more diverse and wide ranging athletic feats in kung fu forms than karate by a very large margin. i think you have not looked very deeply into kung fu.
this is precisely because kung fu is not just about what works in combat but is for lifelong range of motion, balance, grace of movement, fluidity, circular and straight movements etc.
the rest of your post must be meant for somebody else as i already said it wasn't about the fighting.....
this is just a basic kung fu form, not even a difficult one
and here is a basic karate form not a difficult one
with kung fu from almost any given system all of the athletic extremely flexible and diverse movements with extremely diverse range of motion is built in to the basic system. you learn 30 or so forms and when completed you can do all of those athletic feats. its just ordinary for kung fu.
this is not the case with karate at all unless a specific style has built all of that in for some reason usually for performance reasons.
the way i am using the terms athletic and diverse and grace and flexibility point to kung fu being vastly more complete in this way. if you want to redefine those words or use them in a different sense thats ok but then we wont be having the same conversation. you know what i mean...
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Aren't they the same?
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Just curious, what style of kung fu did you study?
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Kyokushin karate is the only style I'm aware of that can be described as robotic...
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I was learning modern Shaolin, whats taught in the temple everybodys heard of at the moment. So it was largely performance and form based and not strictly related to old Shaolin styles
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I imagine the experience relies heavily on the instructor. You will find potential "bullshido" in both. I started with Kung fu and learned some forms which was fine, but my Sifu really explained what the moves were for and dwelled a lot on the eye, throat, and groin strikes.
Not something I could ever use in competition, but definitely gave me confidence for walking around the streets at night.
Had a friend that went to a karate place nearby around the same time and would exchange notes. Always thought the fu was better, but again, probably depended on the teacher.
Not something I could ever use in competition, but definitely gave me confidence for walking around the streets at night.
Had a friend that went to a karate place nearby around the same time and would exchange notes. Always thought the fu was better, but again, probably depended on the teacher.
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Pretty much going to come down to the coach and the environment they create in their gym. I'm mostly a Karate guy and I've had just as much trouble with good Karate and Kungfu guys in open style kickboxing tournaments. I'd consider training either route if I moved to a new area and didn't know any of the gyms.
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Basically there are huge overlaps. Mythological both Karate and Kung fo originate from Darum / India who is no one else then Bodidharma the founder of Chàn in China and Zen Buddhism in Japan.
If you look about historical facts especially Okinawan Karate styles originate within chinese Kenpo. There was a strong cultural connection with esp. Fujian province during Ming dynasty era and later on.
Lots of chinese people moved to Okinawa and brought their style of fighting. Shorin Ryu / Shuri Te can even be translated as Kung Fu to chinese. As weapons were forbidden on Okinawa ( Shimazu 1609 on) in that time frame
Okinawan styles stayed true to their origin and in my opinion nowadays some Okinawan styles are a lot closer to the original Kung Fu styles as White Crane Fujian then anything in China.
Thats why to this day near any Okinawan style on Okinawa does also full contact sparring. This is meant to fight and thats its spiritual foundation.
In the end if you really use a martial art to fight weaponless there are only certain ways and they all focus on knee, leg, fist punch, ellbow and head as weapons.
Chinas cultural revolution or better culttural elimination surpressed and destroyed martial arts foundations. Thats why they had to reinvent by lore and thats imo why its often so detached from real fight application and sometimes feels like a fairy tale.
What is shown today and trained in temples in China ( what I have seen) I would more call folklore artistic dancing and kind of detached from its origins version of Kung Fu. All the "it should not be trained as full contact or even semi contact sparring / competition" originates from this detachement through Mao.
Kung Fu as a fighting art had many different styles that are lost nowadays. The ones we know of were not much different if at all to Okinawan Karate and as that hasnt changed much you can study that up to today in Japan.
Its all changing again nowdays as China opens up and Sanda is allowed and MT and boxing are also possible to train.
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It's easy;
In Karate we enjoy LARPing strong feudal Japanese fellows. It's very important you can count to 10 in Japanese or your belt doesn't count.
In Kungfu they wear a sash and twirl both themselves and shiny objects.
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Karate rocks, and Kung fu is for nerds
