Is there any overlap between Judo and Aikido?

[Deleted member 466273]

Different principles?

 

[Kaffe]

In theory, yes. In reality, not much. Breakfalls of the non-rolling variety (like from proper kotegaeshis) is what comes to mind as the most overlapping feature.

Edit: I’ve never ever seen kubishime practiced in any aikido dojo I have been to. Heck, I’ve barely seen any chokes at all, and only as a way to initiate throws/locks. Maybe I’ve just trained at the wrong ones.

 

[Deleted member 466273]

In theory, yes. In reality, not much. Breakfalls of the non-rolling variety (like from proper kotegaeshis) is what comes to mind as the most overlapping feature.

Edit: I’ve never ever seen kubishime practiced in any aikido dojo I have been to. Heck, I’ve barely seen any chokes at all, and only as a way to initiate throws/locks. Maybe I’ve just trained at the wrong ones.

Isn't that because the art has been watered down so that they push the opponent off instead? It's the same set up

 

[Deleted member 466273]

And when fist grappling with no gloves , why wouldn't joint locks work against a grappler who only tries grapple you? He is after all stickning his hands out exactly like an Aikido expert wants him to

 

[Deleted member 466273]

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

Yes, the overlap is do Judo when you can, and it becomes more like Aikido as you age.....

Or, do jiu-jitsu when you can and it becomes Invisible more like Rickson the older and wiser you get

This is all if you are good. If you're not, then you just suck.

Because Aikido guys back in the day were already Black Belts in Judo and Shotokan so maybe their shit wasn't shit, before Ueshiba's son ran with flower power in the 70's.

AIKIDO AS TAUGHT WAS ALWAYS DRAJJ same syllabus. Compare books and scrolls.

The guy at Kodokan, older guy, I had most issues with was like me like sensitive in the arms waiting to counter, sensing balance/kazushi. Better Aikido than Any Aikido guy I have ever met.


Watch him at the end of this video with me at Kodokan....really really watch subtle things

 

[Deleted member 466273]

Yes, the overlap is do Judo when you can, and it becomes more like Aikido as you age.....

Or, do jiu-jitsu when you can and it becomes Invisible more like Rickson the older and wiser you get

This is all if you are good. If you're not, then you just suck.

Because Aikido guys back in the day were already Black Belts in Judo and Shotokan so maybe their shit wasn't shit, before Ueshiba's son ran with flower power in the 70's.

AIKIDO AS TAUGHT WAS ALWAYS DRAJJ same syllabus. Compare books and scrolls.

The guy at Kodokan, older guy, I had most issues with was like me like sensitive in the arms waiting to counter, sensing balance/kazushi. Better Aikido than Any Aikido guy I have ever met.


Watch him at the end of this video with me at Kodokan....really really watch subtle things

It wasn't O senseis son, it was O sensei himself post WW2 who had a revelation and took out chokes and strikes (Like the ones you see Seagal do in movies) .

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

It wasn't O senseis son, it was O sensei himself post WW2 who had a revelation and took out chokes and strikes (Like the ones you see Seagal do in movies) .

Doesn't mean Saito and the likes watered their shit down.....They said it was same as DRAJJ, they said Atemi 80 or 90% of Aikido or whatever. Everything he taught, was same as DRAJJ

Those peaceful fuckers were getting drunk looking for fights in bars to test their shit Vunak style

Doesn't mean he didn't side with killer hard core Political side and invaded other countries for peace

I don't think it really went to shit until his son took over Aikikia....kia should change their name to this

 

[QingTian]

Coincidentally today I reviewed a list of aikido techniques out of curiosity. In my opinion, as a Judo BB, even the base Aikido techniques are divorced from reality. It's not even that they do not spar.

Main thing is that the techniques do not take advantage of large muscle groups or additional levers beyond the base throwing mechanism. Compare Aikido sumi otoshi versus Judo one hand tai otoshi. Looks similar right? Except Judo uses the strong back muscles plus level change plus leg trip plus a squat-like snap. That is to say, Judo has plan A B C D to make sure you go down, whereas Aikido is a one shot principle. Likewise there is iriminage which is like osotogari without a sweep. Aikido koshinage is like a reverse one handed sode, except instead of you gripping the sleeve you rely on a dumb uke to keep his wrist grip. Juji nage - anyone remember the lug wrench?

I still like checking out Aikido now and then for interesting concepts, but that is exactly what they are. They are concepts, rather than finished products. Early Judo looked pretty raw too but competition has forced refinement.

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

Coincidentally today I reviewed a list of aikido techniques out of curiosity. In my opinion, as a Judo BB, even the base Aikido techniques are divorced from reality. It's not even that they do not spar.

Main thing is that the techniques do not take advantage of large muscle groups or additional levers beyond the base throwing mechanism. Compare Aikido sumi otoshi versus Judo one hand tai otoshi. Looks similar right? Except Judo uses the strong back muscles plus level change plus leg trip plus a squat-like snap. That is to say, Judo has plan A B C D to make sure you go down, whereas Aikido is a one shot principle. Likewise there is iriminage which is like osotogari without a sweep. Aikido koshinage is like a reverse one handed sode, except instead of you gripping the sleeve you rely on a dumb uke to keep his wrist grip. Juji nage - anyone remember the lug wrench?

I still like checking out Aikido now and then for interesting concepts, but that is exactly what they are. They are concepts, rather than finished products. Early Judo looked pretty raw too but competition has forced refinement.

I USE JujiNage from high mount dude, and yes sometimes for the lugnut tap, and other times transition into the armbar.or into the LeBellion Armbar..on good people.

Agree with everything else you said though. Iriminage is good to teach concept of Breaking structure however

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

jujinage on ground may help disarm someone too......theirs real world reasons I don't write off every technique like others do.



And more fuel for my haters, this is for vs drunks and for movies


But the technique I found most working, Russian FSB style double salute against jab to knee lift or Ashi barai....

In that UK wing Chun guys channel a dude did it against a guy who drew Pistol from his waistband

And Adesanya did the counter Osoto vs Tavares haters

 

[Deleted member 466273]

Coincidentally today I reviewed a list of aikido techniques out of curiosity. In my opinion, as a Judo BB, even the base Aikido techniques are divorced from reality. It's not even that they do not spar.

Main thing is that the techniques do not take advantage of large muscle groups or additional levers beyond the base throwing mechanism. Compare Aikido sumi otoshi versus Judo one hand tai otoshi. Looks similar right? Except Judo uses the strong back muscles plus level change plus leg trip plus a squat-like snap. That is to say, Judo has plan A B C D to make sure you go down, whereas Aikido is a one shot principle. Likewise there is iriminage which is like osotogari without a sweep. Aikido koshinage is like a reverse one handed sode, except instead of you gripping the sleeve you rely on a dumb uke to keep his wrist grip. Juji nage - anyone remember the lug wrench?

I still like checking out Aikido now and then for interesting concepts, but that is exactly what they are. They are concepts, rather than finished products. Early Judo looked pretty raw too but competition has forced refinement.

So there is no way Steven Seagal could flip a judoka on his ass, break his wrists, or do a rear naked choke on him?

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

So there is no way Steven Seagal could flip a judoka on his ass, or break his wrist, or do a rear naked choke on him?

Do you think all people in all styles are of the exact same level? WTF

Seagal in the 70's vs avg 2 yr twice a week judo black belt? Sure SS inu 70's Path beyond thought was LEGIT

Vs Travis Stevens now? LLLLLLLLLLLLLL

But yet, he still does hold his center well etc I watched his footage vs some of my friends in Russia a month ago....people wanted me there


spacetime I like the name, but, are you what 15?

 

[Deleted member 466273]

Do you think all people in all styles are of the exact same level? WTF

Seagal in the 70's vs avg 2 yr twice a week judo black belt? Sure

Vs Travis Stevens now? LLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Going by how people deride Aikido, why not?

I don't believe most BJJ guys can take Steven Seagal to the ground, and I expect him to break their limbs.

 

[Deleted member 466273]

Coincidentally today I reviewed a list of aikido techniques out of curiosity. In my opinion, as a Judo BB, even the base Aikido techniques are divorced from reality. It's not even that they do not spar.

Main thing is that the techniques do not take advantage of large muscle groups or additional levers beyond the base throwing mechanism. Compare Aikido sumi otoshi versus Judo one hand tai otoshi. Looks similar right? Except Judo uses the strong back muscles plus level change plus leg trip plus a squat-like snap. That is to say, Judo has plan A B C D to make sure you go down, whereas Aikido is a one shot principle. Likewise there is iriminage which is like osotogari without a sweep. Aikido koshinage is like a reverse one handed sode, except instead of you gripping the sleeve you rely on a dumb uke to keep his wrist grip. Juji nage - anyone remember the lug wrench?

I still like checking out Aikido now and then for interesting concepts, but that is exactly what they are. They are concepts, rather than finished products. Early Judo looked pretty raw too but competition has forced refinement.

Thank you for your post and insight.

Steven Seagal says that Aikido operates on a principle of staying low so it doesn’t become a struggle of who's stronger, which Judo may saddle you with.

Here it is for those who don't know:

 

[Deleted member 466273]

 

[Deleted member 466273]

To say there is no applicability in that is ridiculous.

 

[shunyata]

Segal shit his pants when he fucked with a much older Lebell, so yeah Segal has this record of getting embarrassed by older judoka.


Also to suggest people don't understand and manipulate the importance of lowness for leverage in competitive grappling is insane. It's a fundamental principle in wrestling, Judo, and BJJ.

Aikido is bullshit and doesn't work. Judo actually works against an opponent intelligently defending. It's just that simple.

 

[QingTian]

No what I said is that there has been no refinement of the base concept to ensure it works. Look how they apply the straight armlock with uke facing down - anyone who's done an armbar on a resisting opponent knows how hard it is to keep the arm straight, let alone twisting to the wrong angle. Yet they do it with just their hands and not any other body part to ensure control.

 

[Deleted member 466273]

Segal shit his pants when he fucked with a much older Lebell, so yeah Segal has this record of getting embarrassed by older judoka.


.

Do you believe in santa too?