Training one art at a time vs. two for MMA

[Kenjamito]

I've heard different takes on this and was just curious what the community thinks is best? Would you train a couple days of MT and a couple days of BJJ a week for example? Or just go full out 4-5x's a week in one for a year, and then learn the next discipline? What about "MMA classes" where they teach you something different everyday?

The school I'm looking at is the best in the state for fighters it's produced and they were telling me how their most recent fighter out of the MMA class was in it for 3 years before he took his first ammy fight and won by RNC in the first round. Makes me wonder if I were interested in MMA and have already been boxing if I should do that class or just hop in the jiu jitsu class or what. Right now I'm signed up for MT. I like fighting standing up, so I think I should focus on that, and maybe at some point when they see I'm dedicated they'll throw me some stand-up bjj and sprawl classes to do MMA?

 

[MadSquabbles500]

Just train MMA. If most places dont offer MMA only, then just get some people together and spar mma rules.

 

[panamaican]

For MMA? I agree with @MadSquabbles500, just train MMA. If you want to specialize in something or get deeper in something then add that second art. MMA and boxing or MMA and BJJ.

I think MMA training itself has come along far enough that it can be a starting point instead of starting with separate arts and trying to blend them on your own.

 

[Azam]

It depends on what your goals are.

Personally - my advice is avoid MMA classes unless you are looking to compete in MMA or are just want casual training. They will teach you decent enough striking/grappling for sure and yes they have come a long way. What they are better for is when you have adequate striking/grappling already.

But what they won't necessarily do as well is teach you technical striking & grappling - the way an instructor who just specializes in those things will. Most people I know that train MMA - learn striking & grappling separately usually at the same mma gym they go to (usually from instructors who specialize in those fields).

The structured training you get in MT, BJJ or individual martial arts are imho 1000x better than what you will get at your average mma class. MMA classes are a great way to put everything together.

Unless you have structured MMA classes (like for beginners) - even then you won't get the same technical instruction that a pure striking or pure grappling coach will give you.

So again depends on your goals.

 

[IrishWarMachinex]

It depends on what your goals are.

Personally - my advice is avoid MMA classes unless you are looking to compete in MMA or are just want casual training. They will teach you decent enough striking/grappling for sure and yes they have come a long way. What they are better for is when you have adequate striking/grappling already.

But what they won't necessarily do as well is teach you technical striking & grappling - the way an instructor who just specializes in those things will. Most people I know that train MMA - learn striking & grappling separately usually at the same mma gym they go to (usually from instructors who specialize in those fields).

The structured training you get in MT, BJJ or individual martial arts are imho 1000x better than what you will get at your average mma class. MMA classes are a great way to put everything together.

Unless you have structured MMA classes (like for beginners) - even then you won't get the same technical instruction that a pure striking or pure grappling coach will give you.

So again depends on your goals.

Agree

 

[MadSquabbles500]

It depends on what your goals are.

Personally - my advice is avoid MMA classes unless you are looking to compete in MMA or are just want casual training. They will teach you decent enough striking/grappling for sure and yes they have come a long way. What they are better for is when you have adequate striking/grappling already.

But what they won't necessarily do as well is teach you technical striking & grappling - the way an instructor who just specializes in those things will. Most people I know that train MMA - learn striking & grappling separately usually at the same mma gym they go to (usually from instructors who specialize in those fields).

The structured training you get in MT, BJJ or individual martial arts are imho 1000x better than what you will get at your average mma class. MMA classes are a great way to put everything together.

Unless you have structured MMA classes (like for beginners) - even then you won't get the same technical instruction that a pure striking or pure grappling coach will give you.

So again depends on your goals.

You should be able to learn technical striking for MMA by simply training in MMA. If you want to get into more detail, you can just do situational training.

 

[Universal Kombat]

I've heard different takes on this and was just curious what the community thinks is best? Would you train a couple days of MT and a couple days of BJJ a week for example? Or just go full out 4-5x's a week in one for a year, and then learn the next discipline? What about "MMA classes" where they teach you something different everyday?

The school I'm looking at is the best in the state for fighters it's produced (MN Martial Arts Academy) and they were telling me how their most recent fighter out of the MMA class was in it for 3 years before he took his first ammy fight and won by RNC in the first round. Makes me wonder if I were interested in MMA and have already been boxing if I should do that class or just hop in the jiu jitsu class or what. Right now I'm signed up for MT. I like fighting standing up, so I think I should focus on that, and maybe at some point when they see I'm dedicated they'll throw me some stand-up bjj and sprawl classes to do MMA?

I like to focus on one art at a time. But you can definitely do a grappling and and striking art at the same time.

I'd do the MMA classes once you're comfortable with some good amount of BJJ and Muay thai

 

[IrishWarMachinex]

You should be able to learn technical striking for MMA by simply training in MMA. If you want to get into more detail, you can just do situational training.

There are nuances that most MMA classes don't go in depth about, probably due to lack of experience, a good boxer can teach you a lot of things an MMA teacher can't, how you use it practically is up to you

 

[MadSquabbles500]

There are nuances that most MMA classes don't go in depth about, probably due to lack of experience, a good boxer can teach you a lot of things an MMA teacher can't, how you use it practically is up to you

But then we are talking about lack of depth and lack of quality instruction in MMA because MMA is new.

In a situation like we have now, we need to get people together, spar, dick around, and then get into a circle and discuss what they have discovered.

 

[IrishWarMachinex]

But then we are talking about lack of depth and lack of quality instruction in MMA because MMA is new.

In a situation like we have now, we need to get people together, spar, dick around, and then get into a circle and discuss what they have discovered.

The thing is though, it's difficult without people who have actually competed at that level, it would just be a theoretical discussion, you see a lot more top class grapplers in MMA than strikers because primary striking sports like boxing still make a shit ton of money

remember it wasn't so long ago that Joe Rogan used to say shit like "bobbing and weaving is impractical in MMA because it leaves you open for headkicks" ummm...what?? so you can't bob or weave a headkick??

He also said shoulder rolling wouldn't work with small gloves, yet I saw a fighter (can't remember his name) using a shoulder roll very effectively in a prelim fight (think it was one of those fight for the troops cards)

 

[Captain]

Train separately. I don't think anyone that is new to combat sports should be jumping straight into MMA. I don't even think you need to split the days, I use to go to sequential classes. That being said you need to recognize what your end goal is.

I'm a slow learner when it comes to fighting. My BJJ coach did mention to me once how he thinks I need to focus on one game, and try to get good at that first. While I respected his advice, I was having too much fun. I am willing to sacrifice learning speed to have fun.

 

[Mr Mojo Lane]

remember it wasn't so long ago that Joe Rogan used to say shit like "bobbing and weaving is impractical in MMA because it leaves you open for headkicks" ummm...what?? so you can't bob or weave a headkick??

He also said shoulder rolling wouldn't work with small gloves, yet I saw a fighter (can't remember his name) using a shoulder roll very effectively in a prelim fight (think it was one of those fight for the troops cards)

? The Philly Shell is not that great for MMA b/c of the smaller gloves. Using your shoulder(shield) for extra defense is still good. Bob and weaves leaves you pretty vulnerable to knees. I wouldn't bob and weave a head kick anyways but I don't see how it leaves you open.

 

[biscuitsbrah]

Definitely learn the individual arts and then put it together in an MMA class.

 

[MaxMMA]

Training for MMA can be such a crap shoot. Whether you're new to combat sports completely or you have experience in a single art, it would be wise to receive instruction and guidence from someone who has experience fighting/coaching MMA (which will more than likely be a grappling heavy coach). Training individual arts is great, and you'll reap the rewards of expertise coaching, but MMA truely is a different animal than each individual art.

Recieving instruction from coaches that having little/no mma exp can counterproductive, they may not know how to use their knowledge to help you achieve your goals in the cage and you may not be experienced enough to help them give you exactly what you need.

Some non mma coaches won't be willing to alter their program for you, so you'll have to do everything their way and then decide which techniques/concepts from them you will use. Which again can be problematic if you are inexperienced.

I see way more "i want to try mma" threads in the striking forum than the grappling forum, which should come as no surprise i guess because a lot of jitz guys don't like being hit. What is a suprise though is how many people with some striking experience want to jump to MMA and treat Jiujitsu like an afterthought. Make no mistake, if you're not putting in the mat time, you won't make it very far. 50/50 grappling and striking minimum, the closer you can get to 75/25 the better.

 

[Zefram Cochrane]

It depends on what your goals are.

Personally - my advice is avoid MMA classes unless you are looking to compete in MMA or are just want casual training. They will teach you decent enough striking/grappling for sure and yes they have come a long way. What they are better for is when you have adequate striking/grappling already.

But what they won't necessarily do as well is teach you technical striking & grappling - the way an instructor who just specializes in those things will. Most people I know that train MMA - learn striking & grappling separately usually at the same mma gym they go to (usually from instructors who specialize in those fields).

The structured training you get in MT, BJJ or individual martial arts are imho 1000x better than what you will get at your average mma class. MMA classes are a great way to put everything together.

Unless you have structured MMA classes (like for beginners) - even then you won't get the same technical instruction that a pure striking or pure grappling coach will give you.

So again depends on your goals.

Cross training vs mma training is a an ongoing never-ending debate.

It all depends on the instructors, imo.

Cross training is great for depth in every single art, but you will also spend a lot of time learning a zillion things that don't apply to (look at my killer collar choke) or might be dangerous in (my deep half guard is amazing) MMA. You will also receive contradicting information: wrestling coach tells me to hunch over but MT coach wants me to stay more upright, boxing coach says my lead foot tip must point inside but kickboxing coach says point forward (of course, these examples are generalizations). Then, you will have to go the extra mile to decide what techniques to apply, how to adapt them and finally jump into MMA sparring anyway. Some coaches may be more willing to help in this area, but it's not common.

On the other hand, MMA training can give you a more consistent approach offering an all-in-one package even if classes are distinct, because each art is (or rather should be) taught with the goal of putting it all together. That makes life a lot easier. However (big however), finding an MMA gym that has truly competent coaching might be a crap shot.

 

[Azam]

Cross training vs mma training is a an ongoing never-ending debate.

It all depends on the instructors, imo.

Cross training is great for depth in every single art, but you will also spend a lot of time learning a zillion things that don't apply to (look at my killer collar choke) or might be dangerous in (my deep half guard is amazing) MMA. You will also receive contradicting information: wrestling coach tells me to hunch over but MT coach wants me to stay more upright, boxing coach says my lead foot tip must point inside but kickboxing coach says point forward (of course, these examples are generalizations). Then, you will have to go the extra mile to decide what techniques to apply, how to adapt them and finally jump into MMA sparring anyway. Some coaches may be more willing to help in this area, but it's not common.

On the other hand, MMA training can give you a more consistent approach offering an all-in-one package even if classes are distinct, because each art is (or rather should be) taught with the goal of putting it all together. That makes life a lot easier. However (big however), finding an MMA gym that has truly competent coaching might be a crap shot.

Of course it's an endless debate. Just going off my own personal experience.

I definitely agree it depends on the instructors. But I think it's important to note that most MMA instructors will not give you the depth of technical instruction that a striking coach or a grappling coach will give you. What MMA instructors will be extremely good at is teaching you how to adapt/apply techniques (they are familiar with) in striking/grappling in the MMA sport context.

There are disadvantages like you touched on - a striking or grappling coach depending on the art will teach you contradictory things and they will not teach you how to adapt techniques to MMA. But I think these are conditional disadvantages - a striking or grappling coach will teach you contradictory things if you are cross training in a multitude of striking/grappling styles - so this is easily remedied by learning one striking style & one grappling style only. Then adding further when you are competent in both. I wouldn't advice anyone either doing MMA or something else to engage in more than one grappling style or more than one striking style - especially if you're a newbie.

As for a striking/grappling coach not being able teach you how to adapt techniques to MMA - sure this is an issue. But you have to weight up the pros & cons. What a striking coach or a grappling coach will provide is indepth structured technical instruction - that will give you a good foundational grounding in the striking or grappling - like a striking coach will teach you proper footwork, distance management, angles, balance & weight transitioning during techniques, how to leverage properly with punches or kicks etc - all of which are transferable skills. A grappling coach will teach you basics in posture, positioning, grips, how to manipulate someone's weightetc etc things that most MMA instruction classes will not really delve into the same way.

This type of bottom up technical instruction tends to be lacking in MMA classes because time is divided between striking/grappling & instructors themselves have specific areas of expertise. The result is you will get rounded instruction but with no technical expertise in either area & you won't have the basic fundamentals down that someone who did striking or grappling separately will.

Habit is a very underrated thing in martial arts and once you learn something long enough it's very difficult to undo. Personally I think it's more important to learn basics properly rather than have gaps - because once you have those gaps it's very difficult to remove after it becomes habit.

I think that's probably the reason why most professional fighters in MMA learn arts separately for the most part & use MMA classes to put everything together.

It also depends on your goals - if you want to compete in MMA. I'd say you need to learn striking/grappling separately & once you have the basics down - then start doing MMA classes.

 

[Kenjamito]

Training for MMA can be such a crap shoot. Whether you're new to combat sports completely or you have experience in a single art, it would be wise to receive instruction and guidence from someone who has experience fighting/coaching MMA (which will more than likely be a grappling heavy coach). Training individual arts is great, and you'll reap the rewards of expertise coaching, but MMA truely is a different animal than each individual art.

Recieving instruction from coaches that having little/no mma exp can counterproductive, they may not know how to use their knowledge to help you achieve your goals in the cage and you may not be experienced enough to help them give you exactly what you need.

Some non mma coaches won't be willing to alter their program for you, so you'll have to do everything their way and then decide which techniques/concepts from them you will use. Which again can be problematic if you are inexperienced.

I see way more "i want to try mma" threads in the striking forum than the grappling forum, which should come as no surprise i guess because a lot of jitz guys don't like being hit. What is a suprise though is how many people with some striking experience want to jump to MMA and treat Jiujitsu like an afterthought. Make no mistake, if you're not putting in the mat time, you won't make it very far. 50/50 grappling and striking minimum, the closer you can get to 75/25 the better.

Thanks for that. No one has really broken it down 75/25 to me. I have a good relationship with a boxing gym owner here who invited me to be in his gym to work with his heavyweight and he just did a deal with a jiu jitsu program. I'm thinking I'll get a gi and dive into those classes once he works out a deal with them and if I like it I'll do MMA in a few years. I've just been so wishy washy with what the "end goal" is for me. Sometimes I want to have amateur MMA fights, other times I want to have more boxing matches, recently I wanted to do MT because I liked the idea of international travel...I did a month of no gi classes this past summer but went back to boxing because I thought I wanted to have more boxing matches and get an ammy belt for a credential, but now that I'm not under the stress of preparing for my own matches maybe I'll enjoy bjj more. It's funny when it comes to martial arts, I know that I "want it" and am a gym rat each day, I'm just not particularly clear on the "why." I've always admired how there's a philosophy of respect behind jiu jitsu and how the early UFC showed it trumps all disciplines and is the best self-defense art. I suppose I'll give it another try and if I don't like it I'll just stick with boxing.

 

[MaxMMA]

You should also be choosey with whom you decide to learn jiujitsu from as well if they are of non MMA lineage. Training at a place that does a lot of Gi jiujitsu doesn't necessarily mean it won't be useful for you in MMA. However, especially as a beginner you want to be training jitz at a place that puts heavy emphasis on fundamental jiujitsu. If you're spending a lot of your class time learning spider guard tricks and deep half guard sweeps you should find another gym. One that drills dominate positioning and basic high percentage submissions as a majority of their class.

 

[Kenjamito]

You should also be choosey with whom you decide to learn jiujitsu from as well if they are of non MMA lineage. Training at a place that does a lot of Gi jiujitsu doesn't necessarily mean it won't be useful for you in MMA. However, especially as a beginner you want to be training jitz at a place that puts heavy emphasis on fundamental jiujitsu. If you're spending a lot of your class time learning spider guard tricks and deep half guard sweeps you should find another gym. One that drills dominate positioning and basic high percentage submissions as a majority of their class.

I spoke with him and he said that he went 3-2 in MMA but did it 9 years ago before there was a heavy emphasis on ground work at the lower levels. He said the class is broken up based on what the goals are and explained why their work translates to MMA. Both of the instructors are brown belts and one is planning to do the pan am tourney before getting his black...he said some students are preparing for other big international tournaments (ibjjf? Adcc?). They have one guy preparing for a fight. They didn't like how one of the bigger schools in town did things when they got a new instructor so they started their own school. Smaller mat space than what you see at the bigger schools but seemed like hungry trainers ready to work.

 

[MaxMMA]

A lot of times smaller gyms can be great, less people means more 1 on 1 instruction.