International [ISIS Repatriation] Yazidis plead with Canada not to repatriate ISIS members

[Arkain2K]

As ISIS Fighters Fill Prisons in Syria, Their Home Nations Look Away
By Charlie Savage | July 18, 2018

Syrian Democratic Forces have converted this former school in Ainissa, Syria, into a makeshift prison for holding suspected Islamic State fighters. American funds helped pay for the towering concrete perimeter walls installed last month.
​

AINISSA, Syria — The two-story building here still looks much like the school it once was. But the classrooms are closed off by reinforced black doors, padlocked from the outside. And the campus is surrounded by men with machine guns seeking refuge from the desert heat in the shade of towering concrete perimeter walls.

The visitors’ echoing footsteps and voices were the only sounds on a recent day in a dusty pink-and-white hallway once filled with schoolchildren. But when a guard slid open a small window in a classroom door, a man’s face pressed against the opening. Behind him, about 15 others, sitting on mats in black sleeveless shirts, stared back.

The old school is one of about seven makeshift wartime prisons in northern Syria housing suspects accused of fighting for the Islamic State and captured by the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces. The S.D.F. prisons for male detainees — about 1,000 men from nearly 50 countries — are generally off limits, but a New York Times reporter accompanied a congressional delegation touring two of them, the first such visit to either.

The prisoners pose a dilemma that has no easy solution and that is growing urgent. Their home countries have been reluctant to take back the men. Their governments are leery that battle-hardened members of the Islamic State, also known as ISIS, might radicalize domestic prisoners. Some countries face legal hurdles to prosecuting militants if they take custody of them from a nonstate militia, as opposed to extraditing them from another government.

But the S.D.F. is unlikely to hold them forever. A debate is brewing inside the United States government about whether to take a few of them — either for prosecution in civilian court or to the wartime prison at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba — but even that leaves open the fate of the rest.

The uncertainty looms as a threat to the rest of the world, said Christopher P. Costa, a former senior director for counterterrorism on President Trump’s National Security Council who now heads the International Spy Museum. He pointed to the “wandering mujahedeen” of the 1980s who fought in Afghanistan, then metastasized Islamist mayhem to places like Bosnia.

“We can’t make those same mistakes,” he said.

A Temporary Fix

Members of the S.D.F. climb a stairwell during a battle against the Islamic State in Raqqa last year. The S.D.F. has captured nearly 1,000 Islamic State suspects but is prosecuting only Syrians, not foreigners, in an ad hoc system.​

The S.D.F. is holding about 400 Syrian men accused of joining ISIS, according to officials familiar with a recent snapshot of undisclosed government data, and 593 men from 47 other countries — many from Egypt, Morocco, Saudi Arabia, Tunisia and Turkey. About 80 are from Europe, including about 40 Russians and 10 to 15 each from France and Germany.

Officials refer to all the male captives as “foreign fighters.” Although ISIS put some recruits into administrative jobs, they believe most helped fight as the so-called caliphate collapsed.

A few prisoners climbed through a hole in the Ainissa prison last fall, according to a Special Operations commander who declined to give his name. Since then, the American military has helped the S.D.F. upgrade security, spending about $1.6 million.

At Ainissa, he said, about $150,000 paid for the double layer of precast concrete walls installed in June; security cameras and hallway gates will soon be added. About $750,000 is helping renovate a former government prison in Hasaka that will hold up to 1,000 detainees.

But, he cautioned, there is no completely secure option.

Despite the security upgrades, the S.D.F. is an unlikely permanent jailer. It is not a sovereign government with a recognized court system; it has set up ad hoc terrorism tribunals — and abolished the death penalty — but is using them to prosecute only Syrians, not foreigners.

And its geopolitical standing is precarious. Mr. Trump has indicated, despite mixed signals, that he wants to withdraw American forces from Syria soon. Menaced by the Turkish military, other rebel militias and the Russian-backed Syrian government, with whom it might strike a deal, the Kurdish-led S.D.F. could lose control over the prisons as the war rages on.

After meeting with local S.D.F. officials and touring its prisons, Senator Lindsey Graham, Republican of South Carolina, said he was no longer as concerned about breakouts or abuses, but had become more apprehensive about the fragility of the group’s position.

“The jail is better than I thought it would be. The people running it are better than I thought they would be,” he said. “But now I’m worried about the larger situation. It’s not really as sustainable as I thought it was. The detainees are going to be out on the street — or dead.”

Improving Conditions

Islamic State detainees are permitted an hour a day in this courtyard

​

The Kurds converted the Ainissa school into a prison a year ago amid the assault on Raqqa, the former ISIS stronghold, said Havall Khobat, an S.D.F. regional intelligence section chief who oversees both this jail and the one in the nearby border town of Kobane.

“We had no time — we just built it very quickly,” said Mr. Khobat, a 27-year-old with a serious demeanor who wore a green camouflage uniform with a blue kaffiyeh draping his shoulders, and who led a tour of the Ainissa prison. “We had the Kobane prison for a while and it was not enough for accepting all these detainees.”

The Ainissa facility held 223 ISIS suspects from Syria, and the Kobane prison just over 200 from other countries, he said. More keep flowing in as the S.D.F. fights Islamic State pockets and sleeper cells, he said; his goal was to capture “dangerous” people so they do not slip home.

Mr. Khobat described the prisons’ transformation, emphasizing efforts to make conditions more secure and humane “with our limited resources.” A doctor, shared with the Kobane prison, visits once a week. Detainees spend an hour a day in a caged courtyard heaped with mattresses. The cell shown to the delegation appeared air-conditioned and had a television. He said the detainees watched World Cup matches.

American Special Operations forces visit the prisons multiple times a week to offer expertise about how to secure and run them, and to help process new captives using biometrics and interrogation. But Lt. Gen. Paul E. Funk II, the leader of coalition forces fighting in Iraq and Syria, emphasized their limits: “Our job is not detaining people — we’re not doing it.”

To that end, the American military is also helping train S.D.F. prison guards. Asked whether there had been any allegations of detainee abuses, the commander acknowledged some. He provided few details but said that last fall, the S.D.F. self-reported and investigated an incident, jailing a guard.

Mr. Khobat said most ISIS detainees caused few problems, except a handful from Tunisia and Morocco whom he portrayed as “more extreme” ideologues. “When we have a person who is bad,” he added, “we talk to him and we put him in an isolated cell for 24 hours.”

The delegation was not shown a solitary confinement cell, and an American military official denied the Times’ request to speak with a detainee.

Prisoners in Limbo

Suspected Islamic State fighters are taken into custody by S.D.F. soldiers in Manbij, Syria, in 2016.
​

The first American man known to be captured by the S.D.F. is in American military custody in Iraq, his fate uncertain. The man, whose name has not been released, was registered by ISIS as a fighter but is not accused of fighting, court filings show. After deciding there was insufficient courtroom-admissible evidence to prosecute him, the Trump administration proposed handing him to Saudi Arabia, where he is a dual citizen, or releasing him back inside Syria.

His lawyers are fighting both ideas. Washington’s aversion to repatriating him has complicated efforts to encourage, perhaps even shame, other countries into taking back their own citizens. The Pentagon is leery of detention after its Afghanistan and Iraq war experiences, and its difficulties transferring the man have hardened officials’ resistance to taking custody of other S.D.F. detainees without exit plans — like pending indictments.

Two Kobane prisoners captured by the S.D.F. further underscore the dilemma. The men, El Shafee Elsheikh and Alexanda Kotey, are likely half of an ISIS cell that held and abused Western hostages, who called them “the Beatles” for their British accents; some victims, including Americans, were murdered in gruesome propaganda videos.

Britain stripped their citizenship and refused to take custody. The Trump administration is debating whether the United States should prosecute them — or take them to Guantánamo.

National-security professionals prefer civilian courts, which have convicted numerous terrorists, to Guantánamo’s dysfunctional tribunals. It also costs about 100 times as much to hold a prisoner in Cuba than in a maximum-security prison, and detaining ISIS members — as opposed to Al Qaeda — there would create legal risks.

But Trump administration officials have been searching for candidates to become its first new detainee since 2008. And Mr. Graham, a proponent of holding terrorism suspects in wartime detention — for interrogations without defense lawyers, and in case someone dangerous can’t be prosecuted — sees the two detainees as an opportunity to reopen Guantánamo for new business.

Mr. Graham said the two men should be tried in civilian court — eventually. But he argued that after the pair reached Guantánamo, Congress would be more likely to revoke a law that bars transferring detainees from Cuba to domestic soil for prosecution.

Senator Lindsey Graham, right, Republican of South Carolina, and Lt. Gen. Paul E. Funk II, the commander of coalition forces fighting in Iraq and Syria, on a visit to Syria​

The night before touring the S.D.F. prisons, Mr. Graham and Senator Jeanne Shaheen, Democrat of New Hampshire, debated the duo’s fate over a buffet-style dinner in Baghdad with military leaders of the international coalition fighting in Iraq and Syria.

“I don’t want them to get away,” Mr. Graham said, adding: “We’ve got to come up with a logical system that when we grab somebody with intelligence value, we can figure out what they know.”

But Ms. Shaheen said the United States should take the two directly to court and “bring them to justice.” Convictions would send a better message, she maintained, than reinvigorating Guantánamo, which she called “a recruiting tool” for terrorists.

Ms. Shaheen is working with the parents of James Foley, the American journalist who was beheaded in August 2014, apparently by another Beatle who was killed in 2015. His mother, Diane Foley, said in an interview that the two should be held accountable in a “fair trial,” arguing that Guantánamo would make them martyrs, fueling the Islamic State’s ideology.

“Jim was tortured and made an example of because of Guantánamo, so that would be the worst thing,” she said.

Limited Space

The S.D.F. is using American funds to renovate a 1960's-era government prison in Hasaka, Syria. It plans to start consolidating Islamic State detainees here next month​

Still, the two lawmakers agreed about something else: the United States should not take custody of the hundreds of other accused foreign fighters. Instead, their own governments should step up.

As it waits, the S.D.F. is shoring up its prison capacity. Its renovation of the old government prison in Hasaka is nearly complete; male ISIS detainees will be consolidated there starting in August. (The group holds ISIS women and children in displaced-persons camps, making case-by-case determinations about where to put male teenagers, officials said.)

With five three-story tiers extending out like fingers from a central control area, its cells are mainly for groups. One was lined with 39 beds, stacked in triple bunks. Its once-black walls, snaked by orange security camera cables, fumed with fresh white paint.

The warden, Adnan Ali, smiling in jeans with the sleeves of his plaid shirt rolled up, said he did not want Hasaka to become a “school for terrorists” where prisoners become more radicalized and form networks, so detainees will not get certain religious materials and collective praying will be banned.

But as part of that effort to help jihadists “think differently,” he said, he will “treat them like people,” unlike brutal Syrian government and ISIS prisons. They will wear ordinary clothing and have access to television and books. And the families of Syrians, at least, can visit them.

Imprisoning foreign fighters “is a big burden on our shoulders, but we have to accept that,” Mr. Ali said. “Even if we have to take the food away from our soldiers and give it to them, we will keep them here so they do not harm the rest of the world.”

Warning that the prison will run out of room, he implored other countries to “take their fighters back.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/18/...tion=click&module=RelatedLinks&pgtype=Article

 

[WTF2008]

Trudeau will let him back in, in exchange for being allowed to dress like an Arab jihadists during parliament. Of which the left will celebrate it as 'woke level 12' status.

Gotta leave a like just for "woke level 12" lol. I actually did lol, didn't just phone tap it.

 

[Arkain2K]

 

[ryan3434]

Let me just throw this out there.

I feel sorry for their family/loved ones probably never seeing these people again while strangers cheer for the death of said loved one.

THAT said, they fucking should have known better what they were getting themselves into when they (the person in question) left.

You think the family didn't have a say in these guys leaving to fight for the is is? They are likely more upset he didn't die a marters death.

 

[Arkain2K]

Australian Government silent on Australian prisoners in Syria
By Tessa Fox | OCTOBER 7, 2019​

Back in 2014 in the northern suburbs of Melbourne, Mahir Absar Alam was "kicking back" with his friends, listening to what was happening in Syria.

The country was then in the midst of a civil war, and the terror organisation ISIS had capitalised on the chaos and declared their so-called caliphate.

Alam was 22 at the time and studying accounting and finance at TAFE in the hope of entering university.

"I was thinking about how my life was going, and I was like, I've got to do something that makes a difference," Alam told AAP.

"I thought I would come help the Syrian people, and it turned out I went somewhere else, where I shouldn't be."

Along with more than 5000 foreigners, Alam now sits in jail in northeast Syria after surrendering himself to the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) and the coalition in ISIS's last stronghold of Baghouz six months ago.

He travelled to Syria via Turkey with three other friends; one is still missing and two were killed in airstrikes.

Alam says after arriving the friends completed their initial religious classes before they were separated.

He had told ISIS he didn't go there to fight so instead was sent to the hospital in Raqqa and taught nursing.

In the hospital Alam was exposed to Abu Yousef al-Australi, a fellow Australian known for his ISIS propaganda videos.

Al-Australi's initial videos encouraged people to join him working in the hospital, though he later appeared in footage wearing military fatigues and carrying a machine gun.

Alam said it took him six months to realise what he had got himself into, and at that point, he looked for ways to escape.

"You know how propaganda works, it was misleading propaganda," he said.

He attempted to find a smuggler to get him out of the region, though it was complicated by the fact he was married to a Syrian woman and had two children.

In 2018 he tried again, making contact with the Free Syrian Army (FSA).

"I nearly made it out but I got caught by ISIS secret services (and) I was imprisoned," Alam said.

"I was in prison from 20 days to a month. I had accusations against me that I was a spy for FSA and I sold weapons to FSA, because I tried to leave."

Alam said he wasn't religious at all before he went to Syria, and called himself the "black sheep" of his Bangladeshi-Australian family.

He received sharia - Islamic law - training from ISIS, who also taught him Arabic.

When asked if he still believes in sharia law today, Alam stated it's in the Koran, so he has to believe in it.

"For one, cutting off the hand is a sharia law for stealing. I agree with it because I'm pretty sure it's in the Koran and the Sunnah as well," Alam said when asked to define various laws.

The Sunnah can be described as the set of customs for Muslims based on the teachings of Mohammed.

Alam became visibly uncomfortable while explaining his stance on sharia law.

"It's not out of my own will but the sharia law and the Koran says to do that, Allah's created laws so we have to follow his laws," he said.

In the Raqqa hospital Alam attended to a patient who had his hand cut off for stealing.

"I was kind of shocked, it was the first time I've seen something like that," he said, adding that he didn't think the man deserved it but it was up to an Islamic judge.

"I think people should have two hands. Personally I wouldn't do something like that. But I do believe in the law," he said.

Alam had difficulty explaining his stance on whether sharia law should be instated in Australia.

"I'd prefer it, but it's not, so I'm happy with that. I can't talk against the Koran and the Sunnah," he said.

"God says in the Koran ... sharia rule will be implemented in the end."

He said he wants nothing to do with ISIS anymore, and that he and the majority of other foreigners are "done and dusted".

The Australian Government has remained silent on what to do with their citizens in prison in Syria.

SDF spokesman Mustafa Bali told AAP the best way to deal with foreigners who joined ISIS was to set up an international court in northern Syria.

"All of those people have committed crimes here, on the ground here," Bali said.

He said the Australians especially were supporters of ISIS, considering they travelled so far at a time when mass atrocities were being perpetrated by the terror organisation.

"When we talk about Australia, it is far away from here, so when someone came from Australia to Raqqa or Deir ez-Zor, of course they didn't come to have fun, they came for something."

The SDF have been left alone to deal with foreigners in the region, receiving no help from the UN or any overseas governments.

"The Western governments, the Australian government and people in general need to understand that their governments are not helping us in the fight against ISIS," Bali said.

Alam explained it is difficult for all the Australians in prison because they don't know what is going to happen to them.

He wanted to tell Australians how sorry he was, though realised it's hard for anyone to believe him.

"Australia, I'm very apologetic, I came here and I feel like I've betrayed the people, because I came for a different cause and I've actually done something completely different," he said.

https://amp.news.com.au/world/break...a/news-story/8839f339cab9bae7cc463643f7b5fe5a

 

[Stoic1]

Suddenly very relevant, eh?

 

[Paradigm]

Suddenly very relevant, eh?

 

[Arkain2K]

They Left to Join ISIS. Now Europe Is Leaving Their Citizens to Die in Iraq.
By Pilar Cebrián | September 15, 2019

BAGHDAD—There was no other way out. After months under siege in the Syrian city of Raqqa, the Belgian Islamic State member Bilal al-Marchohi decided to escape. He fled his post as a religious police officer at the break of dawn on August 29, 2017, and ran with his wife and son to the closest enemy checkpoint. With his arms up, he handed himself over to the Kurdish militants in the hope of eventually being repatriated to Belgium. The family was immediately separated, and his spouse and child were transferred to a nearby Islamic State relatives camp.

Along with other jihadi comrades, al-Marchohi was driven to a prison near the city of Tabqa, where he was interrogated by U.S. officials on his role in the organization, his closest companions, and on weaponry manufacturing. The 23-year-old jihadi told them he used to attend the Friday prayers at De Koepel mosque in Antwerp, whose imam, Youssef, ended up joining the fight in Syria. Al-Marchohi waited until he turned 18 to cross the Turkish-Syrian border with his girlfriend and other acquaintances, first joining the Nusra Front and later deserting to the Islamic State, after internal clashes erupted within the armed opposition brigades.

U.S. soldiers took him to Kobani in northern Syria and from there to Erbil in Iraqi Kurdistan by helicopter, he recalls. “I was alone. I stayed there for two months and I went crazy. It was very hard. … Because of the strong lights, I was not able to sleep,” al-Marchohi told Foreign Policy in an exclusive interview. The Belgian was one of the first jihadis transferred by the U.S. army from Syria to Iraq after the liberation of Raqqa, as part of a series of renditions, during which at least three other European citizens were handed over to the Iraqi judiciaryThe Belgian was one of the first jihadis transferred by the U.S. army from Syria to Iraq after the liberation of Raqqa, as part of a series of renditions, during which at least three other European citizens were handed over to the Iraqi judiciary, possibly in contravention of international law.

“I even met the Belgians there and I cooperated with them,” he said, referring to Belgian intelligence agents. “They told me: ‘We will take you to the local government now, and you will wait to see the judge and maybe you go back to Belgium, maybe not.’” But al-Marchohi wasn’t repatriated; instead he was escorted from Erbil to Baghdad, where he was delivered to Iraqi counterterrorism forces and subjected to a new, harsher round of interrogations.

Western governments are generally reluctant to facilitate the repatriation of Islamic State militants. After the departure of more than 5,000 European citizens, European countries don’t wan’t to deal with the returnees file. “Except Germany, no other European country is interested in the return of their citizens accused of being Daesh members,” claimed Hisham al-Hashimi, an Iraqi researcher who briefs officials on jihadi group dynamics. “Western countries don’t have a policy for jihadi returnees, they are not ready for their arrival. … And if they get a death penalty in Iraq, they will be thankful,” he says.

It’s a political matter more than anything; lawmakers won’t dare to defy public opinion. In France, 89 percent of respondents are against the return of adult jihadis; and 67 percent oppose the repatriation of children, according to a survey by Odoxa.

The issue of repatriation would also require consensus across the European Union from a security perspective. If a returnee enters the Schengen Area, all of that territory would be at risk because of free movement. A returned Belgian could strike in Spain.

Bringing Islamic State members back also exposes a judicial weakness; a lack of evidence could lead to short prison sentences, and jihadis might only serve three- to five-year jail terms before they are back on the streets. If a terrorist attack were perpetrated by a repatriated fighter in coming years, the political party that approved their return would face devastating consequences.

Al-Marchohi has become a pawn in this international political chess match—rejected by his own nation and subject to the judicial system of one where he has never lived. He claims Iraqi officers fabricated a confession to show he could therefore be tried under Iraqi jurisdiction. “They wrote that I got arrested in Mosul, and forced me to put my fingerprints on it,” he explains, despite the fact that he surrendered in Raqqa. An investigative judge examined this evidence and passed his case on to a criminal court.

It was not until a year later that al-Marchohi attended his first hearing, at Rusafa court in Baghdad. In front of three magistrates, confined in a wooden cage, the Belgian got a court-appointed defense lawyer with whom he couldn’t communicate before the trial. During the third hearing, with Belgian consular officials in attendance, he was sentenced to death by hanging for “belonging to a terrorist organization and his involvement in fighting against Iraqi forces in Mosul.”

The Iraqi Supreme Court later published a purported quote by Abu Fadel al-Belgiki (al-Marchohi’s Islamic State nom de guerre) following the formal resolution: “We fought fierce battles with Iraqi forces in Mosul and when the army began to advance and control most of the area, I fled towards Syria, but I could not escape and was arrested inside Iraqi territory.”

But there is evidence that contradicts this supposed confession. When al-Marchohi was interrogated in Syria, the information was compiled under Operation Gallant Phoenix by the U.S. Army, which gathers data and evidence on foreign terrorist fighters for the multinational mission there. His fingerprints were taken, and the U.S. military personnel took a picture of him looking exhausted and wild-haired. The classified tactical report establishes the place of detention as “Raqqah, Syria” on “29/0400/Z/AUG/17” (Aug. 29, 2017, at 4 a.m.), and doesn’t mention Iraq at all.

Nevertheless, this evidence wasn’t introduced during the court hearing. The confidential information is “provided only for intelligence purposes in an effort to develop investigative leads,” the report explained “and cannot be used in affidavits, court proceedings, subpoenas, or for other legal or judicial purposes.” But this doesn’t mean the Belgian authorities were not briefed. Indeed, “Belgian Military Intelligence and Security Service is always required before transmission of any information contained in this document,” according to the classified file.

Al-Marchohi was not the first European jihadi to be sentenced to death in Iraq. The Belgian Tarik Jadaoun received the same sentence a year earlier, as did 11 French men transferred from Syria in January 2019. Lamia K., a German national, faced the same fate until officials in Berlin insisted on Germany’s stance against capital punishment and, after the appeals process, her sentence was commuted to a 20-year jail term. So far none of them have been executed.

Belgian officials claim, like their counterparts in other European countries, that they will lobby, through diplomatic channels, against al-Marchohi’s death penalty if it is eventually imposedBelgian officials claim, like their counterparts in other European countries, that they will lobby, through diplomatic channels, against al-Marchohi’s death penalty if it is eventually imposed after the appeal process. “We always fight for the abolition of the death penalty, whether it is through international organizations and fora or in our bilateral relations in countries where it is still in vigor,” said Nadia Benini, the deputy spokesperson of the Belgian Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Nevertheless, they insist they respect Iraqi sovereignty and that they “try to remain discreet in consular affairs.”

Each EU member state addresses the returnees differently: The U.K. has stripped terror suspects of citizenship, as was the case with Shamima Begum, the London teenager who traveled to Syria at the age of 15. Under the 2006 amendment of the 1981 British Nationality Act, a person can be deprived of citizenship if it would be “conducive to the public good” and the person is eligible for another passport. The U.K. has made her stateless, an illegal act according to international conventions, because she never applied for her parents’ Bangladeshi nationality.

The U.K. “is not even considering sending the children back,” said Richard Barrett, a former director of global counterterrorism at the British foreign intelligence service MI6. “They say no to anybody and they’re not talking about it. It’s basically waiting for a crunch. Only if they escape and go back to Turkey, they might be sent back to the U.K. in a week.”

France and Belgium are examining fighters on a case-by-case basis, and have repatriated at least 27 children, some of them orphans, since the fall of the Islamic State’s last territory. But the return of adults is still unlikely. Lawyers in Baghdad have even suggested that there has been diplomatic interference in the judicial process, as was allegedly the case with the French jihadi Mélina Boughedir: “Between the first and the second session of the trial the French ambassador in Iraq had a meeting with the head of the [Supreme] Judicial Council Faiq Zidan,” claimed NasserAddin Madlool Abed, Boughedir’s Iraqi attorney. She was initially sentenced to a seven-month jail term, “but in the second hearing recess, the main judge left to a private room. He was on the phone for 15 minutes and when he came back … he gave her a life sentence,” he recalled.

Moreover, Germany, which has recently accepted four children from Syria, accepts there is not a strategy to bring foreign fighters back: “We examine case by case,” said a member of the German diplomatic service. “The cases come to us and not vice versa. … Because, is there a legal framework?” he asked rhetorically, pointing out the lack of extradition agreements.

The subject has even been a source of disagreement within the international coalition that fought the Islamic State. The United States has lobbied EU members to take their citizens back. “We are still trying to get the countries to repatriate them but first, they don’t want to do it; and second, if they do it they want to keep it entirely quiet. Which I don’t personally agree with,”said U.S. Col. Sean Ryan, a coalition spokesman.

The transfer of terrorist suspects from Syria to Iraq is being used as a mechanism to circumvent the judicial and political vacuum in northern Syria.

The Kurdish-led authority, derived from the postwar partition of Syria and administered by the Democratic Union Party (PYD), does not have international diplomatic recognition. This means Kurdish courts cannot prosecute foreign Islamic State convicts. Furthermore, European governments fear that imprisonment in an unstable territory might lead to a prison break—as happened in Derik prison near the Iraqi-Syrian border in April, when French detainees turned against their guards, although no one managed to escape—or encourage bribery.

The most publicized rendition transfer was the handover of the 11 French jihadis in January. During a subsequent visit by Iraqi President Barham Salih to Paris, French President Emmanuel Macron admitted that the operation had taken place, and disavowed responsibility by saying that it was up to the Iraqi authorities “to decide, sovereignly,” if captured jihadis had to be subjected to legal proceedings. “They are accused of having commanded operations against Iraqis,” added Salih. But although there is evidence that some of the 13 French detainees had previously entered Iraqi territory, there is no such evidence in the case of al-Marchohi.

The Iraqi judicial labyrinth, labeled by human rights defenders as “Guantánamo East,” does not grant the accused basic human rights and procedural guarantees. It seems to be the path favored by many European countries to prosecute the jihadis.The Iraqi judicial labyrinth, labeled by human rights defenders as “Guantánamo East,” does not grant the accused basic human rights and procedural guarantees. It seems to be the path favored by many European countries to prosecute the jihadis. The Americans took al-Marchohi out “because the U.S. unfortunately can do whatever they like to prosecute a foreigner,” explained Clive Stafford Smith, founder of the London legal-action charity Reprieve and a Guantánamo detainees’ lawyer who has been hired by some relatives of Western-born Islamic State members. “No European country can do it because under European law it’s illegal. Rendition is illegal,” he added. “You are rendering someone into a nonfair trial, to face the death penalty, which is also illegal … so the Americans have to be in charge of that.”

Iraqi prosecutors also lack proper evidence to prosecute foreign fighters, claimed Thomas Renard, a researcher at the Egmont Institute in Brussels and the author of a report on European jihadi returnees. “Some of them may not have been in Iraq … so what is the legitimacy of this country to prosecute them?” he asked. “The judicial system is not up to international standards either. We’ve witnessed trials with no lawyers, that last 15 minutes, where children of 12 years old or less have been tried,” he added. “And when they are convicted, they end up in Iraqi jails that are not meeting international standards of detention.”

Those who have been relocated from Syrian to Iraqi jails have hugely varied profiles: One of them is Lahcen Gueboudj, a 59-year-old French man who claims to have traveled to Raqqa in search of his son, and who is now serving life in prison; another is a 30-year-old Austrian of Afghan descent, whom the Iraqis accuse of being a fighter, although he insisted in an interview with Foreign Policy that he entered Syria to join his relatives and live under sharia rule. His trial is scheduled for October.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/1...ope-is-leaving-their-citizens-to-die-in-iraq/

 

[sweede]

They Left to Join ISIS. Now Europe Is Leaving Their Citizens to Die in Iraq​

And no one shed any tears.


​

 

[Teehee]

This is the retardation of not having a death penalty

Instead of wasting time and money just shoot them in the head

No need for retardation anymore

 

[Arkain2K]

Suddenly very relevant, eh?

It has always been relevant, even though Europe pretends it doesn't exists.

 

[Arkain2K]

Months after the fall of ISIS, Europe has done little to take back its fighters
By Michael Birnbaum | June 20, 2019​

BRUSSELS — European leaders have hammered the United States for nearly two decades about the injustice of Guantanamo Bay, where prisoners are held indefinitely at a detention camp outside the normal U.S. justice system.

But faced with what to do about European nationals who went to fight for the Islamic State and ended up in Syrian detention camps, the continent’s leaders are proving reluctant to bring their citizens to trial at home.

Three months after the collapse of the Islamic State, about 2,000 foreign fighters are imprisoned in Syria and Iraq, and about 800 of them are believed to be European, according to U.S. officials. Those figures don’t include the thousands of wives and children with foreign citizenship.

European leaders have made little movement to repatriate their citizens, even as U.S. and Kurdish authorities beg them to take back their people. Some security officials warn that inaction could enable future attacks, and human rights advocates deplore the conditions in overcapacity camps.

“It’s obvious that there is a humanitarian crisis unfolding in the camps in northeast Syria and the prisons in Iraq that are holding thousands of foreigners,” said Letta Tayler, a global terrorism researcher at Human Rights Watch. “Western Europe’s response has been to look the other way. It just goes against everything that Western Europe says it stands for.”

European leaders have taken a hard look at what their domestic populations want — and blinked. Popular opinion is overwhelmingly against bringing back the European fighters. The anger sharpened after terrorist attacks in Paris in 2015 and Brussels in 2016, in which some of the perpetrators had visited the caliphate.

“Ordinary Belgians want them to be taken care of over there,” said Koen Metsu, a Belgian lawmaker who has worked on security issues. The Europeans who joined the Islamic State “knew up front what they were about to do,” he said.

Even bringing back the children of the fighters is unpopular. France and the Netherlands have taken back orphans in recent days, because those children are free from the leaden political baggage of having parents who might also want to return alongside them. Belgium last week announced plans to do the same. Britain, meanwhile, has sought to strip suspected Islamic State sympathizers of their citizenship.

Some fighters and sympathizers have been convicted in absentia — unable to appear at their European trials because they were in Syria. But authorities have little appetite to bring people home to serve their sentences.

European countries have also begun to outsource prosecutions to Iraqi courts. Justice is swift, the burden of proof light, access to lawyers minimal and the punishment consistent: death by hanging, according to human rights groups who have witnessed the proceedings. In recent weeks, 11 French citizens, among others, have been sentenced to death. France, which opposes the death penalty, signaled it will not stand in the way of the trials, saying it respects Iraqi sovereignty.

Advocates of shifting prosecutions to Iraqi courts, including Metsu, acknowledge that some fighters may have fought in Syria only, not Iraq, raising questions whether Iraqis truly have jurisdiction. But they say justice is better served close to where crimes were committed and where witnesses and evidence are nearby.

The question of whether to reclaim fighters and their families is less pressing for the United States, because only a few dozen U.S. citizens are known to have traveled to join the Islamic State, according to counterterrorism analysts. But America has started to bring its people home. This month, six children and two women were flown back from the al-Hol camp to be resettled in the United States, according to Syrian Kurdish authorities. Three men and a woman are awaiting U.S. trial. Three others agreed to plea deals. And one Virginia man is appealing a sentence of 20 years for providing material support to a designated terrorist organization.

U.S. officials, having made greater progress than their European counterparts, have sought to claim the moral high ground and to impress that the current situation is not sustainable.

“It is not a solution to leave these people in camps in northeast Syria. This is a burden on the people of northeast Syria,” James Jeffrey, the U.S. special representative for Syria engagement, told reporters last week. “It is absolutely imperative that countries take action as necessary to deal with their own citizens.”

The challenge bloomed as a U.S.-led coalition took over the final pockets of Islamic State territory in Syria and Iraq. That sent a wave of refugees and ex-fighters into the already fragile camps in Kurdish-controlled northeast Syria. Many of the men are in improvised prisons. Women and children are not under the same tight control, but those suspected of Islamic State sympathies are not allowed to move freely.

At al-Hol, more than 73,000 people are packed into facilities built to house about half that. The camp population includes 3,200 foreign women and 7,900 foreign children, alongside more than 60,000 Syrians and Iraqis, according to Kurdish authorities. There are just three mobile clinics at the camp, and shortages of medicine are acute.

The Kurdish forces who operate the jammed camps have few resources. Some of them complain they are being forced to lavish more money on their defeated enemies than on their own war-frayed population.

Meanwhile, President Trump has said he wants to withdraw U.S. forces from the region. A pullout could threaten the viability of the camps, because the U.S. military has been a crucial source of support for the Kurds.

Trump tweeted his frustration at the end of April: “European countries are not helping at all, even though this was very much done for their benefit. They are refusing to take back prisoners from their specific countries. Not good!”

The inaction by European politicians also comes over the objections of some of their own security officials. Many who work to keep Europeans safe — but who don’t have to win their votes — would prefer to keep terrorism suspects and convicts close by, where they can be watched, instead of running the risk they could vanish abroad and plot future violence.

“There is a disconnect between the political world that is very concerned about the political risks that are associated with the repatriation of terrorists, and the various services that are dealing with counterterrorism daily,” said Thomas Renard, a terrorism expert at the Brussels-based Egmont Institute. “Having these individuals here, prosecuting them here, is not only feasible but also probably less problematic.”

“Purely from a security point of view, we should not make the mistakes of the past. We should not create a new Guantanamo Bay,” said one senior European security official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive assessments that do not line up with those of national leaders.

Many of Europe’s objections to Guantanamo, the U.S. detention facility in Cuba, had to do with torture. But other factors that led the United States to detain people there — a lack of confidence in civilian courts to handle terrorism trials and a fear of the political backlash of bringing terror detainees onto U.S. soil — echo in the European decisions, the official said.

European sentences for terrorism-related charges tend to be lighter than in the United States — the lightest offenses are punishable with two- to five-year sentences. Prisons can be hotbeds of radicalization. And European politicians warn that mustering the battlefield evidence necessary for convictions on serious charges can be difficult. Some countries, such as Sweden, never criminalized travel to Syria, making it difficult for law enforcement to charge people for basic association with the Islamic State.

“It’s political suicide to try to bring them back, because the public doesn’t want them back,” said Magnus Ranstorp, a counterterrorism expert at the Swedish Defense University. “They’ve committed atrocities, but you cannot convict them. And if you can convict them, it won’t be for that long unless you can prove murder. It’s a ripe mess.”

Swedish leaders are advocating a different approach.

“We said we will not repatriate terrorists to Sweden,” said Swedish Home Affairs Minister Mikael Damberg in an interview. Damberg has pushed for an international tribunal near Syria to prosecute Islamic State crimes. He said that would provide a way to process the detainees without bringing them to Europe.

“Not doing anything in the region, close to evidence and witnesses, is also complicated, and risks not actually prosecuting and condemning them,” he said.

Skeptics of the effort, including the U.S. government, say setting up a tribunal could take years, by which time evidence would be lost and memories faded. They also say it would force an even bigger burden on Iraq, which is already struggling to rebuild after Islamic State occupation. The Iraqi government is in talks to take back about 30,000 of its own citizens who traveled to Syria to live under Islamic State rule.

Some families of terrorism victims say they would prefer that justice be served closer to home.

“We want those trials to happen in France,” said Georges Salines, whose daughter, Lola, died in the 2015 Paris terrorist attacks. “We really want for those people to be heard by judges. We want to know how they got radicalized.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/after-caliphate-collapsed-europe-has-done-little-to-take-back-those-who-joined-isis/2019/06/20/4bab9cc2-8bc4-11e9-b6f4-033356502dce_story.html

 

[Arkain2K]

U.S. military takes custody of British ISIS terrorists known as the 'Beatles'
By Kayla Brantley | 9 October 2019

Two British ISIS terrorist accused of killing American hostages are being transferred to U.S. military custody due to impending Turkish invasion into Syria threatening their continued detention by Kurdish forces.

The Washington Post reports that Alexanda Kotey and El Shafee Elsheikh, two of the four British ISIS soldiers known as the 'Beatles', were being held by the Kurds with the goal of making the stand trial in the U.S.

However, since President Trump decided to pull American troops out of Northern Syria there are fears the men would escape from Syrian jail after a Turkish invasion.

A senior official tells The Washington Post that those men have been taken to Iraq, while another called them 'high-valued detainees' and could not disclose where they were being taken.

Prosecutors would reportedly seek to charge the two men as 'conspirators in hostage-taking resulting in death'. Those charges carry a potential death sentence, the Washington Post reports.

Prosecution in the U.S. relies on whether British authorities will release evidence to American courts.

The issue is currently being decided in the Supreme Court of the U.K.

The third 'Beatle', Mohammed Emwazi, is accused of killing Americans James Foley, Steven Sotloff, and Peter Kassig. Emwazi was killed in a drone strike in 2015.

The fourth member, Aine Davis, was convicted in Turkey and sentenced to seven years in prison.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...h-ISIS-terrorists-known-Beatles.html#comments

 

[Arkain2K]

Turkey's Syria advance leaves Europe with foreign fighter dilemma
John Irish and Joseph Nasr

Turkey-backed Syrian rebel fighters are seen in action in the village of Yabisa, near the Turkish-Syrian border, Syria, October 13, 2019​

PARIS/BERLIN (Reuters) - European states are trying to fast-track a plan to shift thousands of foreign Islamic State militants out of Syrian prison camps and into Iraq, after the outbreak of fresh conflict in Syria raised the risk of jihadists escaping or returning home.

Europeans comprise a fifth of around 10,000 Islamic State fighters held captive in Syria by Kurdish militias, which are under heavy attack by Turkish forces. If the militias redeploy prison guards to the front line, there is a risk of jail-breaks.

Before Turkey began its offensive last week, European nations had been assessing how to create a mechanism that could ultimately see foreign fighters moved from Syria to face trial in Iraq for war crimes.

Europe does not want to try its Islamic State nationals at home, fearing a public backlash, difficulties in collating evidence against them, and risks of renewed attacks from militants on European soil.

Iraq saw some of the bloodiest battles against Islamic State and its government is already conducting trials of thousands of suspected Islamic State insurgents with many arrested as the group's strongholds crumbled throughout Iraq.

Eleven legal experts from EU countries first met in June to assess their options and made slow progress, partly due to European concerns over the fairness of Iraqi justice. But the Turkish attack in northern Syria has since spurred European powers to fast-track it, diplomatic and government sources say.

"There is a sense that the Iraqis want their Nuremburg moment and that Iraqi families want to see Islamic State pay so we have to find a way that satisfies everyone so that they are judged without the death penalty being implemented even if that is the sentence," said a European diplomat.

A core group of six nations, who have the bulk of fighters held in Kurdish prisons, including France, Britain and Germany, have now pressed ahead with narrowing options after ruling out a fully international "ad hoc" tribunal. Such a body could take years to establish and was unlikely to get U.N. Security Council backing.

They last met on Oct. 11 in Copenhagen focusing on a hybrid structure involving international and Iraqi judges. Those discussions are in parallel with the Baghdad government.

"It's not simple. We don't want to face litigation from jihadist families back in European courts," said another European diplomat. "The situation is sufficiently complex that we didn't need to add a degree of urgency when there wasn't one. That has changed with Turkey's actions."

Negotiations with Iraq, which is also seeking millions of dollars in financial compensation for taking European fighters, are not straightforward.

'DIFFICULT QUESTIONS'

Iraqi Prime Minister Adel Abdul Mahdi said in June that his government was exploring the idea of prosecuting foreign Islamic State fighters currently held in Syria, but had at that time not received serious offers.

Three European diplomats said talks with Iraq were ongoing, and that there would be a push to accelerate those efforts in light of Turkey's offensive, but that they were still some way off coming to an agreement with Baghdad.

"The Iraqis want money to pay for it, written agreements with every country and promises of no criticism of the proceedings," Belkis Wille, senior researcher for Iraq at Human Rights Watch, told Reuters.

"This (Turkish offensive) is speeding everything up and makes it more likely," she said.

With no recognized legal system in the Kurdish Syrian areas, Western countries have as a result not opposed the principle of transferring some jihadists from the region to Iraq to face justice.

About a dozen French jihadists were moved in January and subsequently sentenced to death. Officials say no foreigners appear to have been moved between the two countries since. The Europeans had been waiting to see whether those death sentences would be implemented.

"We don't want them back and public opinion won't support it," said a French diplomatic source. "Beyond the most vulnerable children on a case-by-case basis, the option of repatriating the adults is clearly not what we want. That hasn't changed because of the Turks."

Those comments were echoed by Belgian, Dutch and German officials. "There are difficult questions to be answered about adult Islamic State fighters with German citizenship," said a German foreign ministry source.

'COLONIAL HYPOCRISY'

Other than the detention centers for fighters, thousands more women and children are in camps guarded by Kurdish forces in areas not specifically targeted by Turkey. The Kurdish forces have said that protecting those prisons and camps is also no longer their priority.

The Syrian Kurdish-led authorities said on Friday that five fighters fled a prison in the northeastern town of Qamishli after Turkish shelling. On Sunday, they said 785 foreigners affiliated with Islamic State, mostly women and children, managed to escape a camp at Ain Issa. Reuters could not independently verify the reports.

There are several detention centers in areas Turkey is set on capturing, which Ankara estimates about 1,000 foreign jihadists are held in. Turkish officials have said suggested they could eventually return all foreign nationals back to their home country.

"We took back our bad guys. There is a certain colonial hypocrisy from the Europeans on this subject," a senior Turkish diplomat said. "They want fighters to be tried in the region under their conditions."

European officials say their immediate priority is to persuade U.S. President Donald Trump, whose decision to withdraw U.S troops from northern Syria effectively enabled Turkey to make its advance, to reverse his policies and to persuade Ankara to cease its operations.

They argue that the offensive is weakening the coalition fighting Islamic State, which will embolden remaining Islamic State cells and pave the way for the group's revival.

Underscoring those concerns the U.S. military has taken custody of two high-profile foreign Islamic State militants previously held by the Kurds and moved them out of the country, U.S. officials have said.

Jean-Charles Brisard, President of the Terrorism Analysis Center in Paris, said European powers were left waiting to see how the situation evolved, but that their policy of keeping their nationals in either Syria or Iraq to face trial had become "untenable".

"All the European countries took a decision because of their public opinions not to repatriate their jihadists, but it was clear the Kurds wouldn't keep them indefinitely," France's former ambassador to Washington Gerard Araud said.

"Sooner or late the jihadist question was bound to come up and obviously the only solution is to bring them back to be able to control them," he said.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1WS0IF

 

[Arkain2K]

Killing them would solve the problem

Nope. That would go against the civilized European ideals.

Didn't you read the article directly above your own post?

 

[TripleAz]

So they fear Europeans errrrr Isis supporters will be upset? Lmfao UKucks

 

[MicroBrew]

Nope. That would go against the civilized European ideals.

Didn't you read the article directly above your own post?

Charge them with war-crimes. Throw them in prison for life.

 

[Arkain2K]

Charge them with war-crimes. Throw them in prison for life.

That's what we have been trying to get Europe to do for the last three years, and what Europe is trying to outsource to Iraq now.

European countries have resigned to the fact that their progressive European laws wouldn't be able to do anything to these European jihadists though (the British posters in this thread are of the opinion that not only they gonna go free, but they might score a nice payday from the British government instead for their pain suffering in the Middle East). So no matter what anyone says, Europe had been effectively pretending that these guys don't exists and flatly refuses to do anything about it, while American tax-payers continue shelling out millions to house and feed them in Syrian Kurds' jails, which was built with American funding in the first place.

It's rather amusing that the same virtuous countries that berates Guantanamo Bay are the very same countries who secretly wishing and hoping that the U.S will take their ISIS fighters there. Now that it's clear that neither we nor the Kurds are going to take care of these European jihadists forever, and there's a real chance that they might escape and go back to Europe when Turkey moves in, these countries are finally getting off their asses and enter into real negotiation with the Iraqis to prosecute them there instead.

The only two things they're haggling over now are the millions of euros in court fees for this subcontracted justice system, plus convincing the Iraqi government to forego the death penalty. I'm not sure the Iraqis would be keen to be housing and feeding these European jihadists for life though, so we'll see what's the price tag they'll demand for that.

 

[Arkain2K]

Turkey says it will send back Islamic State prisoners even if citizenships revoked

Turkish Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu ​

ANKARA (Reuters) - Turkey will send captured Islamic State members back to their countries even if their citizenships have been revoked, Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu said on Monday, criticizing the approach of European countries on the issue.

Turkey launched an offensive into northeastern Syria against the Kurdish YPG militia last month following a decision by U.S. President Donald Trump to withdraw troops from the region. The move prompted widespread concern over the fate of Islamic State prisoners in the region.

The YPG is the main element of the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), which has been a leading U.S. ally in beating back Islamic State in the region, and has kept thousands of jihadists in jails across northeastern Syria. The United States and Turkey’s Western allies have said Ankara’s offensive could hinder the fight against Islamic State and aid its resurgence.

Turkey, which views the YPG as a terrorist group linked with insurgent Kurdish militants on its own soil, has rejected those concerns and vowed to combat Islamic State with its allies. It has repeatedly called on European countries to take back their citizens fighting for the jihadists.

Speaking to reporters, Soylu said Turkey would send back any captured Islamic State fighters to their countries even if their citizenships are revoked.

“We will send back those in our hands, but the world has come up with a new method now: revoking their citizenships,” Soylu said. “They are saying they should be tried where they have been caught. This is a new form of international law, I guess.”

“It is not possible to accept this. We will send back Daesh (Islamic State) members in our hands to their own countries whether they revoke their citizenships or not,” he said.

Soylu had warned at the weekend that Turkey would send back Islamic State members captured by Turkey to their home countries and complained of European inaction on the matter.

The United States said last month that it had killed Islamic State’s leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi in northwestern Syria, where Turkey and Russia have troops. While Baghdadi’s death was hailed by world leaders, including Turkey, the group has vowed revenge against the United States.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...rs-even-if-citizenships-revoked-idUSKBN1XE0T7

 

[JDragon]

Turkey says it will send back Islamic State prisoners even if citizenships revoked

Turkish Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu ​

ANKARA (Reuters) - Turkey will send captured Islamic State members back to their countries even if their citizenships have been revoked, Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu said on Monday, criticizing the approach of European countries on the issue.

Turkey launched an offensive into northeastern Syria against the Kurdish YPG militia last month following a decision by U.S. President Donald Trump to withdraw troops from the region. The move prompted widespread concern over the fate of Islamic State prisoners in the region.

The YPG is the main element of the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), which has been a leading U.S. ally in beating back Islamic State in the region, and has kept thousands of jihadists in jails across northeastern Syria. The United States and Turkey’s Western allies have said Ankara’s offensive could hinder the fight against Islamic State and aid its resurgence.

Turkey, which views the YPG as a terrorist group linked with insurgent Kurdish militants on its own soil, has rejected those concerns and vowed to combat Islamic State with its allies. It has repeatedly called on European countries to take back their citizens fighting for the jihadists.

Speaking to reporters, Soylu said Turkey would send back any captured Islamic State fighters to their countries even if their citizenships are revoked.

“We will send back those in our hands, but the world has come up with a new method now: revoking their citizenships,” Soylu said. “They are saying they should be tried where they have been caught. This is a new form of international law, I guess.”

“It is not possible to accept this. We will send back Daesh (Islamic State) members in our hands to their own countries whether they revoke their citizenships or not,” he said.

Soylu had warned at the weekend that Turkey would send back Islamic State members captured by Turkey to their home countries and complained of European inaction on the matter.

The United States said last month that it had killed Islamic State’s leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi in northwestern Syria, where Turkey and Russia have troops. While Baghdadi’s death was hailed by world leaders, including Turkey, the group has vowed revenge against the United States.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...rs-even-if-citizenships-revoked-idUSKBN1XE0T7

Well, I hate to say it, but of course Turkey is right here. Unless these terrorists have dual citizenship, you cannot simply take their citizenship and act like it's not your problem. Imagine Mexico doing that to all Mexican criminals convicted in the US: "Sorry, you cannot deport, not our citizen."

The problem is our justice systems are not equipped to deal with these people. There is a reason Guantanamo came into existence (even though I think it should not exist). There is a reason the world was content to let IS prisoners rot in Kurdish camps.