Social Can homeless people be fined for sleeping outside? A rural Oregon city asks the US Supreme Court

[Rob Battisti]

There are astronomical costs associated with leaving homeless people in the streets. From cleanup, to policing, to court costs, to jailing (which is housing them)...and that's on top of ineffective program costs that keep recycling methods that aren't working.

In every place that has done Hosing First, its proven to be cheaper.

I’d like to see that.

If you provide housing for 2500 people for a year and include meals, you’re looking at $100,000,000 minimum. I’d like to see something that proves leaving those people without services is more expensive.

 

[Limbo Pete]

There are astronomical costs associated with leaving homeless people in the streets. From cleanup, to policing, to court costs, to jailing (which is housing them)...and that's on top of ineffective program costs that keep recycling methods that aren't working.

In every place that has done Hosing First, its proven to be cheaper.

I have one specific anecdote from my own personal life in which an acquaintance -mentally ill, long time homeless- was essentially able to get a case worker that was in charge of his money, and she paid his bills for him and he was able to keep himself in assisted housing pretty much without issue until he died. During the day he would wander around, collecting cans, etc, and then had somewhere off the street to sleep at night. His rent was always paid because he had someone in charge of his SS that took care of it. She would also come by periodically with things he needed that she would buy with his money (basic household stuff like TP, whatever). It was impossible for him to blow all of his money because she always had enough set aside to take care of basic needs. He also stopped getting arrested for trespassing, and all the other minor, stupid offenses that come with being a public nuisance. This is obviously a very specific example, but something like that could be useful for a LOT of people imo. Certainly not everyone, but definitely some.

 

[Sinister]

I’d offer 9 months of housing that includes a training program. You can work while in the shelter to offset the costs and eventually get on your feet.

This just suggests you've never worked with people who are addicts or who have severe PTSD from numerous things. 9 months to get clean is pretty absurd...unless you're not doing things like requiring drug tests or whatever to gatekeep continued service. Also with the cost of housing nowadays are we sure 9 months is enough to be move-in ready (as well as clean and in a GOOD rehab/therapy program)? If this is a bigger city getting an apartment is going to have a high move-in cost.

I think this idea comes from a misconception of what homeless people actually have to contend with. This channel has lots of candid stories of people who are working homeless. The basic infrastructure they lack in just getting food and storing their possessions without fear of theft, and being able to keep clean enough to work ca be staggering:

 

[avenue94]

Yeah, but if it’s city by city, you’re asking for over a hundred million dollars a year or more. It’s a lot for social spending on what society essentially deems “undesirables”.

There isn’t a big enough net benefit to allocate that funding when we haven’t yet solved so many other issues.

Thats a drop in the bucket for the federal government and most states.

 

[Sinister]

I’d like to see that.

If you provide housing for 2500 people for a year and include meals, you’re looking at $100,000,000 minimum. I’d like to see something that proves leaving those people without services is more expensive.

The Business Case for Ending Homelessness: Having a Home Improves Health, Reduces Healthcare Utilization and Costs

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Study Data Show that Housing Chronically Homeless People Saves Money, Lives

Homelessness costs taxpayers a lot of money. Take, for example, the infamous case of Murray Barr, aka “Million Dollar Murray,” a chronically homeless man in Reno, Nevada who accrued more than a million dollars in emergency room, substance abuse treatment, police, jail, ambulance, shelter and...

endhomelessness.org

Solving Homelessness And Saving Taxpayer Dollars - Invisible People

Housing homeless people could cut up to 80% of government costs and save $30,000 – $50,000 per chronically homeless person.

invisiblepeople.tv

Literally the only reason not to advocate for this is a general disdain for the less fortunate. The idea that they dont deserve it because they should suffer the fate of their own alleged misgivings. And unfortunately, they arent suffering it alone. It's more expensive for the taxpayers

 

[Sara]

I wouldn't let people intending to commit crime on my property

Ok so why is public property open season?

 

[Rob Battisti]

The Business Case for Ending Homelessness: Having a Home Improves Health, Reduces Healthcare Utilization and Costs

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Study Data Show that Housing Chronically Homeless People Saves Money, Lives

Homelessness costs taxpayers a lot of money. Take, for example, the infamous case of Murray Barr, aka “Million Dollar Murray,” a chronically homeless man in Reno, Nevada who accrued more than a million dollars in emergency room, substance abuse treatment, police, jail, ambulance, shelter and...

endhomelessness.org

Solving Homelessness And Saving Taxpayer Dollars - Invisible People

Housing homeless people could cut up to 80% of government costs and save $30,000 – $50,000 per chronically homeless person.

invisiblepeople.tv

Literally the only reason not to advocate for this is a general disdain for the less fortunate. The idea that they dont deserve it because they should suffer the fate of their own alleged misgivings. And unfortunately, they arent suffering it alone. It's more expensive for the taxpayers

Please scrutinize your “sources” even a little bit.

I would be hard pressed to be convinced that each homeless person constitutes a burden of 30-50k a year.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Thats a drop in the bucket for the federal government and most states.

That’s per city

 

[DoctorTaco]

I’d like to see that.

If you provide housing for 2500 people for a year and include meals, you’re looking at $100,000,000 minimum. I’d like to see something that proves leaving those people without services is more expensive.

I think you could easily hit 3300 bucks a month per person On the cost of Hospital visits and police payroll alone.

 

[avenue94]

That’s per city

How many cities do you think have a homeless population of 2500 or more do you think? You're acting like every random city and town has this problem.

Also how did you arrive at your estimate that housing and feeing 2500 people for a year costs $100 million?

 

[Limbo Pete]

I think you could easily hit 3300 bucks a month per person On the cost of Hospital visits and police payroll alone.

Yeah hospital visits have gotta be a BIG one, but i'm not sure if or how that data would even be collected.

 

[RoastBeast]

This just suggests you've never worked with people who are addicts or who have severe PTSD from numerous things. 9 months to get clean is pretty absurd...unless you're not doing things like requiring drug tests or whatever to gatekeep continued service. Also with the cost of housing nowadays are we sure 9 months is enough to be move-in ready (as well as clean and in a GOOD rehab/therapy program)? If this is a bigger city getting an apartment is going to have a high move-in cost.

I think this idea comes from a misconception of what homeless people actually have to contend with. This channel has lots of candid stories of people who are working homeless. The basic infrastructure they lack in just getting food and storing their possessions without fear of theft, and being able to keep clean enough to work ca be staggering:

Two jobs yet lives in a homeless camp.....lol

The way your mind works is just something else man.

 

[Rob Battisti]

I think you could easily hit 3300 bucks a month per person On the cost of Hospital visits and police payroll alone.

I think SOME people do who are addicted. But I’ve heard it argued here that drugs only impact a small percentage of homeless.

 

[Sinister]

Ok so why is public property open season?

Do I need to explain the difference between private and public property?

 

[Rob Battisti]

How many cities do you think have a homeless population of 2500 or more do you think? You're acting like every random city and town has this problem.

Also how did you arrive at your estimate that housing and feeing 2500 people for a year costs $100 million?

$130/day for food and shelter. How much would you think that would cost? That doesn’t even cover training.

 

[Sinister]

Please scrutinize your “sources” even a little bit.

I would be hard pressed to be convinced that each homeless person constitutes a burden of 30-50k a year.

Uh, buddy I hate to break the news to you but earlier you stated that 2500 people would cost $100,000,000 annually

That's literally $40k per person.

 

[Sinister]

Two jobs yet lives in a homeless camp.....lol

The way your mind works is just something else man.

Not sure what working homeless has to do with my mind, but ok. You ever been homeless?

 

[Rob Battisti]

Looks like estimates for Texas alone are 56-85k homeless which feels high.

Let’s consider “chronically homeless” and guess at 45k.

That would be 2 billion a year minimum for Texas alone. That would be about 1.5% of the annual budget for Texas. I suppose that could be doable.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Uh, buddy I hate to break the news to you but earlier you stated that 2500 people would cost $100,000,000 annually

That's literally $40k per person.

Yeah, that’s why I said it’s unpalatable. It’s cheaper to not do anything.

 

[avenue94]

$130/day for food and shelter. How much would you think that would cost? That doesn’t even cover training.

How did you arrive at those estimates? You're quoting me a cost approaching annual tuition for private colleges.