Shinya Aoki just defeat John Lineker at 40 years old

[RedMountain]

His record is impressive, 48-11 fighting in the best promotions. still fighting and winning at 40 years old and after almost 60 fights is impressive for me.

Opinions?, how do you rank him among Lightweights?

 

[Kb7]

...he beat a flyweight?

 

[Prologue]

Pajama Pants Aoki is more dangerous than Motivated BJ Penn.

 

[maximus__]

His record is impressive, 48-11 fighting in the best promotions. still fighting and winning at 40 years old and after almost 60 fights is impressive for me.

Opinions?, how do you rank him among Lightweights?

He beat a guy 3 divisions below him on short notice who is undersized as it is.

He should win those fights. He is a top 20-30 LW at best who probably was top 15 at best during his career.

 

[PrideNverDies]

Linker took the fight on like 1 hour notice because Sage pulled out last minute

 

[sonhow]

Isnt Shinya LITERALLY FIVE TIMES HIS SIZE though?

 

[maximus__]

Isnt Shinya LITERALLY FIVE TIMES HIS SIZE though?

Aoki was fighting at WW vs Sage... it was more than 3 divisions holy bejesus. WW is 185 in One... 30-40 pounds above his usual weightclass.

 

[mkt]

Tony Ferguson should start fighting former flyweights who are past their primes. I think he'd probably win, too.

 

[BabyBlue_Bomber]

I will never forget how Sakurai battered him in seconds…

Or those hot photos with Imanari…

 

[mkt]

Aoki was fighting at WW vs Sage... it was more than 3 divisions holy bejesus. WW is 185 in One... 30-40 pounds above his usual weightclass.

"Was" is they key word. It never happened. He did fight Ben Askren (who could probably cut to 155 if he lost some baby fat) and got ragdolled badly.

 

[mkt]

He beat a guy 3 divisions below him on short notice who is undersized as it is.

He should win those fights. He is a top 20-30 LW at best who probably was top 15 at best during his career.

I never believed he was a top LW, except in his limited fighting world in Japan. BJ Penn would've owned him when both were in their primes in the mid 2000's. BJ could hang with him on the ground if he needed to but would most likely keep it standing and TKO him. Both Gilbert Melendez and Eddie Alvarez (rematch) showed Aoki's limitations against well-rounded opponents, particularly in a cage.

 

[maximus__]

I never believed he was a top LW, except in his limited fighting world in Japan. BJ Penn would've owned him when both were in their primes in the mid 2000's. BJ could hang with him on the ground if he needed to but would most likely keep it standing and TKO him. Both Gilbert Melendez and Eddie Alvarez (rematch) showed Aoki's limitations against well-rounded opponents, particularly in a cage.

And yet Aoki is still out there fighting decent competition whilst BJ (who I am a massive fan of) was losing to bums on his way out. Same with Giblert, Alvarez was the only one still beating decent competition in MMA on his way out.

Aoki probably beats Sage to be honest if they fought. He is just shop worn at this point.

BJ Penn was probably one of the best to ever do it and would still do ok in the current FW landscape if he was transported forward in time. HIs boxing, takedown defence and back control game, transports straight into today's MMA game with minor adjustments. Everyone remembers him for his guard, but that was only against GSP. He was winning fights without having to really on that skillset.

The difference is you don't need to be undefeated to be a great in Japanese MMA like the current UFC. Sure he isn't undefeated, but the fights have always been entertaining if Aoki is fighting.

 

[Kb7]

And yet Aoki is still out there fighting decent competition whilst BJ (who I am a massive fan of) was losing to bums on his way out. Same with Giblert, Alvarez was the only one still beating decent competition in MMA on his way out.

Aoki probably beats Sage to be honest if they fought. He is just shop worn at this point.

BJ Penn was probably one of the best to ever do it and would still do ok in the current FW landscape if he was transported forward in time. HIs boxing, takedown defence and back control game, transports straight into today's MMA game with minor adjustments. Everyone remembers him for his guard, but that was only against GSP. He was winning fights without having to really on that skillset.

The difference is you don't need to be undefeated to be a great in Japanese MMA like the current UFC. Sure he isn't undefeated, but the fights have always been entertaining if Aoki is fighting.

Aoki is fighting nobodies...sorry to burst you bubble.

 

[maximus__]

Aoki is fighting nobodies...sorry to burst you bubble.

They brought Siver out of retirement to try and give BJ a win... I love BJ and all time he is way better, but BJ had the bigger drop off.

I will respect a guy taking dangerous fights like Sage Northcutt at 170 in the tail end of his career. Aoki doesn't gain anything from a fight like that.

Just a fun fact, Aoki and Khabib have a common win within 2 years of each other in Kamal Shalorus and it was Aokis 45th fight, compared to Khabibs 17th. Khabib is gone and Aoki is still out there fighting people in various weightclasses. Got to respect that in my opinion especially in Japanese MMA.

 

[mkt]

And yet Aoki is still out there fighting decent competition whilst BJ (who I am a massive fan of) was losing to bums on his way out. Same with Giblert, Alvarez was the only one still beating decent competition in MMA on his way out.

Aoki probably beats Sage to be honest if they fought. He is just shop worn at this point.

BJ Penn was probably one of the best to ever do it and would still do ok in the current FW landscape if he was transported forward in time. HIs boxing, takedown defence and back control game, transports straight into today's MMA game with minor adjustments. Everyone remembers him for his guard, but that was only against GSP. He was winning fights without having to really on that skillset.

The difference is you don't need to be undefeated to be a great in Japanese MMA like the current UFC. Sure he isn't undefeated, but the fights have always been entertaining if Aoki is fighting.

Yes, Aoki has had good longevity, but my point still stands. At his peak, he wasn't the best LW at the time. Jim Miller, Clay Guida and Matt Brown are similar. They were never at the very top of their weight class, but they didn't decline quickly like many elite fighters have.

I think it's also helped that Aoki's overall competition hasn't been that strong. If he fought consistently good/dangerous guys Cerrone like did, I think he'd be more worn down by this point.

 

[maximus__]

Yes, Aoki has had good longevity, but my point still stands. At his peak, he wasn't the best LW at the time. Jim Miller, Clay Guida and Matt Brown are similar. They were never at the very top of their weight class, but they didn't decline quickly like many elite fighters have.

I think it's also helped that Aoki's overall competition hasn't been that strong. If he fought consistently good/dangerous guys Cerrone like did, I think he'd be more worn down by this point.

I still think he was a top 15 guy when he was fighting Eddie Alvarez and that sort of era. Top 15 to me is elite and pairing it with the ability to still be around after those guys is respectable.

 

[Da Speeit]

He beat a guy 3 divisions below him on short notice who is undersized as it is.

He should win those fights. He is a top 20-30 LW at best who probably was top 15 at best during his career.

He was top 3 at LW for a long time

 

[maximus__]

He was top 3 at LW for a long time

Let's be honest though. He kinda alternated lost or alternated a win/loss with every other long time ranked LW he ever fought.
Eddie Alvarez 1-1
Jaoachim Hansen 1-1
Eduard Folyang 1-1

I love him as a fighter, but LW all time he is in there by volume over quality.

 

[Da Speeit]

I never believed he was a top LW, except in his limited fighting world in Japan. BJ Penn would've owned him when both were in their primes in the mid 2000's. BJ could hang with him on the ground if he needed to but would most likely keep it standing and TKO him. Both Gilbert Melendez and Eddie Alvarez (rematch) showed Aoki's limitations against well-rounded opponents, particularly in a cage.

Shinya had way more miles and was not as roided as those. He beat Eddie. He’s also way better on the ground than BJ

 

[Da Speeit]

Let's be honest though. He kinda alternated lost or alternated a win/loss with every other long time ranked LW he ever fought.
Eddie Alvarez 1-1
Jaoachim Hansen 1-1
Eduard Folyang 1-1

I love him as a fighter, but LW all time he is in there by volume over quality.

Volume matters and while BJ was “reigning” over Diego Sanchez and Joe Stevenson, Aoki was fighting and beating Alvarez, Kawajiri,JZ, Hellboy. All the actual top lws.

We give BJ respect bc he’s a historic fighter but his actual resume at LW isnt good at all