Opinion on 165lbs Division?

Bend NvR Break said:
The guys hollering for a 165 division should be at 170.
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I think many 70'ers will drop to 65 but the big boys, like Till and Usman, would likely go to 75.

I think UFC could just put on cards full of all 70 and 55'ers, as those divisions are STAAACKED, but instead we get WMMA and other junk. IMO, it's a great idea.

Anything to cut down on insane weight cuts is good.
 
I did the math (well, an website did) about the difference between weight classes. hwo much of an increase in weight it is between weightclasses

125-135 8% 135-145 7.4% 145-155 6.9% 155-170 9.6% 170-185 8.8%

the jump of 155 to 170 is of 9.6%!! way higher than any other jump between the lower weight classes. why? why are 165ers punished like this? while 155-165 wouuld be only 6.4%. and 175-185 would be only 5.7%

185 to 205 is 10.8%. and yes, you see romero, rockhold and even weidman complaining about the cut, BUT there is NO depth at all to warrant 195. also they don't miss weight* (yes, romero, but first time it was short notice and second time he got fucked by the commission. and he missed weight by only 0.2 pound. he also 41 years old, having cut weight for decades)

I don't see any reason NOT to have 165. as I just said, it's the biggest difference between weight classes aside MW to LHW. and you see guys having problem at this particular weight. not only that, it's where the biggest talent pool in the world is. I think it's the average height, that's why there are so many LWs and WWs
 
Mesos said:
Actually think khabib is better suited at 165 than 155lbs. Big khabib fan but its only a matter of time before that weight catches up to him, and costs him a fight.
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However, some real wrestling big boys, like TWood and Usman, just have to drop ten pounds and then they could fight Khabib.
 
Toco said:
225... jesus fucking christ. 185 is already shallow, 205 even more. 265 too. then you want to add ANOTHER in the mix?

and no, 155 guys would be a bit small in 170. like cerrone, RDA who got dominated by colby
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That's funny you said Colby. Colby isn't a big 170 at all and could make 155 if he wanted to play to huge weight cut game. He's between 180-185 WALKING AROUND. He intentionally doesn't cut a lot of weight so he doesn't hurt his cardio or pace. There are multiple 155 that are heavier than him on a normal day. Eddie Alvarez, Kevin Lee, Tony Ferguson, Khabib. Hell there are FW that are just as heavy or even heavier than him. Oretega and Holloway are both 180+ normally. Jeremy Stephens said when he was fighting at LW he weighed 185 normally.

And you ignored the first part of my post where I said they have to control weight cutting which would send most people up a division. Some people 2 divisions.

The entire MW division walk around at HW weights.

And creating a 165 division will do is cause 170 to dehydrate 5 more pounds leading to more problems not solutions. The 155ers crying for the 165 division (I'm staring right at you Lee) need to be at 170.


Step 1 control weight cutting via hydration testing
Step 2 send people up closer to their natural walk around weight
Step 3 create 225 division.
 
Tyrannosaurus rex said:
How so? The size differences between fighters would increase and so would extreme weight cutting.
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Well, let's put in a hypothetical then.

The UFC introduces a 165lb division tomorrow. What percentage of 155'ers move up, and what percentage of 170'ers move down? I put to you that most 155'ers will stay put where they are, since they can make the weight, but that some 170'ers will make the extra cut to 165.

In this model, an added weight class leads to more weight cutting, not less.
 
Mesos said:
What is your opinion on making a new division 165lbs?

Who do you thinks becomes champ?


What would the division would be called?



Was curious on what others thought about making a new 165 lbs division. Think its needed at this point. 155 is really crowded with a ton of talent and theirs is alot of oversized LW that could easily fill in division. Think it makes alot of sense, but the talk of making other divisions like Cruiserweight makes no sense their is not enough people for it either way.


Think alot of top LW would perform better with less weight to cut as well.
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wont happen even if conor asked really nicely. there no need for a 165 class just to have 155ers who cant make weigh at 155 any more.
 
Bend NvR Break said:
That's funny you said Colby. Colby isn't a big 170 at all and could make 155 if he wanted to play to huge weight cut game. He's between 180-185 WALKING AROUND. He intentionally doesn't cut a lot of weight so he doesn't hurt his cardio or pace. There are multiple 155 that are heavier than him on a normal day. Eddie Alvarez, Kevin Lee, Tony Ferguson, Khabib. Hell there are FW that are just as heavy or even heavier than him. Oretega and Holloway are both 180+ normally. Jeremy Stephens said when he was fighting at LW he weighed 185 normally.

And you ignored the first part of my post where I said they have to control weight cutting which would send most people up a division. Some people 2 divisions.

The entire MW division walk around at HW weights.

And creating a 165 division will do is cause 170 to dehydrate 5 more pounds leading to more problems not solutions. The 155ers crying for the 165 division (I'm staring right at you Lee) need to be at 170.


Step 1 control weight cutting via hydration testing
Step 2 send people up closer to their natural walk around weight
Step 3 create 225 division.
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170s that are big would go to 175, the others that are not will go to 165. its not hard to udnerstand it. and if you're too big there's always 10 pounds more

225 is horrendous. stop

what about this

125-135 8% 135-145 7.4% 145-155 6.9% 155-170 9.6% 170-185 8.8%

the jump of 155 to 170 is of 9.6%!! way higher than any other jump between the lower weight classes. why? why are 165ers punished like this? while 155-165 wouuld be only 6.4%. and 175-185 would be only 5.7%

why are the 2 classes with most fighters being punished with a way bigger difference in weight than the rest of hte divisions? tehre could be 165 and 175 and the weight difference would be similar to 145-555. why 155 have to jump 15 pounds to 170? it doesn't make any sense. it just makes weight cut harder for no reason

also, 165 will happen. wait and see. no reason not too. because a couple of hardcores doesn't want it? eh
 
Toco said:
170s that are big would go to 175, the others that are not will go to 165. its not hard to udnerstand it. and if you're too big there's always 10 pounds more

225 is horrendous. stop

what about this

125-135 8% 135-145 7.4% 145-155 6.9% 155-170 9.6% 170-185 8.8%

the jump of 155 to 170 is of 9.6%!! way higher than any other jump between the lower weight classes. why? why are 165ers punished like this? while 155-165 wouuld be only 6.4%. and 175-185 would be only 5.7%

why are the 2 classes with most fighters being punished with a way bigger difference in weight than the rest of hte divisions? tehre could be 165 and 175 and the weight difference would be similar to 145-555. why 155 have to jump 15 pounds to 170? it doesn't make any sense. it just makes weight cut harder for no reason

also, 165 will happen. wait and see. no reason not too. because a couple of hardcores doesn't want it? eh
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155 is full of fighters who kill themselves to make weight rather than fight 170.

All 165 is going to do is cause a bunch of 170ers to lose 5 more pounds. 90% of 155 is staying at 155 except extreme cutters who shouldn't be there in the first place.
 
EndlessCritic said:
Well, let's put in a hypothetical then.

The UFC introduces a 165lb division tomorrow. What percentage of 155'ers move up, and what percentage of 170'ers move down? I put to you that most 155'ers will stay put where they are, since they can make the weight, but that some 170'ers will make the extra cut to 165.

In this model, an added weight class leads to more weight cutting, not less.
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Well, I assume if they introduce 165 they change 170 to 175. So the smaller WW's might move down and the bigger LW's go up.

Either way, I'd prefer if they did away with weight cutting and radically changed up the weight classes.

140
150
160
170
185
200
220
220+

Something like that sounds good to me.
 
also just look at this stat

Heavyweights (265 lb, 120 kg): 43 Fighters

Light Heavyweights (205 lb, 93kg): 50 Fighters

Middleweights (185 lb, 84 kg): 52 Fighters

Welterweights (170 lb, 77 kg): 100 Fighters

Lightweights (155 lb, 70 kg): 82 Fighters

Featherweights (145 lb, 65 kg): 64 Fighters

Bantamweights (135 lb, 61 kg): 58 Fighters

Flyweights (125 lb, 56 kg): 34 Fighters


there are cleary WAY mroe fighters at WW and LW than anything else. you can safely do 165 that the divisions would still be quite strong. not only that, between 155 and 170, the weighclasses that easily have more fighters in the roster, its the one that has the biggest weight differential between them

125-135 8% 135-145 7.4% 145-155 6.9% 155-170 9.6% 170-185 8.8%

there's a 9.6% difference between 155 and 170. precisely because there is no 10 pound difference like the lower weight classes. and these are the weight classes that have by far the most fighters in the ufc. and they are punished with the biggest weight difference for some reason. just make 165 and let guys like kevin lee, cerrone, masvidal, chiesa, kevin lee, gastelum, till and others cut weight without a problem




https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2013/1/29/3928296/ufc-roster-current-list-fighters
 
Bend NvR Break said:
155 is full of fighters who kill themselves to make weight rather than fight 170.

All 165 is going to do is cause a bunch of 170ers to lose 5 more pounds. 90% of 155 is staying at 155 except extreme cutters who shouldn't be there in the first place.
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yes because at 170 they are undersized

d80b85aab4ba853da8544206247cc696.png


this is a sample by @executionermma. this list here, no one will be cutting extreme weight. where are the 170 that would go to 165 that would suffer because of the weight cut? everything would be fine. 3 healthy weight classes, like it should have been since the beginning
 
People whot want less weight classe clearly never competed,its very hard to pick the good weight class when u are in between
 
More divs doesn't mean less weight cutting, but more. Once a WW loses a few his choices now are to stay at WW or move up, as he can't cut to 155. But a lot of guys could cut to 165.
 
I only care about interesting matches. If there are enough guys to fill the division and it's not going to be another shallow 125 dominated by one guy, I'm in.
 
Toco said:
yes because at 170 they are undersized

d80b85aab4ba853da8544206247cc696.png


this is a sample by @executionermma. this list here, no one will be cutting extreme weight. where are the 170 that would go to 165 that would suffer because of the weight cut? everything would be fine. 3 healthy weight classes, like it should have been since the beginning
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Dude Tony Ferguson has said multiple times he's a 170 pound fighter, he won TUF at 170, and the only reason he fights at 155 is that's where the UFC wants him.
https://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/tony-ferguson/tony-ferguson-wants-gsp-not-conor-mcgregor/amp/
Screenshot_2018-07-12-15-21-02.png
Khabib, Eddie Alvarez and Daurish probably would also head to 165.

Wait why is Diaz heading to 165? To my knowledge he's never missed weight.

That list is pure conjecture.

Kevin Gastelum is about to fight and win imo the MW title but people are still calling for him to fight at WW. SMFH.

I can make a list to that if they controlled weight cutting did hydration testing where everyone would end up.
 
I'm fine with moving Welterweight up to 175 and making a 165 division. There is enough talent there to make another viable division, and the 155-170-185 jump always seemed rather arbitrary.

What would we call the new 165 weightclass? Commonweight? Centerweight?
 
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