Media Kyoji Horiguchi and Kai Asakura May Be Joining UFC According to Rizin President

[Hellowhosthat]

I guess you mean in the last decade or so.

Horiguchi, Okami and Uno all made their way to a tittle shot in UFC, so achieved higher levels than Mizugaki

You need to put some hespect on Yuki Kondo's name too.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

At FLW there are several Japanese that could make the top10 in UFC, or at least be competitive in there. Horiguchi, Shinryu, Taira and Ougikubo imo, then others who would be solid gatekeepers as Motoya or Wakamatsu. Rei Tsuruya is a good prospect as well.

At BW Asakura, Rinya Nakamura, and some of the aforementioned FLWs are legit imo. Also Naoki Inoue.

I mean, outside of USA, Brazil, and maybe Russia, its not like there is any single nation in the world that will provide plenty of solid top10 contenders in a particular division. But I can't think of any better than Japan at FLW/BW than those.

I don't think Hiro would be in the rankings personally. He's a little bit limited, but he could for sure be a solid middle of the rankings guy. Agree that Gucci, Taira and Shinryu are all rankings quality.

I think only the three countries you mentioned have better flyweights than Japan, with Kazakhstan fairly close to them and then probably England.

 

[pankrat]

You need to put some hespect on Yuki Kondo's name too.

Yeah I mentioned those three because they actually built a winning streak in UFC to get a tittle shot.

Kondo - despite he had won a fight in UFC prior to facing Tito - was imo more like Hayato Sakurai, who were brought in to challenge the champion based on credentials earned outside UFC.

 

[NoSmilez]

I mean, if JMMA is dead, under those standards MMA is dead in every country in the world outside of a few handful. There is no nation with plenty of champions and UFC top ranked fighters outside of USA, Brazil, Russia and now UK and Australia

Isn't that the truth? The JMMA scene is dying compared to 20 years ago. This is in contrast with another country like Korea, Mexico or even China. Their scene is still growing and there is still room for growth. Places like Mexico and China didn't even have a MMA scene a few years ago. Don't get me wrong. I get happy when I see Chonan cornering people in the UFC. At least he is helping develop other fighters for international competition.

 

[LindyBrah]

I guess you mean in the last decade or so.

Horiguchi, Okami and Uno all made their way to a tittle shot in UFC, so achieved higher levels than Mizugaki

LOL completely forgot about Horiguchi. He’s just had so much success post UFC.

 

[pankrat]

Isn't that the truth? The JMMA scene is dying compared to 20 years ago. This is in contrast with another country like Korea, Mexico or even China. Their scene is still growing and there is still room for growth. Places like Mexico and China didn't even have a MMA scene a few years ago. Don't get me wrong. I get happy when I see Chonan cornering people in the UFC. At least he is helping develop other fighters for international competition.

If you compare it with 20 years ago when JMMA was basically the Mecca of the sport then yeah, that's not the case today and probably will never be again. But that would be unrealistic expectations.

If you said a decade ago that JMMA was dying I would've agreed but in recent years there has been a rebound in MMA in Japan and there is lot of young surging talent, with several promotions in the country, lead by Rizin, that hold events regularly. Certainly more and more prominent than in Mexico, Korea or China, nations with huge potential but not in the level of Japan today.
JMMA is still the strongest in Asia and to say it's dying is not a true statement; if anything, it's in the rise in recent years.

 

[bambammccoy]

Dana won’t allow it. Ever since his boy Chuck got KO’d in pride by Rampage he’s been terrified to do cross promotion.

That isn't it at all lol UFC sent some guys over, Pride was supposed to do the same. Then they didn't. They got swindled.

 

[Yosuke]

MMA in Japan is pretty dead. The last few Rizin events had competitors with 20 fights but still fight at a lower level. I don't believe they will make an impact in the international scene. JMMA aren't the top dogs in terms of producing competitors in Asia. The Koreans probably took that spot and they produce competitors more suitable for cage fighting.

Damn, you really dont watch any MMA eh? The Koreans did what....?

 

[Hellowhosthat]

Isn't that the truth? The JMMA scene is dying compared to 20 years ago. This is in contrast with another country like Korea, Mexico or even China. Their scene is still growing and there is still room for growth. Places like Mexico and China didn't even have a MMA scene a few years ago. Don't get me wrong. I get happy when I see Chonan cornering people in the UFC. At least he is helping develop other fighters for international competition.

It's not really dying there is just MMA in far more countries now. There's still usually 3 or 4 Japanese MMA cards a week.

 

[NoSmilez]

It's not really dying there is just MMA in far more countries now. There's still usually 3 or 4 Japanese MMA cards a week.

You can probably find more than 3-4 regional shows but let's be honest. They aren't producing much talent suitable for fighting internationally. I watched most of the Rizin cards. Most of those guys aren't fighting at a high level. You have guys that have 20 fights in the local scene that don't look good. I don't want to seem like I am blindly hating. I want to see more Japanese competitors in the UFC.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

You can probably find more than 3-4 regional shows but let's be honest. They aren't producing much talent suitable for fighting internationally. I watched most of the Rizin cards. Most of those guys aren't fighting at a high level. You have guys that have 20 fights in the local scene that don't look good. I don't want to seem like I am blindly hating. I want to see more Japanese competitors in the UFC.

I don't think they're low level. The guys in RIZIN tend to do fine against international competition when it comes over. Kai Asakura recently KO'd former Bellator champ Juan Archuleta, Chihiro Suzuki KO'd current Bellator champ Patricio Pitbull.

 

[NoSmilez]

I don't think they're low level. The guys in RIZIN tend to do fine against international competition when it comes over. Kai Asakura recently KO'd former Bellator champ Juan Archuleta, Chihiro Suzuki KO'd current Bellator champ Patricio Pitbull.

These are two instances of an upset with aging fighters fighting in catchweight fights. You have to look at the skill level of Japanese MMA fighters as a whole. You are ignoring the fights that they often lose. These aren’t international competitors if they can only fight in Japan.

The skill level in their regional events aren’t great either. They encourage brawling because it is exciting. You have guys with more than ten fights that look like amateurs.

 

[pankrat]

These are two instances of an upset with aging fighters fighting in catchweight fights. You have to look at the skill level of Japanese MMA fighters as a whole. You are ignoring the fights that they often lose. These aren’t international competitors if they can only fight in Japan.

The skill level in their regional events aren’t great either. They encourage brawling because it is exciting. You have guys with more than ten fights that look like amateurs.

Meanwhile, the skill level in the regional scene of Mexico, China and Kores looks awesome across the board

 

[You Will Vote For Dreyga]

Automatic titleshot for Horigochi please

 

[NoSmilez]

Meanwhile, the skill level in the regional scene of Mexico, China and Kores looks awesome across the board

These aren't countries that are big on MMA. They didn't pioneer anything in the sport of MMA. They are trying to get into the game.

Mexico produces how many contenders and champions in the UFC? They come to America to cross train and they bring the knowledge back for the next crop of MMA fighters. Their regional fighters are definitely competitive with the amateur scene in America. Those folks from Mexico, China and Korea train overseas and they don't go back to fight in their native countries.

 

[pankrat]

These aren't countries that are big on MMA. They didn't pioneer anything in the sport of MMA. They are trying to get into the game.

Mexico produces how many contenders and champions in the UFC? They come to America to cross train and they bring the knowledge back for the next crop of MMA fighters. Their regional fighters are definitely competitive with the amateur scene in America. Those folks from Mexico, China and Korea train overseas and they don't go back to fight in their native countries.

What nations outside of the top3 plus recently UK is at a higher level than Japan, particularly in lighter weightclasses? In terms of international top talent and native promotions

If your point is that Japan is not at the level of USA, Brazil and even better tham Russia as it was 20 years ago, I dont think there is debate there. Of course it isnt.
Its still better than it was 10 years ago and still arguably better than any nation outside of those aforementioned. And their regional circuit is not "dying", at all. More on the contrary

BTW, a regional Japanese FW (not that standout at that) easily dispatched an standout regional Mexican FW in PFL this year. Yeah, most likely the Japanese comes back to fight in a recognizable native promotion and the Mexican no idea what he is gonna do but not sure how thats a testament of JMMA dying

 

[NoSmilez]

What nations outside of the top3 plus recently UK is at a higher level than Japan, particularly in lighter weightclasses? In terms of international top talent and native promotions

If your point is that Japan is not at the level of USA, Brazil and even better tham Russia as it was 20 years ago, I dont think there is debate there. Of course it isnt.
Its still better than it was 10 years ago and still arguably better than any nation outside of those aforementioned. And their regional circuit is not "dying", at all. More on the contrary

BTW, a regional Japanese FW (not that standout at that) easily dispatched an standout regional Mexican FW in PFL this year. Yeah, most likely the Japanese comes back to fight in a recognizable native promotion and the Mexican no idea what he is gonna do but not sure how thats a testament of JMMA dying

Bro he beat a guy who didn't make it on Contender's Series then lost his next few fights in the PFL.

 

[pankrat]

Bro he beat a guy who didn't make it on Contender's Series then lost his next few fights in the PFL.

Cool. I was replying to a particular point from you.
You deliver nothing to support your "JMMA is dying" outside of vaguely bringing up Mexico, China or Korea...
Dont even sound convinced yourself lol, not sure what you are asking for

 

[NoSmilez]

Cool. I was replying to a particular point from you.
You deliver nothing to support your "JMMA is dying" outside of vaguely bringing up Mexico, China or Korea...
Dont even sound convinced yourself lol, not sure what you are asking for

I am not sure what point you are making. You picked one guy who is pretty much a failure in the PFL to prove JMMA is well and alive. lol this is going nowhere.

 

[pankrat]

I am not sure what point you are making. You picked one guy who is pretty much a failure in the PFL to prove JMMA is well and alive. lol this is going nowhere.

It was a reply to this lame attempt to prove your point about JMMA dying:

. Their regional fighters are definitely competitive with the amateur scene in America. Those folks from Mexico, China and Korea train overseas and they don't go back to fight in their native countries.

Keep pretending dude. You are going nowhere indeed