"Antiglycolytic" training

[deadshot138]

One of them you're using momentum.
I just don't like KB snatches for the fact that the KB has to swing around the wrist. DB snatches are better.

The kettlebell snatch becomes effortless with enough practice. If you're smooth enough, you don't even notice the bell go around your wrist. It happens naturally throughout the rep.

 

[Fahcough]

The kettlebell snatch becomes effortless with enough practice. If you're smooth enough, you don't even notice the bell go around your wrist. It happens naturally throughout the rep.

my singles go around but doubles try to float more over the top. After28kg. All the practice and when weight gets heavy your form starts drifting from what got you there.

 

[deadshot138]

They are trying to do everything to cater to people that don't want to just do some Z2 LSS work.

The whole idea is explosive movements done with full recovery, but keeping your overall heart rate around that easy LSS zone. They do recommend substituting with running also to cover that area. IMO people feel good because they are fully recovered and just doing less random work. I followed minimalist programs for years and they have their place but these type of programs get you minimal results. The end result is you eventually just get better at doing that chosen exercise for those reps in that period. Great for short periods of training, but when nearly every program involves a swing protocol for time, you will get good at swinging a kettlebell for time.

Are you saying a light jog for 30 mins would accomplish the same task as one of these axe workouts, or the KB marathons? If that's the case I'd rather do the road work. Repetitive KB movements for extreme periods of time get rough in the joints

 

[maximus__]

Are you saying a light jog for 30 mins would accomplish the same task as one of these axe workouts, or the KB marathons? If that's the case I'd rather do the road work. Repetitive KB movements for extreme periods of time get rough in the joints

I am saying a light jog (LSS Run) will actually achieve the aerobic benefits much better. The Kettlebell work will get you better at doing a specific amount of reps with an exercise for each interval or for a specific time period. After the initial adaption, you will just get better at swinging the kettlebell for example. Strongfirst does have a full system though.

My issue with these programs is they claim to do everything, but it kinda just does everything to a lesser standard. Kettlebell axe will build you aerobic system if it's already poor, it will make you stronger if you are weak and it will make your strength endurance better if it's already poor. After that initial jump it's just you getting better at doing your chosen protocol.

I am a big proponent of MAF(maffetone) style running for building aerobic capacity. They even recommend it in the program and reference trying to use swings to achieve this, why not just run 1-2x a week, do some power work and some strength work? It's a good short term generalist program, but you would get more from building the ability to run for 30-60 mins 2-3x a week, provided injuries aren't an issue for you.

Plus you get the added ability of developing an extra skill like running, as opposed to getting good at standing in one spot swinging a kettlebell.

 

[deadshot138]

I am saying a light jog (LSS Run) will actually achieve the aerobic benefits much better. The Kettlebell work will get you better at doing a specific amount of reps with an exercise for each interval or for a specific time period. After the initial adaption, you will just get better at swinging the kettlebell for example. Strongfirst does have a full system though.

My issue with these programs is they claim to do everything, but it kinda just does everything to a lesser standard. Kettlebell axe will build you aerobic system if it's already poor, it will make you stronger if you are weak and it will make your strength endurance better if it's already poor. After that initial jump it's just you getting better at doing your chosen protocol.

I am a big proponent of MAF(maffetone) style running for building aerobic capacity. They even recommend it in the program and reference trying to use swings to achieve this, why not just run 1-2x a week, do some power work and some strength work? It's a good short term generalist program, but you would get more from building the ability to run for 30-60 mins 2-3x a week, provided injuries aren't an issue for you.

Plus you get the added ability of developing an extra skill like running, as opposed to getting good at standing in one spot swinging a kettlebell.

Ok running will be my go to cardio. Moving my big ass is probably better than swinging a kettlebell around ad nauseam.

 

[maximus__]

Ok running will be my go to cardio. Moving my big ass is probably better than swinging a kettlebell around ad nauseam.

Haha it's probably not terrible for big man cardio, but running has other benefits if you are bigger, because your body will try and drop some weight. It comes down to goals and you will need heavier kettlebells(more money) to reach the same intensity as us little guys. I outgrew a 32kg pretty quick for simple and sinister and Axe and its right in that BW percentage they recommend for me.
There is nothing wrong with running/walking if you need to. If it works for ultra marathoners in race, it will work for training. The main goal is to keep your HR in the correct zone for extended periods that you can recover from.

I am pretty partial to running because it's my only actual alone time I ever get besides my work commute.

 

[deadshot138]

Haha it's probably not terrible for big man cardio, but running has other benefits if you are bigger, because your body will try and drop some weight. It comes down to goals and you will need heavier kettlebells(more money) to reach the same intensity as us little guys. I outgrew a 32kg pretty quick for simple and sinister and Axe and its right in that BW percentage they recommend for me.
There is nothing wrong with running/walking if you need to. If it works for ultra marathoners in race, it will work for training. The main goal is to keep your HR in the correct zone for extended periods that you can recover from.

I am pretty partial to running because it's my only actual alone time I ever get besides my work commute.

Do you have a heart rate monitor recommendation

 

[maximus__]

Do you have a heart rate monitor recommendation

I use my garmin instinct watch wrist sensor. It's definitely not perfect heart rate wise but I pair it with the talk test or breathing through my nose. I do all my running without music now and focus on good breathing.

If you are mouth breathing heavily, you are probably going too fast.

 

[deadshot138]

I use my garmin instinct watch wrist sensor. It's definitely not perfect heart rate wise but I pair it with the talk test or breathing through my nose. I do all my running without music now and focus on good breathing.

If you are mouth breathing heavily, you are probably going too fast.

Did a run/walk today, running two blocks and walking two blocks for a little over two miles. I need to work on that mid range running speed because my jog is slow as fuck and obviously sprinting isn't sustainable. I think that's where 400m or 200m repeats would come in handy.

 

[maximus__]

Did a run/walk today, running two blocks and walking two blocks for a little over two miles. I need to work on that mid range running speed because my job is slow as fuck and obviously sprinting isn't sustainable. I think that's where 400m or 200m repeats would come in handy.

That's awesome mate. 2 miles is good. Any reason you chose that distance? I like to use time for my runs unless I need to hit a certain distance for something.
The idea being there is some great science on cardiac adaptations around the 30 min mark. Basically the longer in that lower intensity realm, the better for building the adaptions we want for long term improvement.
If you can't do a continuous 30-60min run I personally wouldn't worry too much about sprinting yet.
Your aerobic system is the main thing that helps you recover in between these intervals. If it's not developed enough, you will have one good interval and then drop off massively.
If your aerobic system is good, the drop off is pretty small with short rests in between.

There is no reason you couldn't do another day where you say run/walk zone for 10-15 mins at the start, do some intervals in the middle and finish off with another 10-15 mins if easy run/walk.
That way you get 20 mins+ of cardiac output training, some sprint work in like you want, and then more cardio training. 1x a week would be plenty, even fortnightly depending on your training volume. I am about to head out soon and do a variation of this myself for my interval work today.

 

[deadshot138]

That's awesome mate. 2 miles is good. Any reason you chose that distance? I like to use time for my runs unless I need to hit a certain distance for something.
The idea being there is some great science on cardiac adaptations around the 30 min mark. Basically the longer in that lower intensity realm, the better for building the adaptions we want for long term improvement.
If you can't do a continuous 30-60min run I personally wouldn't worry too much about sprinting yet.
Your aerobic system is the main thing that helps you recover in between these intervals. If it's not developed enough, you will have one good interval and then drop off massively.
If your aerobic system is good, the drop off is pretty small with short rests in between.

There is no reason you couldn't do another day where you say run/walk zone for 10-15 mins at the start, do some intervals in the middle and finish off with another 10-15 mins if easy run/walk.
That way you get 20 mins+ of cardiac output training, some sprint work in like you want, and then more cardio training. 1x a week would be plenty, even fortnightly depending on your training volume. I am about to head out soon and do a variation of this myself for my interval work today.

I just pick a loop around my house and it happens to be 2 miles.

 

[maximus__]

I just pick a loop around my house and it happens to be 2 miles.

How long is 2 miles taking you for the walk/run? If you are hitting that sweet spot of 30+ mins, I reckon you are on to a winning strategy.

 

[deadshot138]

How long is 2 miles taking you for the walk/run? If you are hitting that sweet spot of 30+ mins, I reckon you are on to a winning strategy.

Last night I jogged 2.2 miles in about 30 mins, the run/walk today took about just as long.

 

[deadshot138]

How long is 2 miles taking you for the walk/run? If you are hitting that sweet spot of 30+ mins, I reckon you are on to a winning strategy.

You think the 2+ miles is a fine standalone workout for the day? I try to get something going later in the day but my legs are sore and I have no energy lol

 

[maximus__]

You think the 2+ miles is a fine standalone workout for the day? I try to get something going later in the day but my legs are sore and I have no energy lol

Yeah mate. Why wouldn't it be? It comes down to what meets your goals.
More isn't always better. If you don't make an income from your fitness, just train enough to reach whatever your goals are.

 

[deadshot138]

I use my garmin instinct watch wrist sensor. It's definitely not perfect heart rate wise but I pair it with the talk test or breathing through my nose. I do all my running without music now and focus on good breathing.

If you are mouth breathing heavily, you are probably going too fast.

Got a garmin coming. Pricier than I was expecting but seems worth it

 

[ChickenBrother]

Got a garmin coming. Pricier than I was expecting but seems worth it

It's totally worth it dude. I've been telling you to get either a Garmin or Polar HR monitor for at least 2 years on here since you've been talking about improving your run times lol. You can track HR during runs, see improvements in your resting HR etc. and the newer ones even calculate your VO2 max and track your cardio zones during runs so they tell you when you should slow down or push it harder depending on your training goals.

 

[deadshot138]

It's totally worth it dude. I've been telling you to get either a Garmin or Polar HR monitor for at least 2 years on here since you've been talking about improving your run times lol. You can track HR during runs, see improvements in your resting HR etc. and the newer ones even calculate your VO2 max and track your cardio zones during runs so they tell you when you should slow down or push it harder depending on your training goals.

Yeah it's an instinct 2 so hopefully it's got those bells and whistles. I must have missed those suggestions or was put off by the price but I'm considering it an investment at this point.

 

[maximus__]

Yeah it's an instinct 2 so hopefully it's got those bells and whistles. I must have missed those suggestions or was put off by the price but I'm considering it an investment at this point.

I have the solar one and I love it. I had the model before and everything but the band held up from the first release date.
I used it to track my HRV, Sleep and to program my runs now for warmups and intervals. I may eventually get a HR strap for it, but to be honest I just use RPE or the talk test and I reckon it's spot on for running.
Only reason I want a HR is for MMA/BJJ training. I did MMA sparring rounds last night and it's basically telling me my recovery is dead today. It would be good to have that training session tracked to see why.

 

[deadshot138]

I have the solar one and I love it. I had the model before and everything but the band held up from the first release date.
I used it to track my HRV, Sleep and to program my runs now for warmups and intervals. I may eventually get a HR strap for it, but to be honest I just use RPE or the talk test and I reckon it's spot on for running.
Only reason I want a HR is for MMA/BJJ training. I did MMA sparring rounds last night and it's basically telling me my recovery is dead today. It would be good to have that training session tracked to see why.

Damn the solar one is like $100 more than mine lol. Do they sell replacement bands?