Peak Larry Holmes jab compared to Liston.

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spacetime

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Bert Sugar was seriously torn who had the better jab. How on earth could it not be more clear that Holmes jab was light years better than Listons??

You can watch prime Holmes jab vs. Shavers here.

Holmes jab was a thing of beauty - fluid, hard, fast. What does Liston have going for his jab besides power? It's not a knock on Liston, nobody had a jab anywhere near Holmes. How is this even a debate?
 
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I can mention a host of HW with jabs superior technically to Liston: Foreman, Lewis, Ali etc. Foreman also had power comparable to Liston's. I love big George's jab.

Wlad's jab is overrated in my opinion. It's nowhere near those guys.

Feel free to disagree.
 
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Can we rename this to spacetime debates jabs with himself?
 
I'll throw my phone if anyone comes in here and says Liston had a greater jab than Foreman, let alone Holmes!!

This is a much faster, cleaner and overall superior jab to Liston

 
spacetime said:
Bert Sugar was seriously torn who had the better jab. How on earth could it not be more clear that Holmes jab was light years better than Listons??

You can watch prime Holmes jab vs. Shavers here.

Holmes jab was a thing of beauty - fluid, hard, fast. What does Liston have going for his jab besides power? It's not a knock on Liston, nobody had a jab anywhere near Holmes. How is this even a debate?
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Joe Louis had a nice jab too.
 
spacetime said:
I'll throw my phone if anyone comes in here and says Liston had a greater jab than Foreman, let alone Holmes!!

This is a much faster, cleaner and overall superior jab to Liston

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Foreman's jab was better after his comeback.
 
StickAndMove said:
Foreman's jab was better after his comeback.
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Not at all. He was outjabbed by Michael Moorer and just plain worse. Young Foremans jab was far better because he was a more mobile and faster fighter.
 
spacetime said:
Not at all. He was outjabbed by Michael Moorer and just plain worse. Young Foremans jab was far better because he was a more mobile and faster fighter.
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Foreman used his jab and left hook to get Moorer to walk into his right hand. Sure he was more athletic when he was young but he was more ring general during his comeback.
 
spacetime said:
He was a fantastic boxer but I haven't seen enough to comment.
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I had to pay for VHS tapes to watch these guys when I was your age. Spend a day on YouTube watching his fights and spend one watching Ricardo Lopez fights.

You seem like a passionate enthusiast so I support your interest but it doesn't seem you're very qualified to make such arbitrary declarations.
 
StickAndMove said:
Foreman used his jab and left hook to get Moorer to walk into his right hand. Sure he was more athletic when he was young but he was more ring general during his comeback.
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Foreman lost all rounds apart from the one he scored in. Was outjabbed the entire match etc
 
XThe GreatestX said:
So did Listons. I have never seen anyone who had as powerful of a jab as Liston
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Cleveland Williams jab clearly makes more sound than Listons in their fights if you want to go by power alone. I don't think that's a great criteria.
 
spacetime said:
Cleveland Williams jab clearly makes more sound than Listons in their fights if you want to go by power alone. I don't think that's a great criteria.
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Makes more sound? Thats not what I meant. I have seen Liston drop guys purely with his jab. Holmes had a good jab. I don't think it was better then Listons tho
 
Discussions like this are always interesting to me because you're never sure if people are picking the jab that is more "technically" correct, or picking a person who did a lot off of their jab despite it's technique. I think you could say Wilder doesn't throw a good jab. He loads it up, flares his elbow, etc. But it's effective. Then you have lower level guys who technically throw it better, but don't seem to do very much with it. Like a carpenter with a beautiful bandsaw he doesn't entirely know how to use. You don't often see that at a high level though, because generally guys who can't jab AND don't have power don't make it far. I can't think of one, actually.

Then you have guys who are both technical and effective, like Miguel Cotto.


As for the OP, it's a good comparison. Both guys use it well offensively and defensively. I guess as a matter of taste I prefer Liston.
 
spacetime said:
Cleveland Williams jab clearly makes more sound than Listons in their fights if you want to go by power alone. I don't think that's a great criteria.
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That's only because Liston has the louder face.
 
XThe GreatestX said:
Makes more sound? Thats not what I meant. I have seen Liston drop guys purely with his jab. Holmes had a good jab. I don't think it was better then Listons tho
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Well I have seen young Listons fights against Williams, and Listons best shot is without question his left hook. That shot was scary.
 
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