Krav maga
- Thread starter Bingoking
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It's mma with headbutts and groin kicks, so it's the best for self defense.
You also learn how to use your environment. I used months ago in a bar fight, it worked well.
You also learn how to use your environment. I used months ago in a bar fight, it worked well.
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REAL Krav is great for ESCAPING. That is what it is intended for. Keeping you alive.
FAKE Krav is MMA with headbutts and groin kicks. Not as good for keeping you alive as the real version.
FAKE Krav is MMA with headbutts and groin kicks. Not as good for keeping you alive as the real version.
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The principles of Krav Maga are great when it comes to self defense. It is a cohesive system that borrows from other disciplines (Wing Chun, Boxing, Muay Thai, Kali). But the bad part of training everything in one place is that you are not going to be extremely good in any one area.
I would recommend supplementing it with specialized martial arts to get the most out of it.
I would recommend supplementing it with specialized martial arts to get the most out of it.
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Most Krav places in America are more likely to just be TMA junk places where the guys have Israeli and para military fetishes instead of being weaboos.
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There isn't much consistency in Krav Maga from on place to another. some are like MMA with full contact sparring other's just have people kick and punch air with some silly weapon disarms.
It would be like if you went studied a foreign language and instead of learning grammar and vocabulary you learned simple words and phrases and never practiced having a full conversation with a partner. Also each week the language you study changes, so one week is French and the next is Spanish. Krav maga is kind of like that.
It would be like if you went studied a foreign language and instead of learning grammar and vocabulary you learned simple words and phrases and never practiced having a full conversation with a partner. Also each week the language you study changes, so one week is French and the next is Spanish. Krav maga is kind of like that.
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Krav maga is horrible. They dont use the shoulder roll at all. And they cant defend against a submission attack from demian maia, or stop a takedown from khabib.
LOL !!! That's exactly the anti krav-maga arguments here
So as other styles, there are crappy Krav-Maga gyms. The main argument anti-Krav Maga is " There is not enough sparring, not enough opposition situation" ( it
concerns self-defense in general ). That's not true in many gyms. The fact is, KM is not a professional sport. If you compare with a professionnal boxer, grappler, mma fighter, that's non sense. I dont' think that a man in a boxing gym, going there during 2 years 2X a week, is more prepared to conflict than a KM practitionner with 2 years 2X a week.
I don't know any KM Teachers who claim that you ll be stronger than Nurmagomedov...
concerns self-defense in general ). That's not true in many gyms. The fact is, KM is not a professional sport. If you compare with a professionnal boxer, grappler, mma fighter, that's non sense. I dont' think that a man in a boxing gym, going there during 2 years 2X a week, is more prepared to conflict than a KM practitionner with 2 years 2X a week.
I don't know any KM Teachers who claim that you ll be stronger than Nurmagomedov...
There are so many things wrong with Krav Maga.
-There is no/not enough sparring.
-"This is not a sport" and "there are no rules" arguments are used for not sparring properly. Or learning good technique.
- Training with lights off, loud music and shouting is used for "stress drilling" or "real life simulation". Imagine spending time with this BS instead of sparring
- It assumes "untrained attacker". Why would I train years and years to prepare against an untrained attacker? 6 months-1 year should be enough. If I'm training long term, I want constant progress and to be good at something.
- It assumes "untrained attacker". When you go to an MMA gym you get tapped out by 6 months BJJ whitebelts and get slapped around by 50kg girls in boxing/muay thai (Not Khabib or Damian Maia)
- There is a loose curriculum at best. Only some basic stuff is shown consistently. The rest is entirely up to the particular instructor and whatever background they have (wrestling, boxing, karate etc.)
- You waste lots of time with stuff like 3rd party defense and weapon disarms (which you'll never pull off in real life as an average citizen)
- Last but not least, you learn a bit of everything but don't get good at anything. This is more significant than people realize. If you don't have a decent jab-cross, or a takedown, or a double-leg defense, or a mount escape that you can consistently apply against a resisting opponent after 1 year of training, then you don't have any self defense.
It might be a good system in theory but from a training perspective it's not effective and I just don't think it can consistently deliver the results it claims.
-There is no/not enough sparring.
-"This is not a sport" and "there are no rules" arguments are used for not sparring properly. Or learning good technique.
- Training with lights off, loud music and shouting is used for "stress drilling" or "real life simulation". Imagine spending time with this BS instead of sparring
- It assumes "untrained attacker". Why would I train years and years to prepare against an untrained attacker? 6 months-1 year should be enough. If I'm training long term, I want constant progress and to be good at something.
- It assumes "untrained attacker". When you go to an MMA gym you get tapped out by 6 months BJJ whitebelts and get slapped around by 50kg girls in boxing/muay thai (Not Khabib or Damian Maia)
- There is a loose curriculum at best. Only some basic stuff is shown consistently. The rest is entirely up to the particular instructor and whatever background they have (wrestling, boxing, karate etc.)
- You waste lots of time with stuff like 3rd party defense and weapon disarms (which you'll never pull off in real life as an average citizen)
- Last but not least, you learn a bit of everything but don't get good at anything. This is more significant than people realize. If you don't have a decent jab-cross, or a takedown, or a double-leg defense, or a mount escape that you can consistently apply against a resisting opponent after 1 year of training, then you don't have any self defense.
It might be a good system in theory but from a training perspective it's not effective and I just don't think it can consistently deliver the results it claims.
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Look, if you reach back to KM's roots - it was developed by a Jew to save his ass from Nazis. NOT TO FIGHT THEM WITH HIS BARE HANDS!
You get jumped by a Nazi, you kick him where it hurts and RUN LIKE THE WIND!!!
That's the whole damn point of SELF DEFENSE!
Lichtenfeld was a boxer and wrestler but he wasn't a RETARD - he understood that his main goal should be STAYING ALIVE. To be safe around people who want you dead or captured you need amazing SITUATIONAL AWARENESS, excellent VERBAL DEESCALATION skills, outstanding STRESS RESISTANCE and a PROPER MINDSET: "strike and run!"
So in street-defense situations, DON'T BE A RETARD and evacuate your sorry ass as soon as you can!
"Deadly fighting skillz" and "MMA sparring experience" go out the window against a dozen armed bastards.
You get jumped by a Nazi, you kick him where it hurts and RUN LIKE THE WIND!!!
That's the whole damn point of SELF DEFENSE!
Lichtenfeld was a boxer and wrestler but he wasn't a RETARD - he understood that his main goal should be STAYING ALIVE. To be safe around people who want you dead or captured you need amazing SITUATIONAL AWARENESS, excellent VERBAL DEESCALATION skills, outstanding STRESS RESISTANCE and a PROPER MINDSET: "strike and run!"
So in street-defense situations, DON'T BE A RETARD and evacuate your sorry ass as soon as you can!
"Deadly fighting skillz" and "MMA sparring experience" go out the window against a dozen armed bastards.
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Also, read this:
http://www.wimsblog.com/2013/04/self-defense-tips-for-men/
No matter if you train KM, MMA, TMA or jogging - the above advice might save your life. READ IT!
http://www.wimsblog.com/2013/04/self-defense-tips-for-men/
No matter if you train KM, MMA, TMA or jogging - the above advice might save your life. READ IT!
Wouldn't know about dozen armed bastards. Don't think if someone who trained krav maga for a couple years can stand his own in a simple traffic rage situation. If you want outstanding stress resistance you have to feel that shoulder pressure on your face, you have to get roughed up a bit in sparring. Otherwise the mindset you get is pure ego which will get you hurt.
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very good read and very true, thanks dawg!
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Krav Maga is great for someone who wants to learn some self protection tools and is not interested in fighting or becoming a fighter, as long as it's at a legit school.
Unfortunately there are many crappy Krav Maga places with non legit instructors, and the fees tend to be higher than for some other martial arts.
If you find a place that trains like this you can't go wrong:
Unfortunately there are many crappy Krav Maga places with non legit instructors, and the fees tend to be higher than for some other martial arts.
If you find a place that trains like this you can't go wrong:
Funny quick story my lady reminded me of last night.
I served as security staff in an inner city shelter. The kind of place that has constant physical threat and violence against staff and clients. I'm still as jumpy as a long tail cat at any sudden sound or commotion from it...Call it heightened situational awareness. Anyway...
Last night we were checking out this fire dancer dude who actually had some good bow staff moves. Of course we were like "WTF happens if he catches on fire" Same as everyone thinks. Well she brings up that we'd been in the same situation a few years ago with a female fire dancer who had a couple of spotters. She literally caught on fire and I'm in the crowd repeating like I'm on Walkie Coms with my squad "She's on fire, she's on fire" 30 seconds before her spotters saw it...
Point is and this came up in a "should I train self defense" thread somewhere here. It's the environmental awareness that you need to drill. You can't be ready for emergency unless you are conditioned to recognize it without thinking.
Another case, a long time homeless guy almost died on scene. He looked like he went to sleep and was cardiac terminal I'd been on my rounds and subconsciously saw him there the first time around, second It was automatic to the medi crew alarm and administer first aid he ended up by passing a week later.
I'll post some VE's sometime cause we had to neutralize them on a daily basis. I can hear escalation from across a crowded club now and point it out while security is still flat footed. That's the kind of skill that keeps you out of trouble or able to process the adrenaline dump when assaulted, not punching pads or rolling around on a carefully padded floor.
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I mentioned the correct mindset. Pure ego will get you in trouble, you are 100% correct. So the stress resistance I'm talking about is exactly NOT letting your ego take over, remaining calm all the way. A traffic rage situation shouldn't even happen to someone who has the right mindset - he won't be a part of it or won't let it escalate.
Let me quote from the link I posted earlier:
http://www.wimsblog.com/2013/04/self-defense-tips-for-men/
A large portion of violent incidents can be avoided by simply getting over yourself, by not letting your ego or sense of entitlement make the decisions. Yes, it is your right to be loud and boisterous in a biker bar. But it’s not a smart move is it? It is absolutely your right to give that guy who cuts in line a piece of your mind; free speech and all that. But calling him a “shit-for-brains retard” is probably not going to do much to defuse the situation. And so on.
In so many cases, men let their testosterone take over and shoot from the hip instead of taking a step back. In part, this is because of how our brains are wired. But that doesn’t mean you have to accept this as an unchangeable fact of life. You can change your knee-jerk responses but only if you really want to. It takes a lot of trial and error, effort, time and determination, but it can most certainly be done. All it really takes is the conscious decision to get over yourself and then stick to it. Or to put it into a practical context:
Whenever you think “It’s my goddamned right to…” right before you do or say something, pause for a second and consider if it’s worth bleeding or dying over. If not, maybe you shouldn’t take it to that next level.
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That last sentence sums it up perfectly, thank you very much for the post! Some of my own experience:
I used to live in a rather dangerous neighborhood, really close to the local soccer stadium. All the ground floor windows along my street had metal bars on them - and for good reasons too, the place was swarmed with thugs / hooligans after every game and they'd kick bins, smash cars and even beat random ppl up. I was coming home late at night once (something I shouldn't have done in the first place) and got jumped by them. They stole my mobile phone but thanks to keeping calm and verbal deescalation they let me off easy. I did not get beat up and even kept my wallet with my credit cards, id etc. Fighting them would be idiotic - I was alone, I was surrounded and outnumbered. The outcome would have been much worse.
I started Karate around the time to learn how to defend myself but quickly realized, Karate-trained or not, I'd still be fucked if the same situation happened again. So I focused on awareness and avoidance. I would be extra careful on game nights, have buddies with me most of the time and take a taxi home if it was late (if I could afford it). A few months later the stage was set for the same occurrence as before - but it didn't go that way for a number of reasons. First of all, I was much more aware of the danger and my surroundings so I spotted the group of hooligans early and had time to think and react. Second, I had a better understanding of who I was dealing with and how they would behave. As they were closing in, I noticed the local team insignia on their clothes. I knew who the team beat that night so immediately I shouted the team slogan and something along "we fucked up *opponent team name* yeah!". Their knee-jerk reaction was to repeat the slogan and instantly I turned from would-be-victim to ally. We all briefly celebrated, I got a pat on the back and was on my way.
Note that in both cases FIGHTING would have been a bad choice, even if I was a blend of Fedor and Machida. First of all, I could have been stabbed (not uncommon). Second, even if I was the victor I'd probably get hurt anyway. Third, the laws in Poland are such that ppl with martial arts experience face criminal charges if they are involved in a fight and the guy who got hurt files a court case - even if it was in self-defense! Lose-lose-lose situation.
