Media A Boxing Case Study: Rematches Are Only Worthwhile if "Lessons are Learned" - Do UFC Care?

[Deleted member 585708]

Let's have a look at a boxing rematch that happened tonight.

Due to the contracts in boxing, Joe Joyce was able to trigger an immediate rematch clause.

He got smashed, again.

Lessons weren't learned, but contracts are contracts, what can you do? Joyce had to get battered again because it was legal.

Why do these rematches happen in the UFC?

If a fighter loses cleanly, who cares if they were a good champion? Have they shown any ability to come back stronger? If not, why are they getting a rematch?

The UFC need to come clean about rematch clauses and whatnot. If they're forced into making certain fights, just tell us. Boxing is clear about it, even when rematches are a pointless waste of time. Just let us know where we stand? If it's automatic, the UFC benefit because we understand why it's happening.

 

[HHJ]

Do they care about a case study? No.

 

[Lee_]

The UFC is forced into absolutely nothing. These are choices by Dana based 100% on the almighty dollar.

 

[Deleted member 585708]

The UFC is forced into absolutely nothing. These are choices by Dana based 100% on the almighty dollar.

Is that a categorical fact? That no UFC champion ever had a rematch clause?

 

[HHJ]

Is that a categorical fact? That no UFC champion ever had a rematch clause?

I doubt that they have rematch clauses. Doesnt seem like that's the way UFC does business.

 

[Deleted member 585708]

I doubt that they have rematch clauses. Doesnt seem like that's the way UFC does business.

So why the proliferation?

Purely the UFC's choice?

If so... why? It makes no sense to bury former champions by giving them immediate losing streaks?

Unless there's a real reason to believe they would have won, why bother with an automatic rematch?

 

[HHJ]

So why the proliferation?

Purely the UFC's choice?

If so... why? It makes no sense to bury former champions by giving them immediate losing streaks?

Unless there's a real reason to believe they would have won, why bother with an automatic rematch?

Izzy is getting the rematch because its in their best interest to get the belt back on izzy for the possible double champ showdown with Poatan at LHW,and they def dont want strickland to hold on to that belt,or be considered better than Izzy.

 

[Kb7]

Instant rematches are stupid, I blame Frankie Edgar for it being standard in the UFC. Fighters back then would have to at least have fight 1 to get back a title shot, now the losers of instant rematches never ever gets to a title and or their careers are practically over. History has proven that in the UFC.

 

[El Fernas]

So far i dont think there are rematch clauses in the UFC/MMA, more like the case of being promotion based sport

 

[Deleted member 585708]

Izzy is getting the rematch because its in their best interest to get the belt back on izzy for the possible double champ showdown with Poatan at LHW,and they def dont want strickland to hold on to that belt,or be considered better than Izzy.

Okay, so that's kinda very short-sighted, if Izzy isn't given any time at all to correct the massive issues he had with Strickland's pacing and pressure, he's going to lose again.

Why roll the dice like that?

 

[HHJ]

Okay, so that's kinda very short-sighted, if Izzy isn't given any time at all to correct the massive issues he had with Strickland's pacing and pressure, he's going to lose again.

Why roll the dice like that?

UFC does indeed rush certain rematches,but I dont know how Izzy feels about the turn around. He is used to fighting very often.

 

[Lee_]

Is that a categorical fact? That no UFC champion ever had a rematch clause?

No, it may have been a special deal in a few select cases; but it clearly is not usually the case.

It is a fact that Dana is under legal stress for (among other things) his coercive and career-killing contracts that (per the recent judge ruling making it a class action lawsuit) were anti-competitive for locking fighters in a prison basically. Dana and co won't give in to anything that gives the fighter advantages in the contract; it is extremely unlikely that they tie their own hands with rematch clauses. It is virtually impossible that the contract stopped Dana from saying publicly that his hands were tied; if it weren't a popular decision, and he could attribute it to something else, surely he would. Dana usually publicly explains why he makes particular rematches, even if it is usually bullshit because it is just a money decision.

 

[Deleted member 585708]

UFC does indeed rush certain rematches,but I dont know how Izzy feels about the turn around. He is used to fighting very often.

He is, but logically the assumption here is they're looking for Izzy to lose.

There's no real reason to expect Izzy to win?

 

[Dick Trickle]

So why the proliferation?

Purely the UFC's choice?

If so... why? It makes no sense to bury former champions by giving them immediate losing streaks?

Unless there's a real reason to believe they would have won, why bother with an automatic rematch?

Boxing has more predictability in terms of favorite/underdog scenarios. Mma produces more upset wins that you could call flukey, and it allows immediate rematches to favor the old champ without them necessarily "learning something".

In boxing id say the better man wins 9 times out of 10. In mma that just doesn't feel as true, and the UFC has guys that are more marketable so it's an easy decision for the to make.

 

[HHJ]

He is, but logically the assumption here is they're looking for Izzy to lose.

There's no real reason to expect Izzy to win?

I dont think they are looking for Izzy to lose. They probably think for sure this is some kind of fight he should win next time w adjustments.

 

[Deleted member 585708]

Boxing has more predictability in terms of favorite/underdog scenarios. Mma produces more upset wins that you could call flukey, and it allows immediate rematches to favor the old champ without them necessarily "learning something".

In boxing id say the better man wins 9 times out of 10. In mma that just doesn't feel as true, and the UFC has guys that are more marketable so it's an easy decision for the to make.

I suppose what I'm saying is, if you have a more marketable guy that just lost, you want them to have the best possible opportunity to earn that win back.

An immediate rematch is kind of a simpleton's way of trying to achieve that, no? It doesn't even make sense to expect the more marketable fighter to win? And if they lose, they're less marketable?

 

[Deleted member 585708]

I dont think they are looking for Izzy to lose. They probably think for sure this is some kind of fight he should win next time w adjustments.

I know I'm asking you some impossible questions here (on purpose), but what adjustments would Dana and the UFC realistically expect Izzy to make?

It's almost like they're rebooking that fight based entirely on hope.

If a dude gets totally outpointed, and is given no time whatsoever to adjust, he's going to get outpointed again - even if the fight is closer.

That's a horrible strategy, no?

 

[HHJ]

I know I'm asking you some impossible questions here (on purpose), but what adjustments would Dana and the UFC realistically expect Izzy to make?

It's almost like they're rebooking that fight based entirely on hope.

If a dude gets totally outpointed, and is given no time whatsoever to adjust, he's going to get outpointed again - even if the fight is closer.

That's a horrible strategy, no?

He may have told them I can get him,let me at him. It might be him pushing for a quick turnaround.

 

[Deleted member 585708]

He may have told them I can get him,let me at him. It might be him pushing for a quick turnaround.

You're right, he might have said that, and they must have believed him.

But man, that's poor business.

If the UFC give a shit about Izzy and his value to the company, they make him look like a star in his next fight.

Immediately rematching a guy that just made him look like a scrub is an utter Fail, no?

 

[HHJ]

Immediately rematching a guy that just made him look like a scrub is an utter Fail, no?

We'll see.