MMA vs Boxing Popularity - Unknowable Mystery?

[BrockLesnarsTurtleBack]

Check the thread dumbass

The world isn't suburban USA

 

[Fisticuffa]

View attachment 1022176

That proves fuck all about the popularity of the respective sports worldwide. In Boxing, fighters get most of the money an event generates while in your sport the UFC gets it

UFC making money will not magically change the fact that no one gives a f*ck about MMA in say Thailand while Sor Rungvisai is a national star or the fact that Inoue is a national star in Japan & that boxing is a high school sport there

 

[Fisticuffa]

Its hard to tell because their popularlity depends on the type of event and their audience heavily overlaps. The biggest boxers cards peform better but the average UFC card performs better.

MMAs popularity came from correcting boxings various structual issues(lack of clear champions, the best fighters not fighting, cards only having 1 good fight etc) but in terms of the sports itself boxing is more popular. Boxing is objectively inferior to MMA in terms of combat but people prefer fist hitting face to a real fight. You need not look further than the MMA fans bitching about fighters using grappling to understand that. Majority of MMA fans want MMA to be kickboxing even if they don't say that they don't need to.

It doesn't

Among the leaked docs in the lawsuit against UFC was the finding that there was little overlap in audience

There might be a bigger overlap between WWE & UFC audience as both have similar models:

1) In house promoter controlled belts & rankings
2) Vince Mcmahon = Dana White
3) WWE brand > wrestlers, UFC brand > UFC fighters

Boxing fans tune in to watch Boxing & boxers not Top rank or Matchroom

 

[Fisticuffa]

That proves fuck all about the popularity of the respective sports worldwide. In Boxing, fighters get most of the money an event generates while in your sport the UFC gets it

UFC making money will not magically change the fact that no one gives a f*ck about MMA in say Thailand while Sor Rungvisai is a national star or the fact that Inoue is a national star in Japan & that boxing is a high school sport there

Srisaket gets hero’s welcome on return to Bangkok​

Srisaket gets hero’s welcome on return to Bangkok

NEWLY CROWNED World Boxing Council super flyweight champion Srisaket Sor Rungvisai received a hero’s welcome upon his return yesterday after defeating the previously unbeaten Roman Gonzalez at Madison Square Garden in New York at the weekend.

www.nationthailand.com

He also met the Thai PM twice

A guy who was literally eating out of garbage before he found Boxing

Now tell me how UFC making the most money somehow proves MMA's popularity over Boxing in Thailand & any number of other countries

 

[Paolo Delutis]

why do fans care what's more popular? are people such tools that they like something based on popularity or is it too hard for people to form their own thoughts and opinions on what they like without mass consensus based on social constructs?

Exactly... People today .

I CAN ONLY LIKE WHAT OTHERS LIKE...NOTICE ME I ALSO LIKE THIS THING OTHERS LIKE I AM COOL!! PICK ME...

it just reeks of desperation... If you like one or the other or both or nether who gives a fuck ...JUST GIVE ME FIGHTS!! .

 

[ferrisjso]

It doesn't

Among the leaked docs in the lawsuit against UFC was the finding that there was little overlap in audience

There might be a bigger overlap between WWE & UFC audience as both have similar models:

1) In house promoter controlled belts & rankings
2) Vince Mcmahon = Dana White
3) WWE brand > wrestlers, UFC brand > UFC fighters

Boxing fans tune in to watch Boxing & boxers not Top rank or Matchroom

This is the most insulting thing anyone has ever said about MMA.

The WWE is not a sport. It is a more ratchet trailerpark version of Broadway.

 

[HHJ]

This is the most insulting thing anyone has ever said about MMA.

The WWE is not a sport. It is a more ratchet trailerpark version of Broadway.

The connection between pro wrestling and fight sports is undeniable. They are both promoted the same,there is always going to be serious overlap,always has been,always will be.

There is always money to be made by mixing the two and it will never stop.

Attach files

 

[Cartiac]

Where the hell are the facts? Where is the certified, reliable data about this matter? I mean the data media companies, advertisers, etc. use to make objective business decisions. - It has to exist! It just has to. So where is it dammit?!

Seriously, though, what are the facts? How can it be established which of the two sports is more popular at present? No problem if it is necessary to break up the data by region or whatever. There should be some way to know for sure.

As someone that has very detailed professional experience with working with industry wide analytics for very large media companies, it is not as easy as you are thinking. Technically you are correct that the data is out there but data is the most valueable asset companies have these days and analytics of that data creates extreme competitive advantage so no one is going to be able to gain access to all of that data to put together that definitive answer.

In the media industry it is not even that easy for a company to gather viewership numbers of its own content since the distribution is owned by different companies. Industry wide data in media has historically been aggregated by companies like Nielsen, but as the industry has changed dramatically away from centralized TV networks that is also not longer very relavant. UFC is in the best position to have the most accurate understanding since they essentially have the full detailed data for the MMA side that they can compare to third party ratings data for the boxing industry.
With that being said I don't think you even need detailed analytics to see the obvious answer. Showtime didn't exit the boxing industry after nearly four decades of leading it because the boxing industry is doing so great these days.

 

[ferrisjso]

The connection between pro wrestling and fight sports is undeniable. They are both promoted the same,there is always going to be serious overlap,always has been,always will be.

There is always money to be made by mixing the two and it will never stop.

Attach files

I say the following every time this sort of thing gets brought up.

People who "get" WWE don't realize how off putting and alienating it is to people who don't "get it". While MMA can do great numbers if the WWEs audience comes to watch a Lesnar or a Punk anyone who doesn't watch it finds it absolutley insufferable. MMA and boxing fans especially the casuals are "sports people" there isn't overlap they tolerate it.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

Boxing =

- Biggest live gates
- Biggest attendances (granted most of these come from UK stadium shows)
- Bigger talent pool and more events
- Higher pay
- Top Rank I think generally gets higher ratings on ESPN in America than the UFC and I believe boxing was outdrawing Bellator on Showtime too before it all got axed.



MMA =

- Biggest single promotion in all combat sports by far
- More consistent of a draw on PPV since the late 00s
- Better online engagement (social media followers, forum traffic, Youtube views etc)
- EA produced video games coming out every few years (no major publisher has touched boxing since 2011)
- Some of the biggest fights in boxing now involve MMA fighters
- MMA fighters get more movie roles etc nowadays
- Even though theres less MMA events than boxing events happening, I think there might actually be more that are operating at a decent scale. If you try to look up boxing cards 90+% of them you wont even find footage. MMA has promotions in double figures that film their events, have commentary, production values etc etc.
- Probably a fair assumption that most weekends a UFC card has the most eyes on it spread across the widest range of countries.


All in all i'd say its 1a/1b now and has been for a while.

 

[TheBulge]

Boxing is still on its way down while MMA is growing. Both slowly. I grew up with HBO boxing and Showtime Boxing. Both have kissed that sport goodbye in only the last few years.

 

[Fisticuffa]

This is the most insulting thing anyone has ever said about MMA.

The WWE is not a sport. It is a more ratchet trailerpark version of Broadway.

The Forgotten Golden Age of MMA – Part I: The Golden Age of Wrestling & the Lost Art of American Catch-as-Catch-can

Accusations were made that Hackenschmidt threw the fight, and that Gotch had hired Ad Santel to injure Hackenschmidt‘s leg in training (the latter was easily proven false). The public soured on professional wrestling, equally tiring of the long boring matches in addition to the fixed matches.

The Forgotten Golden Age of MMA - Part I of IV

Cageside Featured Guest Columnist John S. Nash brings us part one of a fascinating four-part series shining a gas light on the forgotten golden age of mixed martial arts, an age that existed during the Belle Époque.

www.cagesideseats.com

The end of this "Golden Age of Ultimate Fighting" began with the first shots fired in Sarajevo on June 28, 1914. For the next four years, Europe would be engulfed by "The War"; amongst the casualties would be the mixed fights that had been popular only a few years previous, swept away suddenly by the forces of history.

The War would also spell the end of the mixed competitions in the United States. For a multitude of reasons, professional wrestling, the driving force behind mixed competitions, would move from an often-worked-but-still-legitimate sport, to pure vaudeville. A proposed million-dollar contest between the champions of wrestling and boxing, Ed "The Strangler" Lewis and Jack Dempsey, could have perhaps rescued it from this fate, but in the end, the match failed to materialize, and legitimate contests became a thing of the past.

Only in Asia did mixed fighting continue, at least for a few more years. In July of 1925, Ad Santel visited the islands of Hawaii to meet and draw with another jujutsuka in Tsutao "Rubberman" Higami.

The Forgotten Golden Age of MMA - Part IV

Cageside Features Guest Columnist John S. Nash brings us part four, thus concluding his fascinating series shining a gas light on the forgotten golden age of mixed martial arts, an age that existed during the Belle Époque.

www.cagesideseats.com

Please look up the roots of MMA in Japan & its connections with pro wrestling there

Nothing I said was insulting there

I merely pointed out the similarities in structure between MMA & pro wrestling like promoter controlled titles, promotion of the brand above individual fighters/wrestlers, & the personality of Dana White being akin to the role Vince used to play

I guarantee that Dana White probably has more fans than quiet a few fighters including ATG's like Demetrius Johnson while you would be hard pressed to find fans of Arum or Hearn, especially fans who like them more than boxers

Boxing fans tune in to watch Boxing & individual Boxers, who promotes them is of little concern. Even this forum's structure tells its own story with its separation between "UFC Discussion" (used to be called The Heavyweights as I remember) & "Worldwide MMA discussion" (called the Lightweights iirc). You don't see "Top Rank discussion" or "PBC discussion" on Boxing forums, just Boxing discussion (https://www.boxingforum24.com/forums/world-boxing-forum.6/) & perhaps subforums for regional/national discussions like British boxing forum (https://www.boxingforum24.com/forums/british-boxing-forum.8/) & boxers of the past (https://www.boxingforum24.com/forums/classic-boxing-forum.12/)

Even the way UFC titles its events as UFC 300 tell its own story (again keeping the brand center stage just like WWE). You don't see Boxing cards titled Top Rank 1000, instead its Canelo vs GGG or Inoue vs Fulton, boxers aren't interchangeable cogs in a promotional machine & if Canelo or Inoue get injured those events will have to be postponed

To top it all off, now both UFC & WWE are under Endeavour

 

[mraa1]

MMA's popularity peaked with the Conor/Khabib feud. No one actually cares about it anymore. Not even MMA fans care about MMA anymore, which is why the biggest MMA org in the world keeps poaching kickboxers, changed its rules to try and dissaude grapplers from actually grappling and why the 2nd biggest org in the world doesn't get any attention at all outside of the MT bouts they sprinkle in the cards to liven them up. MMA is a jabroni sport for closeted pro wrestling fans

 

[mraa1]

You keep bringing up japan as if everything revolves around them. Mma is more popular worldwide. Just because a country loses interest in it doesnt mean its not popular everywhere else. If anything, boxing is losing more and more everyday to BJJ and muay thai/kickboxing as far as popularity and people doing it for recreation.

i only know 2 guys that “do boxing” one of them didnt like “ultimate fighting” and said that “that takedown stuff is ghey”. The other one does it because he is fat and has diabetes and was force to do some exercising.

He's right. You really do live in a bubble. I'm in Central Asia right now and anytime I even make a passing mention of MMA, people have no idea what I'm talking about. What's even funnier is when I explain it to them they say "oh you mean boxing?"

MMA isn't some worldwide fixture bro, it's time to wake up to that fact

 

[JudoJabs]

Boxing =

- Biggest live gates
- Biggest attendances (granted most of these come from UK stadium shows)
- Bigger talent pool and more events
- Higher pay
- Top Rank I think generally gets higher ratings on ESPN in America than the UFC and I believe boxing was outdrawing Bellator on Showtime too before it all got axed.



MMA =

- Biggest single promotion in all combat sports by far
- More consistent of a draw on PPV since the late 00s
- Better online engagement (social media followers, forum traffic, Youtube views etc)
- EA produced video games coming out every few years (no major publisher has touched boxing since 2011)
- Some of the biggest fights in boxing now involve MMA fighters
- MMA fighters get more movie roles etc nowadays
- Even though theres less MMA events than boxing events happening, I think there might actually be more that are operating at a decent scale. If you try to look up boxing cards 90+% of them you wont even find footage. MMA has promotions in double figures that film their events, have commentary, production values etc etc.
- Probably a fair assumption that most weekends a UFC card has the most eyes on it spread across the widest range of countries.


All in all i'd say its 1a/1b now and has been for a while.

No one in MMA gets better online engagement than Tank Davis, Canelo & Ryan Garcia. These guys surpass even Conor with views on IG clips. Tank Davis has a pad training video he posted in November that is up to 43M views. Ryan Garcia has several that are 12M views.

On social media guys like Haney etc are already at the level of a Sugar Sean and younger.

Creed 3 just came out last year and had the likes of Canelo & Terence Crawford in it. Months later there was another major movie released in Foreman.

 

[Deceasedxo]

The fact is boxing and mma are very different sports to the degree that the only comparable thing about them is that they're listed as 'combat sports'. Even the boxing aspect of mma is totally different to traditional boxing. The fundamentals are totally different.
Also boxing was created as rich persons entertainment. Whereas MMA was made for the fringe fan looking for something different.

 

[chinarice]

I say the following every time this sort of thing gets brought up.

People who "get" WWE don't realize how off putting and alienating it is to people who don't "get it". While MMA can do great numbers if the WWEs audience comes to watch a Lesnar or a Punk anyone who doesn't watch it finds it absolutley insufferable. MMA and boxing fans especially the casuals are "sports people" there isn't overlap they tolerate it.

I get pro-wrestling and MMA. Been a fan of both for several decades. There is a huge connection between the two that anyone who watches both, can see it's plain as day.

Anyone who doesn't watch MMA find it stupid so what is your point?

 

[duke_droese]

I can't watch a boxer train anymore without thinking I'd tear that front leg to shreds lol.

MMA is on the up. Boxing is going down slowly.

This Saudi autism gave boxing a good injection. But it won't be good for the sport long term. They're all converting at this point for the daddy alashaykh stimulus package.

 

[Fisticuffa]

He's right. You really do live in a bubble. I'm in Central Asia right now and anytime I even make a passing mention of MMA, people have no idea what I'm talking about. What's even funnier is when I explain it to them they say "oh you mean boxing?"

MMA isn't some worldwide fixture bro, it's time to wake up to that fact

Central Asia is producing top notch Boxing talent too I might add, something that was impossible during USSR days because they couldn't even turn pro

Kazakhstan had GGG & now Janibek

Uzbekistan has MJ at 122 & Otabek Kholmatov at 126 who is soon to fight Raymond Ford for a title

Same with Australia right now where you have Jai Opetaia, Tim Tszyu, Jason Moloney, Liam Parro, Justis Huni etc. Most of these "UFC taking over" clowns have little clue about Tszyu's public recognition in Australia

 

[Fisticuffa]

I can't watch a boxer train anymore without thinking I'd tear that front leg to shreds lol.

MMA is on the up. Boxing is going down slowly.

This Saudi autism gave boxing a good injection. But it won't be good for the sport long term. They're all converting at this point for the daddy alashaykh stimulus package.

Thus proving that you have the IQ of a special needs kid

This is like saying "I can't watch a MMA fighter train anymore" without thinking I'd bite, eye gouge, & do a million other things prohibited by the unified rules

Go watch bum fights as that seems to be your cup of tea