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Television AGATHA ALL ALONG (Dragonlord's Review, post #111)

I"m open minded to different kinds of stuff, I'm one of the few people here that enjoyed She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel, but whomever is running things in the TV department needs to get fired, or put on a long vacation.

Who is their audience? Who is this show for?
Some of the last shows were Echo, She-Hulk, and Ms. Marvel....not incredibly popular characters, and not characters that would likely appeal to your general fan base. And now Agatha?
It's a good cast, but I just can't be interested in stuff like this when the catalog of Marvel heroes, villains, and other stories is so much larger. It's crazy that they waste time on stuff like this. There's not even any Dr. Strange or Wanda news on the horizon that would help spark some interest in this.

Besides the female centric shows, we had Loki S2 and Secret Wars. I liked Loki, but it's not what your general Marvel fan is looking for. And Secret Wars was a failure on multiple levels.
Crazy how far they've fallen, and how tone deaf they've become.
 
SmilinDesperado said:
I"m open minded to different kinds of stuff, I'm one of the few people here that enjoyed She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel, but whomever is running things in the TV department needs to get fired, or put on a long vacation.

Who is their audience? Who is this show for?
Some of the last shows were Echo, She-Hulk, and Ms. Marvel....not incredibly popular characters, and not characters that would likely appeal to your general fan base. And now Agatha?
It's a good cast, but I just can't be interested in stuff like this when the catalog of Marvel heroes, villains, and other stories is so much larger. It's crazy that they waste time on stuff like this. There's not even any Dr. Strange or Wanda news on the horizon that would help spark some interest in this.

Besides the female centric shows, we had Loki S2 and Secret Wars. I liked Loki, but it's not what your general Marvel fan is looking for. And Secret Wars was a failure on multiple levels.
Crazy how far they've fallen, and how tone deaf they've become.
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Bishes love witches.

Guessing it's aimed at the younger to middle aged women who like horror, Disney, and the occult.

And I'm fine with that, better than a bait and switch like they tried to do with the new Blade or Hawkeye
 
TrueBias said:
Yeah, which makes me interested cuz I feel like I missed the calling.
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It's okay, there is still time to be cast in the MCU. Pretty sure most of us here have been in one or two by now. By 2030 they estimate the last Amazonian tribe with no current contact to modern civilization will be cast in the MCU, rounding out the total world population.
 
Wandavision was almost 3.5 years ago. It feels like too much time has passed, combined with the general decline in audience interest in the MCU, such that this won’t be anywhere close to being a hit like they would have originally thought it would be when they first greenlit this in the early days of Disney+’s MCU tv projects.
 
Thrawn33 said:
Bishes love witches.

Guessing it's aimed at the younger to middle aged women who like horror, Disney, and the occult.

And I'm fine with that, better than a bait and switch like they tried to do with the new Blade or Hawkeye
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Yeah, but that's kind of my point, what % of those people are in the Marvel audience? From the past few shows they've done, it should be obvious that your male audience isn't into a lot of this stuff, and that there isn't a big enough female audience for this either.
They put out shows like this, get bad press, and whatever amount of people that do watch these shows can't justify or make it worth it.
You have to be a big Marvel fan to seek out a TV show like this.
 
I’ll still watch it, but I like the first trailer better it made it seem more dark and actually witchy.
 
It's got Aubrey Plaza and Kathryn Hahn. I'm already going to watch it. Going on with low expectations also helps you be pleasantly surprised, so it's got that going for it, too.
 
Just as long as watching this show isn't necessary for understanding some movie down the line...
 
Actually calling Agatha B level content is unfair to her. She is, at best, D level Marvel content. She Hulk or a Black Widow getting their own show is B Level. Agatha is levels below them and yet this show is quite good, imo.
 
There is one thing that this show has already done better than a lot of other villain-centric movies and shows, and that's let the main character be a villain. Most times when the focus is on an established, even beloved, villain (looking at you, Loki), they're all of a sudden being shown as a hero. It's like the studios are afraid of their villains doing what made them beloved in the first place.

Agatha is a bad guy here. Not a hero, not even an anti-hero. She's mean, conniving, self centered and selfish. She doesn't want power to do good things, she's trying to save her own ass. In other words, she's villain.

I'm sure by the end she'll be on the side of the angels, but at least the progression feels natural at this point. Loki was a full-fledged babyface within 10 minutes.
 
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SmilinDesperado said:
I"m open minded to different kinds of stuff, I'm one of the few people here that enjoyed She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel, but whomever is running things in the TV department needs to get fired, or put on a long vacation.
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To be fair this and the future Iron heart series where green lighted when they went all in in to the MsheU.

Blade and Daredevil getting rewriten (and cancelling she hulk season 2) seems like they actually are doing some forced course correction.
 
ChosenOne said:
Actually calling Agatha B level content is unfair to her. She is, at best, D level Marvel content. She Hulk or a Black Widow getting their own show is B Level. Agatha is levels below them and yet this show is quite good, imo.
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I dont really get this talking point. All the characters were B to D level until the movies came out. Guardians of the Galaxy was a cast full of nobodies.
 
armbarforhire said:
To be fair this and the future Iron heart series where green lighted when they went all in in to the MsheU.

Blade and Daredevil getting rewriten (and cancelling she hulk season 2) seems like they actually are doing some forced course correction.
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Well, the problem isn't that they're female led shows, it's that they don't show what someone who is interested in a comic book tv show would want to see. They could make a good Ironheart show by just making it a good show that centered on the character...not that she is a she.

I'm glad they are trying to address the issues now. But, I find it disheartening that they think they HAVE to make female characters a certain way instead of just making them interesting CHARACTERS that happen to be female, or happen to be Muslim or black.
The actress that plays She-Hulk is great, and I would've liked to have kept her around. Instead of cancelling shows, I wish they'd take notes on what makes a good character good and just do that.

I'm going to start this show soon, so we'll see if any lessons were learned yet...
 
Meh. They should have kept the whole True Detective thing going for several episodes. That was the most interesting part of the show so far.

Episode 3 was poor; it was literally a bunch of Wine Moms sitting around drinking with their GBF.

5/10 so far.
 
blaseblase said:
I dont really get this talking point. All the characters were B to D level until the movies came out. Guardians of the Galaxy was a cast full of nobodies.
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No SpiderMan, Avengers Team, Xmen and others were not B to D level. They were A level Marvel that we should expect big budget great things from.

I would say GoTG, Iron Man, Deadpool, Dr Strange, Scarlett Witch, etc were B and C level and Agatha was D level. Really completely off the radar for her own show or movie.
 
ChosenOne said:
No SpiderMan, Avengers Team, Xmen and others were not B to D level. They were A level Marvel that we should expect big budget great things from.

I would say GoTG, Iron Man, Deadpool, Dr Strange, Scarlett Witch, etc were B and C level and Agatha was D level. Really completely off the radar for her own show or movie.
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You're right about Spiderman and X-Men but Marvel didn't own the movie rights to those characters and kicked off the MCU with B and C tier characters. GOTG was absolutely D tier, no one cared about those characters until the movies. Iron Man was not a big deal in the comics until the movies. Ant-Man was D tier. It's the quality of the films that made the characters, not whether they were popular.

I'll check out this Agatha show and figure out if it's worth watching. I suspect that regardless of it's quality, we've been inundated with two much comic book content for a character from a Disney+ show to gain traction in the way that Iron Man and the others did.
 
blaseblase said:
You're right about Spiderman and X-Men but Marvel didn't own the movie rights to those characters and kicked off the MCU with B and C tier characters. GOTG was absolutely D tier, no one cared about those characters until the movies. Iron Man was not a big deal in the comics until the movies. Ant-Man was D tier. It's the quality of the films that made the characters, not whether they were popular.

I'll check out this Agatha show and figure out if it's worth watching. I suspect that regardless of it's quality, we've been inundated with two much comic book content for a character from a Disney+ show to gain traction in the way that Iron Man and the others did.
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Yes, outside the Avengers team, Marvel started with mostly B & C tier, agreed.

My point with Agatha, is that she is a wrung below those thou. She was not someone who carried her own comic (i don't think) and would be more like giving Peter Parkers friend Ned his own show. No matter how far we say GoTG and others were down the list, Agatha was that much further.

But agreed, with good writing who cares. Marvel has shown us that some of the 'lesser' material can be written better than some of the top tier characters, at times.
 
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