Defense to darce choke?

[Matt Crush]

Getting back into BJJ with the gi after a looong break, was doing mma and kickboxing, I went to an open mat and was able to hang but I identified one weakness, the d'arce choke which wasn't around back in my time, neither was the arm in guillotine.

What do I need to know to first start defending it, and then start using it

 

[ngarauru]

look up, hand fight

 

[MrNN]

and try to get on your knees

 

[Cappy Goodtime]

What does getting on your knees do? If I have a locked darce and someone gets to their knees, I just roll them over me.

 

[selfcritical]

Makes it easier to handfight and make space between your shoulder and neck, because you have base and the ability to build posture

 

[Gl0kta]

Watch the space between your top arm and your side. It's normally the arm straying that facilitates the choke.

Pushing rather then framing is a regular culprit as a push can easily be collapsed by changing direction opening up the space needed for the choke.

If the choking arms being threaded early you can clamp your top arm to your side to prevent it progressing, late you can stick your top arm between your legs taking the shoulder off your neck.

If the chokes fully locked in the highest % escape is devine intervention.

 

[EndlessCritic]

Honestly, it's really simple but it works:

Image from Neil Seery vs Louis Smolka. Smolka is going for a d'arce with Seery's left arm trapped inside. Seery defends by simply pushing on Smolka's left elbow with his right hand. I've personally had a lot of success with this.

 

[BCNASH]

Honestly, it's really simple but it works:

Image from Neil Seery vs Louis Smolka. Smolka is going for a d'arce with Seery's left arm trapped inside. Seery defends by simply pushing on Smolka's left elbow with his right hand. I've personally had a lot of success with this.

Wow, I cannot believe I have never accidentally stumbled onto that. It's sooo simple!

 

[rmongler]

Honestly, it's really simple but it works:

Image from Neil Seery vs Louis Smolka. Smolka is going for a d'arce with Seery's left arm trapped inside. Seery defends by simply pushing on Smolka's left elbow with his right hand. I've personally had a lot of success with this.

There are a lot of bad positions in grappling that can be escaped by pushing elbows in some way.

 

[JosephDredd]

Honestly, it's really simple but it works:

Image from Neil Seery vs Louis Smolka. Smolka is going for a d'arce with Seery's left arm trapped inside. Seery defends by simply pushing on Smolka's left elbow with his right hand. I've personally had a lot of success with this.

Amazing. I love the simple solutions

 

[whooty]

The elbow push works wonderfully, what helps when fighting someone who has strong grips is putting your fist in your hand and force your shoulders wide. In adition try to stretch your neck as straight as possible and it should at the very least make sure you don't get choked. From there fight the grip/elbows.

 

[randomg1t]

i've found that rolling to my stomach and flattening my shoulders to the mat often gives me enough space to not get finished. but you do find yourself in a shitty position and have to defend mount and backtakes, so it's a last resort sort of thing. still better than tapping, though.

that elbow push seems pretty sweet, need to try that one, too.

the thing is though, if whoever is darcing you is good with their grips and switching between darce, anaconda, and guillotine, anything you do will only sink you deeper into their next choke. so you're probably better off handfighting them before they manage to get anything going and keep your head in good position.

 

[ArtemV]

I remember one of my coaches told us to create a fist or push your head up and eventually you end up in bottom side control rather than in a Darce, but don't trust this.. I can't remember this escape at all

 

[mataleaos]

Honestly, it's really simple but it works:

Image from Neil Seery vs Louis Smolka. Smolka is going for a d'arce with Seery's left arm trapped inside. Seery defends by simply pushing on Smolka's left elbow with his right hand. I've personally had a lot of success with this.

Sorry for the necro. I was trying to find out what happened to Smolka and searching the forums here (I always thought he was fun to watch fight) and stumbled on this thread.

Wanted to quote you to say this defense is super legit. Jeff Glover defended one from Ryan Hall perfectly at adcc with this. Much better than just popping to the knees which opens up the Homer Simpson (marce) finish and the guard pull (darceotine) finish. Both of which are tighter than the classic top side finish. If an angle change defense is needed then going back flat to the mat is the best one. Assuming they don't know the step-over/mounted finish and that you can get your back flat before they step over.

Big advocate of this locking elbow-push defense. It also works even better for the anaconda choke because the locking elbow will be more in your workspace (in front of your face) than behind your head.

 

[EndlessCritic]

Sorry for the necro. I was trying to find out what happened to Smolka and searching the forums here (I always thought he was fun to watch fight) and stumbled on this thread.

Wanted to quote you to say this defense is super legit. Jeff Glover defended one from Ryan Hall perfectly at adcc with this. Much better than just popping to the knees which opens up the Homer Simpson (marce) finish and the guard pull (darceotine) finish. Both of which are tighter than the classic top side finish. If an angle change defense is needed then going back flat to the mat is the best one. Assuming they don't know the step-over/mounted finish and that you can get your back flat before they step over.

Big advocate of this locking elbow-push defense. It also works even better for the anaconda choke because the locking elbow will be more in your workspace (in front of your face) than behind your head.

Don't apologize for necro'ing my spread of valuable grappling wisdom!

But yes, it really works. Though Danny Henry still got Anaconda'd and put to sleep by Makwan Amirkhani despite pushing on the elbow:

 

[mataleaos]

Don't apologize for necro'ing my spread of valuable grappling wisdom!

But yes, it really works. Though Danny Henry still got Anaconda'd and put to sleep by Makwan Amirkhani despite pushing on the elbow:

Amirkhani is a beast with that anaconda right?

I'm sure you know this but I'm just adding on. I'll argue that getting out of any fully locked high percentage submission usually involves at least a little bit of luck or them dropping the ball. I think of submissions as positions that are just so dominant the other person has to give up. For most subs you can do the perfect defenses and still get finished most of the time.

I also think everyone by brown or black belt has 1 or 2 subs that they're super hard to get submitted with, and 1 or 2 subs that they can finish on almost everyone if they get it fully locked.

For Amirkhani the anaconda is definitely one of those. I think that's at least the 2nd one I've seen from him in the UFC.

 

[Jose Beehive]

Easy.

 

[EndlessCritic]

Easy.

I learned this in Karate when I was 5 and it's still my favorite back escape.

 

[Peteyandjia]

2 great options:


5:20
https://youtu.be/ADi3xCVmPA8



4:55

 

[mataleaos]

2 great options:


5:20



4:55

Everything Brian shows is money. Love that guy. Great defenses on there. I like some of Malachy's stuff but one of those defenses he shows at 9:10 I think is great in theory but I can think of almost no times where getting the arm across against a good brabo guy finishing from that sliding angle actually works. If they're flat on their back it's super easy to get the arm across. Or sometimes if they slide into the position sloppily. But if they're already on their side close and tight, while retracting their choking elbow, it's pretty much impossible and can make the choke even stronger if you do try to get your arm across. The option he shows at 9:40 is usually a stronger play to defend from that angle.