Best MMA Guard (Besides Rubber Guard--Please READ)

[wildcard_seven]

I like rubber guard and I actually think it may be the best guard for MMA simply because of its tightness/ability to avoid punches--which is crucial in MMA. Sure, there's not many sweeps (none that I know of) and sitting out is pretty much out of the question, but you can always let go, right?

But here's the deal: I have two bad knees which pretty much cancels out the possibility of rubber guard. That's my only real knock against rubber guard. Unlike most of jiujitsu, it does require special physical attributes--flexibility. I can do pretty much every other move out there, like the body triangle or triangle; yet, I don't have the ability to pull my leg over my opponents head for a gogoplata or omoplata from mission control, without putting tremendous strain on my knees. It's not a matter of "leg" flexibility, my knee joints simply won't hold up after having popped each one out in the past. I am flexible enough to simply lock my opponent down in rubber guard, but it's kind of a waste of time if I can't perform several of the bread and butter moves of the position.

So, I was wondering what my next best option(s) might be. One obvious answer is your standard closed guard, cause that's as tight as you're going to get without going rubber. For those who recommend working the closed guard in MMA, what posture do you use to avoid the punches? Overhook and head control? The "rear-naked" grip over the head?

How do you guys feel about half-guard? It can be played tightly, and lately we've seen Big Nog use it very effectively as a sweeping position.

Butterfly is good, but I don't know if I would make it my go-to position, simply because of the probability of an opponent standing up and out/or posturing and punching--eventually (it's hard to keep them tight for a long time in butterfly).

I know, it may seem like I've answered my own question in many ways, but I'm interested in any specific insights you might have, like: specific tips for working certain guards, any other guards you think deserve merit, or any kind of variations of guards/moves that you may use.

I don't do MMA right now, but I like to grapple in an MMA-orientated way simply because I may (do MMA), and I like to train MMA with fighters/non-fighters alike.

 

[colinm]

i can't use rubber guard as well, so i'll play an overhook game from closed guard...you can transition to all the basic stuff using an overhook setup.

i think butterfly guard can be used in mma...doerkson and allen goes are two guys that use it, off the top of my head...you gotta play the underhooks instead of wrist control obviously.

 

[zfolwick]

half-butterfly's good for sweeps. Just don't let them pass into single-leg entaglement or side control. That. . . .sucks.

I would work on reversals from the guard and butterfly guard.

One thing that may work if you're able to (partner has to have the right body type + your legs need to be right), in closed guard- fig. 4 lock your legs around his waiste and make a circle with your "free" foot, turning your knees inward. That'll take his breath away and may set you up for a reversal.

 

[Mike Piekarski]

When I do mma I only really do two types of guard: rubber guard and getting the overhook. I don't feel comfortable enough with my half guard or butterfly guard to use them, especially in MMA when dudes are trying to take your head off. Granted they aren't my specialty, but I generally use them as last resorts as opposed to using them as my go-to setups.

since rubber guard is out i'd suggest going with a whizzer/overhook guard. If you do this you take away the dude's power hand (probably) and he can't posture up. When I overhook mostly all the guy can do is throw little bullshit punches to the body and that is generally only when i go for a sub. If i was content on holding a guy I could neutralize all his attacks. I also like this guard because of preference since the t-sweep/flower sweep is my main sweep and I use this setup a lot.

 

[jakethasnake]

it all depends on what your good at and what works for you

 

[yella91]

Although kind of a transitional guard, I like to Octopus guard. I really don't think half guard is good for MMA...especially once you're stuck there. I mean, hammer fists come pretty quickly on guys that are put into half guard. Nog uses half guard, but does not stay there..he tries to sweep immediately, if he doesn't get it he'll go back to his open guard.

 

[jakethasnake]

Although kind of a transitional guard, I like to Octopus guard. I really don't think half guard is good for MMA...especially once you're stuck there. I mean, hammer fists come pretty quickly on guys that are put into half guard. Nog uses half guard, but does not stay there..he tries to sweep immediately, if he doesn't get it he'll go back to his open guard.

nog is far from the norm when it comes to guards...he is probably one of the best at utilizing the guard in all of mma...pe de pano seems to use half guard very well and avoid getting hit in mma...he just sits up with it, gets the underhook, and is gets really tight on the person so they cant really hit him...but then again, pe de pano is also not the norm...the type of guard you play all depends on your body type, flexibility, and what you are comfortable with...i have seen sherk play butterfly guard very well, but i wouldnt recommend that for all fighters...it all depends on what is open and how much u fear your opponents gnp...theses things play a great role in what guard is best for mma

 

[sproggdawg]

The overhook from closed guard is great, but hard to maintain because of the sweat factor. Butterfly isnt such a great idea in my opinion because if they can break your grip then they can stand right back up. If I had to choose a guard for mma it would be rubber guard, then overhook. If you are very tall then you could probably get away with wrist control.

 

[DaRuckus337]

Rubber guard and butterfly for me. A very active butterfly (even spider) keeps the opponent off balance and at a safer distance, ruining technical striking attempts while creating the most opportunities for sweeps and the best chance of finding a submission off of an over-committed strike. Just keep those feet in there and constantly push off with one leg or the other while looking for angles and sweep opportunities. This screws up the top man's hips, making powerful and accurate striking almost impossible. They will end up falling in and reaching too much if they attempt to throw punches, creating sub opportunities. Joslin did a good job of using an active mma butterfly against Koscheck to limit damage and create scrambles, even though he was unable to secure any decent sweeps or subs against a wrestler as powerful as Koscheck.

 

[wOg]

i can't use rubber guard as well, so i'll play an overhook game from closed guard...you can transition to all the basic stuff using an overhook setup.

i think butterfly guard can be used in mma...doerkson and allen goes are two guys that use it, off the top of my head...you gotta play the underhooks instead of wrist control obviously.

Funny you mention Doerksen. One of the best butterfly guard sweeps I've seen was Marquardt's sweep of Doerksen in their UFC fight awhile ago.

I like dominant position jiu jitsu, so my guard game is mostly based on sweeps. While I've been trying to improve my butterfly guard (some nice notes on this guard over at Aesopian's site, the stuff from Austrailian black belt John Simon), one guard I've been trying to develop is what I call the Hilo Guard, after BJ Penn.

I saw BJ working this guard in his fight against GSP. Basically, all it amounts to is putting both feet on the hips (as opposed to locking them around the guy's waist or putting them under his hips/thighs as in a butterfly guard). It makes it easier and faster for me to attack with submissions and set up sweeps by starting with my feet "on the gas" instead of somewhere else. It requires a little more hamstring and glute flexibility, but I like how I can shift from that guard to butterfly guard to half guard very quickly and with little effort ...

 

[zfolwick]

anybody know any good sweeps/reversals from half-guard??? I got an eddie bravo book, but can't seem figure it out.

 

[yella91]

Funny you mention Doerksen. One of the best butterfly guard sweeps I've seen was Marquardt's sweep of Doerksen in their UFC fight awhile ago.

I like dominant position jiu jitsu, so my guard game is mostly based on sweeps. While I've been trying to improve my butterfly guard (some nice notes on this guard over at Aesopian's site, the stuff from Austrailian black belt John Simon), one guard I've been trying to develop is what I call the Hilo Guard, after BJ Penn.

I saw BJ working this guard in his fight against GSP. Basically, all it amounts to is putting both feet on the hips (as opposed to locking them around the guy's waist or putting them under his hips/thighs as in a butterfly guard). It makes it easier and faster for me to attack with submissions and set up sweeps by starting with my feet "on the gas" instead of somewhere else. It requires a little more hamstring and glute flexibility, but I like how I can shift from that guard to butterfly guard to half guard very quickly and with little effort ...

I like that name, the "Hilo guard." I noticed BJ working this too! I mean, GSP wanted it on the ground but he couldn't effectively hit BJ while in the Hilo guard. I mean, GSP wasn't going back to his feet, and the foot on the hip is a great way to ruin the comfort level of the guy on top going for strikes. BJ also tried some rubber guard stuff and even a gogoplata during that fight. GSP had NO CHANCE when he tried to pass BJ's guard.

 

[IanMoone]

also that 'hilo guard' makes it really easy to kick your opponent away - randy talks about that pretty much every time he's doin commentary and someone is pounding away from the guard.

 

[wildcard_seven]

Out of curiousity, what kind of game would you guys play with MMA butterfly? It's pretty much a sweeping position; so, anything else? The idea of swinging underneath for a leglock sounds risky. Just over/under or double underhooks and look for a sweep? Or, any other kind of strategy? Just to kick out and stand up?

 

[sIcKnEsS]

overhook guard is always my first option while always makign sure to break his posture at all times, I like as well to control both of his biceps with my feet on his hips, this way I can work subs and some sweeps from my open guard and if he stands out I can push him off to stand up

 

[sIcKnEsS]

Out of curiousity, what kind of game would you guys play with MMA butterfly? It's pretty much a sweeping position; so, anything else? The idea of swinging underneath for a leglock sounds risky. Just over/under or double underhooks and look for a sweep? Or, any other kind of strategy? Just to kick out and stand up?

Butterfly in mma is horrible, so many guys have such a great base from there like all the wrestlers that my best suggestion would be to push him off using the butterfly guard by scooting you butt back and getting up, if you still have 2 underhooks from here and you get up you have good a position to take him down

 

[sIcKnEsS]

anybody know any good sweeps/reversals from half-guard??? I got an eddie bravo book, but can't seem figure it out.

Nova Uniao is known for half guard sweeps in bjj but this is not bjj, it's mma. Chute Boxe has actually shown through the Rua brothers that hlaf guard is not too bad a position in mma. they use the grab the leg that's in your half guard and rock back and forth with it untill you can go out the back door or get to your knees to eihter sweep him or get up