Social Biden considers accepting Palestinian refugees

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

Nice fan fiction. The reality is that Gaza is in rubble, Hamas is running scared, and Israel will never allow Palestine to govern themselves ever again. It is cute that you think all of this lip service Liberal minded nations are giving the press, is actually going to amount to anything, once all is said and done. Like they're gonna turn their backs on Israel for some terrorist nation that offers them nothing. LOL.

And please, just drop the whole "Defeating your enemies only creates more of them" desperate talking point. Last I checked, Nazis didn't rise back up after WW2, and the Japanese aren't kamakazeeing themselves into the Empire State Building for revenge over having a couple of NUKES dropped on them. Sometimes the losers just lose. Save the fairy tales for your children.

So you think th war on terror has been a success?

 

[avenue94]

Nice fan fiction. The reality is that Gaza is in rubble, Hamas is running scared, and Israel will never allow Palestine to govern themselves ever again.

Like I said, a strategic failure. Hamas will return, if not even more extreme offshoots. You can't stamp out terrorism by trying to turn an entire area, civilian or not, into a parking lot. History is chock full of failed attempts at this.

Like they're gonna turn their backs on Israel for some terrorist nation that offers them nothing. LOL.

Palestine doesn't offer much. It's psuedo allies do, however. Bibi's rhetoric speaks for itself, there's a real worry in Israel of what pariah status will cost the country going forward.

Last I checked, Nazis didn't rise back up after WW2, and the Japanese aren't kamakazeeing themselves into the Empire State Building for revenge over having a couple of NUKES dropped on them.

Yes, because the occupying countries were able to rekindle civil society and transition to stable democracies afterwar. I'll add that the MacArthur purposefully kept the emperor as a figurehead in order to avoid popular backlash. The literal opposite of Israel's approach with Hamas at this point.

Note how Israel has done its best to ensure civil society is shredded in Palestine and has been doing so for decades. That's how you end up with popular terrorist groups: because you reduced the less violent and less extremist options and spent decades jailing intellectuals and moderates and then occupy the region. Again, the opposite of Germany and Japan after WWII.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

Red meat for the extra stupid portion of his base

Those are the ones that won him the election in 2020.

 

[HereticBD]

So you think th war on terror has been a success?

This is not some sprawling region like Afghanistan, where folks just hide out in the mountains waiting for the baddies to leave. It's not gonna be "Hamasland" after it's over. It will be Palisrael. They're not going anywhere, that would allow a power vacuum that we saw in Iraq to occur. This isn't like America taking a shit in another country and then leaving. They're right beside them. If Iraq was right beside America, it would now be called "New Iraq" and have a major league Baseball team.

 

[HereticBD]

Like I said, a strategic failure. Hamas will return, if not even more extreme offshoots. You can't stamp out terrorism by trying to turn an entire area, civilian or not, into a parking lot. History is chock full of failed attempts at this.

Like I said above, this isn't Afghanistan or Iraq. How is Hamas gonna rise up again, with Israel controlling that tiny region?

That isn't what's going to happen. That is what you are wishing will happen. What's going to happen, is Israel taking Palestine, officially or unofficially and the population getting with the program, or getting arrested, killed, or both if they don't.

This is a siege. Not one of America's "freedom tours".

 

[Mike Hagger]

Yes, because the occupying countries were able to rekindle civil society and transition to stable democracies afterwar. I'll add that the MacArthur purposefully kept the emperor as a figurehead in order to avoid popular backlash. The literal opposite of Israel's approach with Hamas at this point.

I just don’t think you can compare germany or Japan to Palestine. Palestine as a resource brings nothing to the world at large. Their population is very poorly educated and its people subscribe to a religious extremism that precludes rational thought. For those problems there is actually no solution. So Israel’s approach really could not reflect at all the allies post WW2. Maybe if decided to really commit at absolutely break Hamas will, and its citizens simultaneously until they surrendered unconditionally than maybe a resolution could be had. But obviously the world doesn’t support even 1 dead Palestinian let alone a few hundred thousand more.

 

[HockeyBjj]

What if I told you these Palestinians hate America and celebrated the destruction of the WTC on 9/11?

That was 25 years ago, and I didn’t think Palestine had much to do with Saudi Arabia? The Saudis sure aren’t helping Hamas with the war they started.

 

[Loiosh]

I'm old enough to remember when Biden abandoned thousands of our Afghan interpreters along with their wives and children to be viciously slaughtered by the Taliban.

And here he is wanting to literally import Hamas terrorists.

You're remembering it wrong.

What happened was the GOP blocked visas for the interpreters, their wives and children.

Also, they were blocked by Trump's travel bans.

 

[avenue94]

Like I said above, this isn't Afghanistan or Iraq. How is Hamas gonna rise up again, with Israel controlling that tiny region?

The same way Palestinians, Lebanese and myriad other populations rose up. There's no endgame here where an Israeli occupation with boots on the ground ends well for them strategically. What historical occupations lead you to think a siege and occupation are viable strategies in Palestine?

What's going to happen, is Israel taking Palestine, officially or unofficially and the population getting with the program, or getting arrested, killed, or both if they don't.

So again. Paths that are strategic dead ends.

Palestine as a resource brings nothing to the world at large. Their population is very poorly educated and its people subscribe to a religious extremism that precludes rational thought.

Pretty much what the world said about the Irish, or the Vietnamese, or Filipinos. All groups the US has successfully integrated and benefitted from.

But obviously the world doesn’t support even 1 dead Palestinian let alone a few hundred thousand more.

The world supports many dead Palestinians and it has for decades. But there's a night and day difference between that and what is happening currently and during the last decade of Israeli operations to mow the lawn.

 

[Brigfa2]

In your face democrat jews

 

[HereticBD]

So again. Paths that are strategic dead ends.

No. You just want it to be that way. It doesn't even enter your mind that these shit heel Hamas terrorists can be conquered, and their land can be transformed. To which I ask, why? Palestine is a pimple on the ass of the Earth. They have no allies to lean on. When they fuck up, which they did, their entire nation is blown to hell, and not one nation gives a flying fuck enough to actually help them, and not just make pretty speeches at the UN.

You have no idea what your talking about. You just throw out vague desperate talking points like "strategically speaking, this is bad 'cause I say so", as if you're a war general. You're just another desperate Leftist trying to make your wishes come true.

I tell you what, though, talk to me in five years about the great Hamas resurgence in Israel controlled Palestine that won't be occurring. Then again, you will have long forgotten about this, and will be using this same energy to rant about some restaurant chain not having unisex bathrooms or some shit.

 

[avenue94]

No. You just want it to be that way. It doesn't even enter your mind that these shit heel Hamas terrorists can be conquered, and their land can be transformed. To

Odd how you are ducking the question. What are some historical instances where a nationalist movement of Palestine's scale was stamped out violently and successfully?

You have no idea what your talking about. You just throw out vague desperate talking points like "strategically speaking, this is bad 'cause I say so", as if you're a war general. You're just another desperate Leftist trying to make your wishes come true.

Israel has repeatedly tried occupying Gaza and Lebanon, all of which ended in dismal strategic failures, the kinds that led to today's situation. There is no reason to think this attempt will be more successful, and plenty of indications that it will be even less successful.

I tell you what, though, talk to me in five years about the great Hamas resurgence in Israel controlled Palestine that won't be occurring. Then again, you will have long forgotten about this, and will be using this same energy to rant about some restaurant chain not having unisex bathrooms or some shit.

It's telling that you don't want to answer specific questions about this issue and would rather toss out strawmen that have nothing to do with it.

 

[HereticBD]

Odd how you are ducking the question. What are some historical instances where a nationalist movement of Palestine's scale was stamped out violently and successfully?

It shouldn't need answering, unless you're unaware of the many instances where nations(ultra nationalistic or whatever the fuck title you want to give them, to make them seem strong) have been conquered throughout the history of time. You think little Palestine is gonna be resilient enough to ward off a super power, backed by another super power, with no allies backing them up? They're already buried in rubble, dude. What exactly do you think is gonna happen when the bombs stop dropping? Israel will be the ones re-building it. Not your little terrorist buddies.

Again, this is simply you wishing things to be true. Quit jerking off to college protests, like they mean anything.

 

[Siver!]

It shouldn't need answering, unless you're unaware of the many instances where nations(ultra nationalistic or whatever the fuck title you want to give them, to make them seem strong) have been conquered throughout the history of time. You think little Palestine is gonna be resilient enough to ward off a super power, backed by another super power, with no allies backing them up? They're already buried in rubble, dude. What exactly do you think is gonna happen when the bombs stop dropping? Israel will be the ones re-building it. Not your little terrorist buddies.

Again, this is simply you wishing things to be true. Quit jerking off to college protests, like they mean anything.

Hmm.

If I understand you right, you're thinking that if Israel occupies a still-populated Palestine, that will be a good solution?

That sounds a little bit like the fairytale Russians were telling themselves at the start of their idiotic invasion of Ukraine.

All that will happen is whoever is occupying will get smithereened by car bombs and the like.

Russia already has a lineage of dead 'leaders' in Ukraine already, and it will continue long after the war is over if Russia are stupid enough to occupy enemy territory and claim it as their own.

 

[avenue94]

It shouldn't need answering, unless you're unaware of the many instances where nations(ultra nationalistic or whatever the fuck title you want to give them, to make them seem strong) have been conquered throughout the history of time.

1900-present. What are successful instances where a national liberation/anti-colonial movement as large as Palestine was suppressed and permanently halted through military force and occupation?

You think little Palestine is gonna be resilient enough to ward off a super power, backed by another super power, with no allies backing them up?

I think they have better or similar chances than the Irish nationalist movement did of warding off a super power (UK) backed by another super power (US). Do you disagree? Oddly enough, both the Irish nationalist movement and Palestinian movement have similar sponsors.

They're already buried in rubble, dude. What exactly do you think is gonna happen when the bombs stop dropping?

And their kids and relatives who know how even more reason to hate Israel? I think when the bombs stop the chances of moderate Palestinian groups gaining power are even less than what they were before this latest round of conflict. I think we'll see the same thing we've seen as a result of Israel's decades-long attempt to stamp out resistance and expand their state. More violence and even more unpopularity domestically, in the Palestinian territories, and internationally.

Quit jerking off to college protests, like they mean anything.

I've never once mentioned college protests. Again, that you keep spazzing out and reaching for random topics I haven't even touched on illustrates how poor your grasp history -- Palestinian or otherwise -- truly is.

 

[avenue94]

Hmm.

If I understand you right, you're thinking that if Israel occupies a still-populated Palestine, that will be a good solution?

That sounds a little bit like the fairytale Russians were telling themselves at the start of their idiotic invasion of Ukraine.

All that will happen is whoever is occupying will get smithereened by car bombs and the like.

Russia already has a lineage of dead 'leaders' in Ukraine already, and it will continue long after the war is over if Russia are stupid enough to occupy enemy territory and claim it as their own.

The partisan blinders are so strong that he keeps insisting that and Israeli occupation of Gaza will lead to peace as if Israel didn't already unsuccessfully occupy various parts of the region already. That's not even touching on the international blowback Israel would receive from the multiple Arab countries it's pursuing détente with.

The two options with an occupation are Israel pulls out and finds itself in the same spot, or it de facto annexes Gaza and loses any argument that it is a democracy and really ends up a pariah.

 

[Siver!]

The partisan blinders are so strong that he keeps insisting that and Israeli occupation of Gaza will lead to peace as if Israel didn't already unsuccessfully occupy various parts of the region already. That's not even touching on the international blowback Israel would receive from the multiple Arab countries it's pursuing détente with.

The two options with an occupation are Israel pulls out and finds itself in the same spot, or it de facto annexes Gaza and loses any argument that it is a democracy and really ends up a pariah.

If we're going to be absolute dickheads about it (by that I mean brutally realistic), Israel's biggest military drawback is it's over-reliance on everyone else: nations who just don't share the same appetite for carnage.

They were always going to be held back by international pressure, and they can't go into business for themselves for very long.

Netanyahu has to tread the line just like everyone else, and his sabre-rattling is pathetic.

The options for the future of Palestine/Gaza/West Bank will be determined by countries not called Israel, and their ultranationalist nutjobs will have to deal with that in time.

 

[HereticBD]

The two options with an occupation are Israel pulls out and finds itself in the same spot, or it de facto annexes Gaza and loses any argument that it is a democracy and really ends up a pariah.

And that's where you're wrong. Nobody gives a shit about what happens to Palestine. You'll notice the aid packages are rather lacking, as opposed to a more strategic underdog ally, like Ukraine.

You guys are just mad that your fantasies are not reality. You've hitched your wagon to these little shit terrorists, like the leftist bobbleheads you are, and must lie to yourselves about a future you, for whatever pea brain reasoning you've made up in your head, wish for.

Like I said, talk to me in five years. I'm sure your Hamas buddies will rise again, and you totally won't be ignoring how stupid and wrong you were.

 

[avenue94]

If we're going to be absolute dickheads about it (by that I mean brutally realistic), Israel's biggest military drawback is it's over-reliance on everyone else: nations who just don't share the same appetite for carnage.

They were always going to be held back by international pressure, and they can't go into business for themselves for very long.

Netanyahu has to tread the line just like everyone else, and his sabre-rattling is pathetic.

The options for the future of Palestine/Gaza/West Bank will be determined by countries not called Israel, and their ultranationalist nutjobs will have to deal with that in time.

I think the biggest flaw is just Israel's overreliance on military solutions. It's too shortsighted given demographics and time are not on their side. Netanyahu is cooked and will be out of office by the end of the year for my money, but unfortunately he's moved the Overton window so much and made so many concessions to the far right.

The base flaw a lot of people in this thread have when they look at the conflict is they think the world woke up one day and Palestinians and Israelis hated each other. In reality, the situation is more akin to that described in The Sleepwalkers (runup to WW1): too many deliberate decisions from multiple actors that escalated a conflict, which means extricating the region from that mess isn't going to happen overnight.

 

[avenue94]

And that's where you're wrong. Nobody gives a shit about what happens to Palestine. You'll notice the aid packages are rather lacking, as opposed to a more strategic underdog ally, like Ukraine.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here, besides Palestine could use a lot more aid.

You guys are just mad that your fantasies are not reality. You've hitched your wagon to these little shit terrorists, like the leftist bobbleheads you are, and must lie to yourselves about a future you, for whatever pea brain reasoning you've made up in your head, wish for.

What fantasies? Again, I just see you ducking my question about historical examples that suggest an Israeli occupation would turn out well, but it's just crickets from your ignorant ass.

Like I said, talk to me in five years. I'm sure your Hamas buddies will rise again, and you totally won't be ignoring how stupid and wrong you were.

That's literally my point: Israel's approach ensures Hamas, or something worse, will rise up and violence will continue. Again, time and demographics are not on Israel's side.