Usyk is a generational GOAT

[aries]

Is that Jalalov's fault? I doubt that it is him or his management that is the cause, more than likely none of the top fighters will fight him. It's not like he is some guy who just fought bums. In the Amateurs' he fights all the very best every time. I doubt most top ten fighters want to give up their shot at a big payday for a guaranteed loss. Seems there have been numerous very skilled fighters who never got top ten opponents Ivan Dychko comes to mind. Having fought the very best on a daily basis in the Amateurs it seems odd they would not want to try themselves against the top ten pros?

I didn't say it was Jalalovs fault but I don't see how you can claim Jalalov would smirch the best HW currently on the planet when he hasn't even fought someone half as good as Usyk.

 

[aries]

Resume is one criteria but there are others. Amongst other things, Jalalov is an extremely accomplished amateur, so he likely wouldn't be out-skilled. He is the bigger man, younger, and knows how to use his size. He is also mean. It remains to be seen how far he will go, but has the same promise Usyk showed before the Super 6. Of course, nothing is certain in boxing, and Usyk is proven while Jalalov is not. But if these two were forced to fight today and I had to put $ down, I'm putting it on Jalalov.

I don't disagree with any of that but you claimed he'd do a number on Usyk. I'd like to see some evidence first. If he walks through the likes of a Joseph Parker level fighter then I can get on board.

 

[Fedorgasm]

Dive, duck and dodge dip too.

Yup, Floyd had those skills both inside and outside the ring

 

[IanEdwards]

Might be the best boxer of the last 30 years over Floyd.

Floyd cherry picked his way to 50-0. Usyk fought everybody in their primes.

boom. i described him to my dad after the AJ fight as a 220lb Mayweather- that level of genius, i meant

 

[Fedorgasm]

Also, we need a new term.

GOAT is greatest of ALL time, so you can't call someone a generational GOAT.

For someone that's the greatest of their own era, we can use GOTE. Greatest Of This Era.

 

[timmytimmy]

I didn't say it was Jalalovs fault but I don't see how you can claim Jalalov would smirch the best HW currently on the planet when he hasn't even fought someone half as good as Usyk.

I don't claim he would, but he looks great has accomplished a ton in the amateur's and should get some fights against the top pros

 

[BoxingMMA]

Floyd is great, incredible skillset and intelligence but he can’t be compared with a man with a true undefeated record (lets face it, Floyd lost vs Castillo) and someone who looked for the toughest challenges regardless of size and danger, met them head on and won.

Floyd barely makes the top 10 in my book, but he makes it, because he was great indeed, poetry in motion with his boxing.

 

[djacobox372]

Floyd is great, incredible skillset and intelligence but he can’t be compared with a man with a true undefeated record (lets face it, Floyd lost vs Castillo) and someone who looked for the toughest challenges regardless of size and danger, met them head on and won.

Floyd barely makes the top 10 in my book, but he makes it, because he was great indeed, poetry in motion with his boxing.

You're failing to consider just how shallow HW and CW are. Usyk only has beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning, and two of them were spit decisions.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

You're failing to consider just how shallow HW and CW are. Usyk only has beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning, and two of them were spit decisions.

He's only beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning? One of his first notable wins was over Huck who is the longest reigning cruiserweight champ of all time (tied with Johnny Nelson). Then he beat a unified champ in Gassiev and then Briedis who won the next World Boxing Super Series tournament and became the man at cruiser.

Then he moved up and beat AJ who was unified champ and has the deepest resume at heavyweight. Beat him twice. Now he's beaten an undefeated (on paper, I thought he lost the first McDermott fight) Fury who beat the most dominant heavyweight of the last era. All of those wins are significant and there are other champs and contenders in there. He did this in only 22 fights.

 

[BoxingMMA]

You're failing to consider just how shallow HW and CW are. Usyk only has beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning, and two of them were spit decisions.

You can make that argument about almost any era, as good as Lennox was he lost not only once but twice to fighters Usyk would absolutely demolish.

The reality is one can only fight those in his era, Usyk has succeeded in every aspect of the sport, he really can’t do much more than what he did. Honestly.

I mean he could have a go at wilder or zhang but do those guys deserve the fight at this point?

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

You can make that argument about almost any era, as good as Lennox was he lost not only once but twice to fighters Usyk would absolutely demolish.

The reality is one can only fight those in his era, Usyk has succeeded in every aspect of the sport, he really can’t do much more than what he did. Honestly.

I mean he could have a go at wilder or zhang but do those guys deserve the fight at this point?

He's wrong anyway. Cruiserweight was actually pretty stacked when Usyk ran through it. That's why they put on the World Boxing Super Series tournament for two consecutive seasons. Enough talent was there. Holyfield's cruiserweight run was impressive but besides Qawi and himself there wasn't any depth back then. It was a new division that had only existed for a few years by that point. So, it's weird when casuals like this guy criticize Usyk's run there but not the others that unified the division.

I do agree with him that this is a weak heavyweight era. Compared to what it used to be anyway. There's little talent there. It's not nearly as deep as it was in the 60s-70s and the 90s. But, these guys are still heavyweights and you can lose to anybody there. All it takes is one punch.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

You're failing to consider just how shallow HW and CW are. Usyk only has beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning, and two of them were spit decisions.

If you know nothing about CW then sure. Usyk won one of the most stacked tournaments of his time. If you think someone like Huck is a can then it isn't because CW is shallow, it's because you don't know much about CW boxing.

CW's hub of fighters are based in a region of the world that likely you do not interact with. The same reason why people will randomly say the lower weight classes are shallow because they only know of 1 fighter worth talking, which is nonsense.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

If you know nothing about CW then sure. Usyk won one of the most stacked tournaments of his time. If you think someone like Huck is a can then it isn't because CW is shallow, it's because you don't know much about CW boxing.

CW's hub of fighters are based in a region of the world that likely you do not interact with. The same reason why people will randomly say the lower weight classes are shallow because they only know of 1 fighter worth talking, which is nonsense.

Not to mention that Glowacki, Briedis, Gassiev & Fury were all undefeated champions when Usyk beat them. Hunter, a solid contender, was also undefeated. Additionally, with the exception of Fury, Usyk beat all of them in their own backyards. He also initially beat Joshua, who only had 1 loss (avenged) at the time, in his own backyard as well as Huck.

 

[BoxingMMA]

He's wrong anyway. Cruiserweight was actually pretty stacked when Usyk ran through it. That's why they put on the World Boxing Super Series tournament for two consecutive seasons. Enough talent was there. Holyfield's cruiserweight run was impressive but besides Qawi and himself there wasn't any depth back then. It was a new division that had only existed for a few years by that point. So, it's weird when casuals like this guy criticize Usyk's run there but not the others that unified the division.

I do agree with him that this is a weak heavyweight era. Compared to what it used to be anyway. There's little talent there. It's not nearly as deep as it was in the 60s-70s and the 90s. But, these guys are still heavyweights and you can lose to anybody there. All it takes is one punch.

Bit late, sorry, yeah Usyk has to get credit for expanding his own depth by going for a higher, more difficult division, at the same time the point is also moot considering he succeded in the amateurs as well, it's not like the guy got lucky and happened to stumble into a weak olympics, weak world's, weak cruiser and weak heavy, he had to go through a bunch of tough dudes in cruiser, tough dudes in HW (at their homes) and he did fight beterbiev 3 times in the amateurs winning two of them.

But comparing eras is kind of unfair, it's completely out of the boxer's hands. Obviously there are other great eras in the past but even those great eras had people saying "these guys suck compared to those of my day!"

I remember a history professor when I was 14, mike tyson was the rage back then and I was a huge fan (who wasnt) and this old geezer was like "mike tyson is a cow compared to Ali! He would have destroyed him bla bla"
Now a days people talk about Tyson as if he was indestructible back in his day.

When Lewis beat Tua people critizised him for running away, now they remember that night as a master class in boxing, as I am sure people will remember the Joshua/Ruiz rematch down the line.

I think comparing eras is a bit unfair, people always romanticise one more than the other.

Seeing things as impartial as possible, it really scrambles my brain to think what Usyk has achieved.

 

[Mujeriego]

You're failing to consider just how shallow HW and CW are. Usyk only has beaten 3 pro fighters worth mentioning, and two of them were spit decisions.

I agree.

I mean if you had to pick the worst division of all time, I think most would settle on CW.

 

[Mujeriego]

Bit late, sorry, yeah Usyk has to get credit for expanding his own depth by going for a higher, more difficult division, at the same time the point is also moot considering he succeded in the amateurs as well, it's not like the guy got lucky and happened to stumble into a weak olympics, weak world's, weak cruiser and weak heavy, he had to go through a bunch of tough dudes in cruiser, tough dudes in HW (at their homes) and he did fight beterbiev 3 times in the amateurs winning two of them.

Usyk also lost to Shawn Porter in the amateurs, lets not forget.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Usyk also lost to Shawn Porter in the amateurs, lets not forget.

When Usyk had only been boxing for a few years. This was before he'd even done anything at the world level in the amateurs. Floyd lost to worse fighters than Porter. One of them was Arnold Bravo who went 4-2 as a pro.

 

[Ardaric]

Usyk also lost to Shawn Porter in the amateurs, lets not forget.

Porter's been ducking the rematch for years.

 

[BoxingMMA]

Usyk also lost to Shawn Porter in the amateurs, lets not forget.

You are talking about a time where he was about two years into his amateur career, he still hasn’t come up to his natural weight and size and he was far away from his gold medal. I think it was only his 16th fight.

Porter was two years away from becoming pro and already at his natural weight class.

That porter loss doesn’t mean much, I can guarantee your favorite fighter in the world has an amateur loss against a lesser fighter than Shawn porter.

Here’s the partial record. It starts in 2005 and the porter fight was in 2006, losing to a future champ in his natural weight class only one year after starting boxing isn’t really that bad a look.

http://amateur-boxing.strefa.pl/Records/Usyk_Olexandr.html

But you are correct, he does have that loss. Can’t deny it.