The truth about championship reigns

your assessment is correct. you are smarter then a lot of people here.

what do you think of usman? he did defend against the new blood but only against three guys. i suppose the new blood were the ones that feasted on the previous generation to get title shots. So the same goes for people working up in away. garry is looking at colby to get the next shot.
 
I do think there's some merit to what you're saying. A win over an undefeated young ilia would have really done a lot to cement Volk as having a better championship reign than Aldo.

I do believe he fell short. Aldo had a big advantage winning the belt at such a young age. Volk was 30 years old before he had his opportunity and Aldo was in his early 20s.
 
This is something a lot of you aren't going to like hearing but it's a discussion that has to be had. Greatness in terms of championship reigns begins only after leftovers are finished. What do I mean?

Volkanovski, I've said time and time again he's not the greatest Featherweight of all time and that his resume is pretty bad short of Max Holloway. Holloway is an all time great and Volk beat him 3x in his prime, huge accomplishment. But a worn out, old and short notice Korean Zombie that Aldo already destroyed years prior? Or an old Mendes coming off multiple knockout losses and a 2 year suspension who already lost two title shots to Aldo years prior? Or Ortega who had a singular win since getting his face dribbled ten thousand times by Max Holloway? I told everyone that Evloev and Topuria weren't Korean Zombie, Ortega or Yair...they were legitimate title contenders in their prime and on the climb, undefeated and well rounded. That Volk needed to beat these two guys to cement his legacy as the best, that they were his true tests...

So often, these champions go on leftover tours because the name recognition of guys who climbed the mountain, failed and got old holds more weight when it comes to media attention and casual fans than actual contenders. Even Charles Oliveir went on a leftovers tour vs guys like Poirier, Gaethje and Chandler. Leon is currently trying to, rematching Usman, then fighting Colby and then asking for Masvidal...It's just how it works unfortunately. True greatness is when you finish the leftovers and beat the next wave that's actually rising to the top. It's what GSP did, Jones, Mighty Mouse. Even Topuria is only talking about leftovers, doesn't want to mention Evloev.


excellent thread
some people really believe you can build a GOAT resume by beating has beens
the truth is that volk reigned on the shallowest era of FW and couldn't hang with the new breed
 
I do think there's some merit to what you're saying. A win over an undefeated young ilia would have really done a lot to cement Volk as having a better championship reign than Aldo.

I do believe he fell short. Aldo had a big advantage winning the belt at such a young age. Volk was 30 years old before he had his opportunity and Aldo was in his early 20s.

Volk began training to pursue MMA at like 22-23, he had some Greco Roman experience in Australia before that which means very little. Topuria on the other hand began wrestling at 8 years old and training out of MMA and BJJ gyms around 14-15, had his pro debut once he turned 18.

It was a point I raised about Islam too, Volk began training for MMA around 22-23, Islam began in Tae Kwon Do and Sanda at like 8 and 10, then did wrestling for a couple years, shortly after that he began doing Sambo with Khabib and Abdulmanap but moved away, came back around 15 and dedicated dedicated himself full-time to the pursuit of Sambo and MMA, had Sambo and amateur MMA tournaments left and right before debuting pro at 18 as well. I also think it shows in Volks style, he's super athletic, intelligent and conditioned but he actually doesn't do THAT MUCH well, his striking arsenal is quite limited both in strikes and combinations he uses and ranges of which he's effective. Beyond that his grappling has always been pretty meat and potatoes offensively, it makes sense you know? It takes so long to develop things and bake them into your game. Aldo was similar, began BJJ in his teens and began MMA pursuit at 17, had been fighting pro since 17.


Volks amazing and did amazingly well with his career but it was mostly leftovers he beat to gain his fame. I kept saying Evloev and Ilia would be his legacy fights, the ones that showed he really transcended such a shallow division and 145 generation.
 
Where was any of this BS when he was actively beating these guys???? Ofcourse In classic Sherdog fashion, after a loss :

“He was never that good”
 
Volk began training to pursue MMA at like 22-23, he had some Greco Roman experience in Australia before that which means very little. Topuria on the other hand began wrestling at 8 years old and training out of MMA and BJJ gyms around 14-15, had his pro debut once he turned 18.

It was a point I raised about Islam too, Volk began training for MMA around 22-23, Islam began in Tae Kwon Do and Sanda at like 8 and 10, then did wrestling for a couple years, shortly after that he began doing Sambo with Khabib and Abdulmanap but moved away, came back around 15 and dedicated dedicated himself full-time to the pursuit of Sambo and MMA, had Sambo and amateur MMA tournaments left and right before debuting pro at 18 as well. I also think it shows in Volks style, he's super athletic, intelligent and conditioned but he actually doesn't do THAT MUCH well, his striking arsenal is quite limited both in strikes and combinations he uses and ranges of which he's effective. Beyond that his grappling has always been pretty meat and potatoes offensively, it makes sense you know? It takes so long to develop things and bake them into your game. Aldo was similar, began BJJ in his teens and began MMA pursuit at 17, had been fighting pro since 17.


Volks amazing and did amazingly well with his career but it was mostly leftovers he beat to gain his fame. I kept saying Evloev and Ilia would be his legacy fights, the ones that showed he really transcended such a shallow division and 145 generation.

I don't think Evloev would have given him much trouble tbh.
 
Using your logic, you could diminish Topuria's win, saying that he beat a 35 year old, post KO Volk..

But no 'Topuria is a serious guy'
 
Volk would have dusted up Evolev even at age 35. I don't even know see how that's a question.

Max also would eat Evolev alive.

Evolev can't finish a slice of pizza what's he going to do out cardio two of the greatest cardio guys to ever step into the ring at FW...get outta here with that
 
UFC pre-Khabib, before fighters from the Caucasus/Central Asia entered the sport, is like the NBA or boxing before blacks. It’s a different game now.

It’s too competitive now. Guys have to win 10 fights before getting a title shot, and then there’s a mountain grappler breathing down their neck once they win the belt. The era of guys getting a title shot after a couple impressive wins, and then racking up 10 defenses, is over.
 
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I don't think Evloev would have given him much trouble tbh.

I think everyone doubts my boy Evloev. But regardless, it's not about that, it's about fighting someone with momentum, in their prime and on the rise. Rather than beating up guys with Ls and who have lost to past champs and lack win streaks etc.
 
This is something a lot of you aren't going to like hearing but it's a discussion that has to be had. Greatness in terms of championship reigns begins only after leftovers are finished. What do I mean?

Volkanovski, I've said time and time again he's not the greatest Featherweight of all time and that his resume is pretty bad short of Max Holloway. Holloway is an all time great and Volk beat him 3x in his prime, huge accomplishment. But a worn out, old and short notice Korean Zombie that Aldo already destroyed years prior? Or an old Mendes coming off multiple knockout losses and a 2 year suspension who already lost two title shots to Aldo years prior? Or Ortega who had a singular win since getting his face dribbled ten thousand times by Max Holloway? I told everyone that Evloev and Topuria weren't Korean Zombie, Ortega or Yair...they were legitimate title contenders in their prime and on the climb, undefeated and well rounded. That Volk needed to beat these two guys to cement his legacy as the best, that they were his true tests...

So often, these champions go on leftover tours because the name recognition of guys who climbed the mountain, failed and got old holds more weight when it comes to media attention and casual fans than actual contenders. Even Charles Oliveir went on a leftovers tour vs guys like Poirier, Gaethje and Chandler. Leon is currently trying to, rematching Usman, then fighting Colby and then asking for Masvidal...It's just how it works unfortunately. True greatness is when you finish the leftovers and beat the next wave that's actually rising to the top. It's what GSP did, Jones, Mighty Mouse. Even Topuria is only talking about leftovers, doesn't want to mention Evloev.

First of all, dont mention Evloev in the same breath as Topuria. Evloev kinda sucks, while Topuria has the makings of a GOAT.

Second of all, although you have a point, you fail to grasp the truth at hand. Which is that beating a truly great fighter many times counts more than beating a variety of lesser fighters an equal amount of times. To illustrate: If Volk had instead of beating Max two more times, beaten Allen and Kattar it seems like you - according to your own metric - would have to rate Volk higher than you do now. But that does not make sense, because we know Max is beter than Allen and Kattar, hence Volk beating him thrice should count for more.
 
GSP beat 7 current, former or would be champions (Hughes, Penn, Serra, Sherk, Condit, Hendricks and Bisping) I think its wild suggesting these fighters weren’t top tier they had UFC gold
Serra was a very lucky journeyman, brought back from the minors with a 4-4 record in the UFC (Mostly as a lightweight), for that travesty TUF4 Kangaroo crap. Never a top tier by any stretch of imagination, in any weightclass.

By the third fight (The one in his "dominant run") Hugues was past his prime.

Sherk was a lightweight that fought as WW because he had no other option.

Penn was a LW that often didn't take the sport seriously and GreaseSP cheated when he (Penn) did. Should be a DQ loss for the Greaseman,

Hendricks beat the shit out of GSP and GSP left the sport to avoid the rematch and the subsequent monetary loss.

Condit, Koscheck, Fitch weren't able to achieve shit once GSP went into hiding from Hendricks.

Nick Diaz was a fighter that, cult hero at all, was to flawed to be any more than a gatekeeper when Gary Shaw and Scott Coker handpicked his rivals.

See? You can do the same they're doing with Volk with everybody. You could do it with Ando and Khabib. Easy.
 
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