Grapevine while having back mount

[thecas]

I was on the back of some1 some timeago. I used to have this Idea that the deeper my grapevine around his legs was, the more secure I would be. However, I was proven wrong. Then he merely had to bring his thighs/hamstring backwards and I almost had to tap from my outturned ankles/foot. I am sure this is simple enough to picture. And of course I did not cross my ankles.

What methods do you all use then for the hooks?

 

[Happy Camper]

I dont undestand how you grapewine from the back

 

[Edward P. Hands]

he's talking about running legs for wrestling (power halfs and such)

 

[krellik]

I was on the back of some1 some timeago. I used to have this Idea that the deeper my grapevine around his legs was, the more secure I would be. However, I was proven wrong. Then he merely had to bring his thighs/hamstring backwards and I almost had to tap from my outturned ankles/foot. I am sure this is simple enough to picture. And of course I did not cross my ankles.

What methods do you all use then for the hooks?

Im having some problems picturing how he are geting you to tap from that motion. But there are basicly things you can do to the guy no matter how he places his feet, only problem is that you have to do it before he chokes you out, keep manipulating his head and work for the choke agresively and it chouldnt be to much of a problem..

 

[Flibb]

You crossed your feet didnt you?

 

[thecas]

, only problem is that you have to do it before he chokes you out, keep manipulating his head and work for the choke agresively and it chouldnt be to much of a problem..

The rest got it more correct, which is while I am on someone's back or having back mount.

I did not cross my ankles.

Ok, a pic = a thousand words.

http://www.lockflow.com/article_view.php?id=107


Over here, the shirtless guy will be a bit more similar to me if his feet were slightly deeper and slightly more out turned. The 'out turn' part is natural, it will be that When your legs r in at that angle.

Does it not look like a grapevine?

 

[DMcKayBJJ]

Saw the pic. Are you getting your foot tucked into the space behind his knee? If so, then all he would have to do is straighten his leg and/or extend his hip (i.e. move his thighs rearward) to make you tap from a foot lock.

I was always taught to keep your hooks higher than that, like near his hip or upper half of his thigh. You really shouldn't ever "grapevine" your leg/foot like you appear to be doing.

If you want to be more tight and secure, you could go for the figure-four around his waist when you're backmounted.

 

[krellik]

The rest got it more correct, which is while I am on someone's back or having back mount.

I did not cross my ankles.

Ok, a pic = a thousand words.

http://www.lockflow.com/article_view.php?id=107


Over here, the shirtless guy will be a bit more similar to me if his feet were slightly deeper and slightly more out turned. The 'out turn' part is natural, it will be that When your legs r in at that angle.

Does it not look like a grapevine?

What did I not get correctly? I understand how you are when you are backmounted. What I dont understand is what he does to you to make you tap when you have the "deep" grapevines?`

If the grapevines aint so deep I myself know a lot of things to do with the feet but if they are in deep around my legs it is whery hard. So if you can explain what he does so I understand better it would help

 

[jyd233]

wow i never knew that. i have been in that position a couple times and he couldn't shake me off i eventually got the tap. but im a beginner and most of my partners are. i'll think about that from now on for sure.

by the way: i crossed my feet when i first started and got the choke, but my ankle was killing me for days. that is one of those locks that doesn't hurt too bad while its on, but damage is done.

 

[thecas]

What I dont understand is what he does to you to make you tap when you have the "deep" grapevines?`

If the grapevines aint so deep I myself know a lot of things to do with the feet but if they are in deep around my legs it is whery hard. So if you can explain what he does so I understand better it would help

Dm got it. He will just close his thights a bit then bring it backwards to cause something similar to an Inverted Heel Hook. And I was careful not to cross my ankles, but the way each ankle was blocking each other prevented me from moving my ankles out.

When I did it it was in his upper thigh region though; apparently it was sufficient for this lock. I had the slightly deep grapevine to prevent him rolling back to guard.

 

[BearTrap]

Aah, I unfortunately did cross my ankles and locked it in. Did it hurt like mad when he pancaked! I'll have to stick to my wrestling roots.

 

[eworden78]

I usually only grapevine one leg at a time
The way I found to best leg ride is to keep your toe planted on the ground between your opponents leg (like the picture).
Your other foot should be directly behind you riding leg.
This makes a 90 degree V with his hip against your crotch(god that sounds gay)
Instead of sinking the leg in deeper to create pressure, rotate your riding leg outward and drive across his body with your toes.
If you do this right it hurts like a bitch!
It also keeps you back behind his hips so he can't shuck you over.
You can tell you're doing it right if your opponent disappeared you would be left squatting on your heels and would not fall over.

 

[krellik]

Dm got it. He will just close his thights a bit then bring it backwards to cause something similar to an Inverted Heel Hook. And I was careful not to cross my ankles, but the way each ankle was blocking each other prevented me from moving my ankles out.

When I did it it was in his upper thigh region though; apparently it was sufficient for this lock. I had the slightly deep grapevine to prevent him rolling back to guard.

Hmm I think I misunderstand what you ment by "grapevine". You ment like where your feet gets caught by his leg like in my pic? Well thats no good, he can just move back his calfes like you say to punish you, and if he can free his hand and pull on your heel in the other direction (the other arrow) he will get a really good heelhook going.

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But if he hasnt steped over your feet with his feet then it should be ok.

 

[jyd233]

add this question. what about diego's body triangle the other day? it was the normal body triangle, but the leg that was hanging down 'grapevined' (hooked under) one of alessio's legs. that looked very effective.

 

[thecas]

The picture could be better if it was labelled whose the Uke. Still, I figured it after staring at it for 2 mins.

But over here and the above, why is it assumed that my foot is so low till it is at the knees or calves? In fact I did an almost normal hook. My foot were at or around the space below his groin. When I said 'deep', it had meant deep there so that I grapevine under his thigh but still near groin.

BJJ isnt easy it seems--'as deep as you can go' is much easier to apply than deep enough so you wont get rolled but shallow enough not to get ankle locked. Do you all apply the same technique here?

 

[thecas]

No one's replying? This is a central detail in BJJ. Any BJJ blue or purple belts to answer how they aim to hook with their legs?

 

[LCDforMe]

When I got this guy's back yesterday in my tourney, I just extended my hips and he flattened out. I choked him in like 3 seconds from here.

Moral of the story is you shouldn't be tapping when you have somebody's back.

 

[TheHighlander]

No one's replying? This is a central detail in BJJ. Any BJJ blue or purple belts to answer how they aim to hook with their legs?

For regular hooks, it's usually with your insteps on his inner thighs, about half way up or higher. If you have the leg length to do more, I suggest using the body triangle.