Your reaction if Bernie wins Democratic Nomination and a Republican wins presidency?

[Forkfoot]

Voting for the Iraq war is something that everyone did because they were DUPED! Good job on Bernie for being as skeptical as he was but the Iraq war should not be some stupid 'litmus' test for how 'liberal' a candidate.

Also Clinton and basically EVERYONE in congress voted for No-Child left behind. So again you being against no child-left behind is not a litmus test for how progressive or effective a leader for president could be.

Sooo, lots of democrats voted for these bad policies, while Bernie opposed them, and this is supposed to be an argument AGAINST Bernie?

Clinton and Jeb Bush are complete polar opposites and this is something ANY informed intelligent person would know if they bothered to look at were the two have stood on n major issues.

There are some differences, but I definitely wouldn't call them "polar opposites". Hilary's a pro-choice neocon that doesn't like guns, Jeb's just a regular neocon.

 

[SouthoftheAndes]

I'm unclear what point you think you're making with all this, my angry friend.

That Gif you posted is for the most part false/lies/untrue.

Hillary did vote for the Iraq war (as did all Democrats basically).
Hillary did vote for No Child Left Behind (as did nearly all of congress)
Hillary did vote for the bailouts (as did Bernie Sanders, and Clinton and Sanders are NEARLY identical on Economic/Financial issues).
Hillary
Hillary NEVER voted on OR made a full address on the Transpacific partnership
Hillary has changed her position on the war on drugs but has always stood for reforms and fighting corruption.
Hillary is NOT an interventionist nor to the extent that Bush is
Hillary has VOTED for Wall Street Reform
Hillary DOES support Student Loan reform and just proposed an ACTUAL plan to make college easier to access/free.


My point is that Hillary and Bernie are similar in many ways but that Hillary is more concrete.

Also being in favor of (some) Charter schools is NOT a bad thing. For christ sakes its a personal choice if you want to send your kid to a charter school.

Jack I think this needs a response given the other thread.

I hope he does. He is a good poster and hopefully can dispel this myth that all a vote for Clinton=a vote for Bush.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Jack I think this needs a response given the other thread.

Not much to say. It's not accurate about a lot of her positions.

 

[SouthoftheAndes]

Sooo, lots of democrats voted for these bad policies, while Bernie opposed them, and this is supposed to be an argument AGAINST Bernie?



There are some differences, but I definitely wouldn't call them "polar opposites". Hilary's a pro-life neocon that doesn't like guns, Jeb's just a regular neocon.

Hillary is Pro-Choice. And is NOT a Neocon.

My god you are basically (almost) repeating Republican talking points. Republicans are trying to make it seem like all Democrats are the same and make it seem like Hillary is basically Bush 2.0. They are doing this in order to try and weaken the Democratic party's base and discourage people from voting for Clinton so that they vote for someone else who doesn't have a shot or vote for a 'moderate' Republican.


My main point in starting this thread is that I think Bernie Sanders has the possibility to dethrone Clinton. I believe that if Bernie takes the Democratic nomination he will get annihilated in the national election and the end result is we will have a Republican president for 4 years who will surely make a Supreme court nominee (after Ginsburg likely retires). And will make great strides in undoing a lot of what liberals and Dems in general have worked for these past few years.

 

[Forkfoot]

That Gif you posted is for the most part false/lies/untrue.

Hillary did vote for the Iraq war (as did all Democrats basically).
Hillary did vote for No Child Left Behind (as did nearly all of congress)
Hillary did vote for the bailouts (as did Bernie Sanders, and Clinton and Sanders are NEARLY identical on Economic/Financial issues).
Hillary
Hillary NEVER voted on OR made a full address on the Transpacific partnership
Hillary has changed her position on the war on drugs but has always stood for reforms and fighting corruption.
Hillary is NOT an interventionist nor to the extent that Bush is
Hillary has VOTED for Wall Street Reform
Hillary DOES support Student Loan reform and just proposed an ACTUAL plan to make college easier to access/free.

Hillary has very openly advocated for the TPP. Hillary is historically VERY interventionist; I don't know how you can claim otherwise. And I truly don't understand your repeated assertions that the fact that Bernie knew the Iraq invasion was bad news while the other Dems didn't is not a huge plus for Bernie. These are key points you're failing to address here.

 

[Gandhi]

Not much to say. It's not accurate about a lot of her positions.

I figured as much I just thought you were best equipped to dismantle it.

 

[Forkfoot]

Hillary is Pro-Choice.

I meant pro-choice.

My god you are basically (almost) repeating Republican talking points. Republicans are trying to make it seem like all Democrats are the same and make it seem like Hillary is basically Bush 2.0.

No, Obama was Bush 2.0. Hillary would be 3.0.

My main point in starting this thread is that I think Bernie Sanders has the possibility to dethrone Clinton. I believe that if Bernie takes the Democratic nomination he will get annihilated in the national election and the end result is we will have a Republican president for 4 years who will surely make a Supreme court nominee (after Ginsburg likely retires). And will make great strides in undoing a lot of what liberals and Dems in general have worked for these past few years.

I really see no reason at all to believe he can't beat the cans the GOP is throwing up right now. I just don't.

 

[japanese steel]

That's a non sequitur. The point is not that any Republican candidates will actually act physically responsible once in office, only that Bernie's plan clearly won't appeal to those who are fiscal conservatives. They look at Bernie's site and see, "I want more money and more government."

Which is fucking retarded because that is exactly what the last Repub POTUS did for 8 years. More money and more government.

How can people continue to be so stupid and naive? Both parties are all about growing their power and influence and don't give two fucks about being fiscally conservative. How can people not see this blatantly obvious truth?

I don't believe that any real fiscal conservative politicians exist in our gov. as of right now.

At least Sanders is attempting to put some money in the places it needs to go, infrastructure being a HUGE one. Our countries infrastructure is crumbling and we need to pump some money into fixing it.

 

[SouthoftheAndes]

Hillary has very openly advocated for the TPP. Hillary is historically VERY interventionist; I don't know how you can claim otherwise. And I truly don't understand your repeated assertions that the fact that Bernie knew the Iraq invasion was bad news while the other Dems didn't is not a huge plus for Bernie. These are key points you're failing to address here.

Well you should just admit that the Picture you posted is false. It deceives people and fails to address the (FACT) that Bernie and Hillary are similar economically.

Depends on how you define 'interventionist'.

https://votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/55463/hillary-clinton#.VcwPwfm6fIU

http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Hillary_Clinton.htm

"Any trade deal has to produce jobs and raise wages and increase prosperity and protect our security. We have to do our part in making sure we have the capabilities and the skills to be competitive. It's got to be really a partnership between our business, our government, our workforce, the intellectual property that comes out of our universities, and we have to get back to a much more focused effort in my opinion to try to produce those capacities here at home so that we can be competitive in a global economy."

^ Yeah she never said she supported it. Furthermore, her response was logical and displays that she feels that ANY trade deal most be at its core beneficial to the consumers, people, businesses and government. Her entire career is filled with supporting the workers.

 

[SouthoftheAndes]

I meant pro-choice.



No, Obama was Bush 2.0. Hillary would be 3.0.



I really see no reason at all to believe he can't beat the cans the GOP is throwing up right now. I just don't.

Yeah okay. That tells me everything I need to know....

You are a conspiracy theorist who is basically the leftist version of Ron Paul fans. For you folk its either your magical candidate or to hell with the world.

 

[Gandhi]

I meant pro-choice.



No, Obama was Bush 2.0. Hillary would be 3.0.



I really see no reason at all to believe he can't beat the cans the GOP is throwing up right now. I just don't.

They are all they same, that logic got us bush instead of gore and a decade of insanity. I can't believe anyone would go down this path again.

 

[Forkfoot]

Depends on how you define 'interventionist'.

Well how about this: Being non-interventionist does NOT mean hawkish advocacy of military aggression at every opportunity. Fair?

^ Yeah she never said she supported it. Furthermore, her response was logical and displays that she feels that ANY trade deal most be at its core beneficial to the consumers, people, businesses and government. Her entire career is filled with supporting the workers.

Dude the article you're quoting from has a section titled "Chief advocate for Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP)". She never had a single critical thing to say about it until Bernie started gaining momentum. Like her stance on gay marriage, Hillary just says whatever people want to hear. When those wants change, so does her tune. Bernie's been remarkably consistent throughout his career.

 

[Forkfoot]

Yeah okay. That tells me everything I need to know....

You are a conspiracy theorist who is basically the leftist version of Ron Paul fans. For you folk its either your magical candidate or to hell with the world.

We've still got troops in dozens of countries around the world, still maintain aggressively interventionist foreign policy, still fly killing machines over sovereign nations, still maintain environmental policies that are destroying the ecosystemic context in which our species evolved, still maintain the Patriot act, still tax the richest Americans very little and provide them with dozens of tax loopholes, still permit crushing poverty to pervade our country, still have children going hungry, still persist in the INSANE and unsuccessful war on drugs... What's changed, exactly? Slightly different approach to health insurance?

 

[emefer]

Hillary is Pro-Choice. And is NOT a Neocon.

My god you are basically (almost) repeating Republican talking points. Republicans are trying to make it seem like all Democrats are the same and make it seem like Hillary is basically Bush 2.0. They are doing this in order to try and weaken the Democratic party's base and discourage people from voting for Clinton so that they vote for someone else who doesn't have a shot or vote for a 'moderate' Republican.


My main point in starting this thread is that I think Bernie Sanders has the possibility to dethrone Clinton. I believe that if Bernie takes the Democratic nomination he will get annihilated in the national election and the end result is we will have a Republican president for 4 years who will surely make a Supreme court nominee (after Ginsburg likely retires). And will make great strides in undoing a lot of what liberals and Dems in general have worked for these past few years.

Not one repube can beat Bernie. He's going to bring back the Reagan democrats and inspire the return of a democratic congress and senate.

 

[Cid]

 

[PEB]

My reaction will be one of laughter and an (I told you so).

But seriously. Does anyone think this can happen? People didn't think Bush Jr could win a second term and he did.

If 2012 is any proof of the country's shift a Republican could win.

Obama won in 2008 by 9.5 million votes, 365 electoral votes and carried 28 states.

Obama won in 2012 by 4.9 million votes, 332 electoral votes, and carried 26 states (Romney carried 24).


And now look at 2014 elections (Governor, Senate, House). For all our criticism of the Republican party they are very spread throughout the country and gerrymandering has helped them a lot.


So the possibility of a Republican president in 2016 taking throne in January of 2017 is a reality.

This is not surprising given resent history except when the first Bush took office. Historically the Country has shifted parties after 8 years. That being said there is little evidence that Republican party has not shifted to far to the right not to have significant problems with the general electorate. Part of Obama's issues with the past election was Benghazi and negative press about the rise of ISIS. No doubt that weighed him down you think that Christie, Ted Cruz, Walker who all have talked about boots on the ground that is not going to pose problems for them.

Jeb Bush has not gone as far as committing troops for ground fighting where Walker stated the day of swearing in he could very possibly be ordering military action in Iraq that includes boots on the ground. I think that Donald Trump has been leading not the least of that is that he has openly talked about how he opposed the Iraq war. He continues with that message as well as Rand Paul and Rand has recently moved up in polling in Iowa and New Hampshire.

People in both parties have little if any interest in a continued massive Military presence in Iraq. I predict that unless Republican can hang the necon badge on Hillary very unlikely Bernie they will have an Iraq war problem. When 4 out of 8 leading contenders have openly talked about expanding presence in Iraq and 3 have talked about boots on the ground that poses a problem for Republicans.

Republicans are far from a slam dunk in the elections even with Bernie Sanders but I have to admit Bernie's age and lack of visibility poses huge problems. Hillary has a much stronger career at the highest levels of Government even with her Benghazi problems and the shadow of Clinton Global Initiatives looming over her head. She still has a better shot at the general then Bernie but Bernie has really tapped into a part of the Democratic party that has been out to lunch the last two election cycles.

I think a lot of Republicans underestimate the size of this group of Democrats.

 

[Sunni and Shia]

Im gonna celebrate and burn a few dozen* Barbie dolls dressed up like Billary* in celebration, drink a beer, roll up a phattie and shit.



*Baker's dozen




*Bill's body/Hillary's big head

 

[The Diplomat]

He is the Anti-Christ though. Can't compete with that.

Dumb.

 

[The Diplomat]

Yes....but Trump is exciting and get reaction of people. This guy sounds boring and old. Im sure he has great ideas and is a serious guy.....but I would take personality and charisma ahead of policies and intelligence any day of the week as a politician

Really dumb.

 

[PrinceOfPain]

For some reason HC reminds me of this annoying, nosy busy-body that lives at the top of my street and insisted on fencing the street off because it would be better for all of us, and is now whining because those of us who didn't want a stupid gate in the first place are not helping to pay for its maintenance.
Please don't vote her in.