Wrestling 14-3 in Past Two Events

[fourfif**]

would you guys allow strikes ?
thats pretty funny if so

only if there was a srs beef, otherwise no.

better off though, since one of our better wrestlers went out and won golden gloves with like 5mo training in boxing.

 

[joe90210]

without his wrestling he would have been done when it hit the ground, and also without the threat of takedowns/attempts I think it would be a different striking match altogether as well, with quite possibly a different outcome.

lol what? without his BJJ he would have been done on the ground too, don't see what's your point

 

[fourfif**]

lol what? without his BJJ he would have been done on the ground too, don't see what's your point

my point is frankie did in fact use wrestling to win that fight.

he sure as hell didn't out grapple a bjj world champ with his awesome bjjz skillz

 

[joe90210]

my point is frankie did in fact use wrestling to win that fight.

he sure as hell didn't out grapple a bjj world champ with his awesome bjjz skillz

so any use of wrestling is what you're counting as a win for wrestling in the 14-3 stat?

 

[fourfif**]

so any use of wrestling is what you're counting as a win for wrestling in the 14-3 stat?

by a wrestler, yes.

also, I am just posting a link to another thread for discussion. feel free to go to the original link and give the OP a piece of your mind.

 

[jarra22]

Wrestling rules all!!!!!

 

[joe90210]

by a wrestler, yes.

also, I am just posting a link to another thread for discussion. feel free to go to the original link and give the OP a piece of your mind.

I see a number of those won by submissions, I count those as wins for BJJ\SW

 

[Andrew Green]

Wrestling
BJJ
MMA

Three separate sports.

There is overlap, which allows people to transition from one style to another. How successful they are depends on how well they can adapt their personal style to MMA.

None of these guys can really be considered wrestlers or BJJ fighters or kickboxers anymore IMO, they might be that, but they are also MMA fighters, and that is what is winning them MMA fights.

Frankie Edgar might have been a wrestler, but he won the fight largely by punching BJ and using superior footwork.

What we are seeing is not wrestlers dominating, but guys with who have wrestling backgrounds becoming complete MMA fighters that can integrate striking with takedowns and ground control in a seamless way.

I find this whole method of classifying fighters a little strange. A guy can be a terrific boxer, but be terrible at MMA, we saw that last night. A guy can have amazing BJJ, but suck when you take the gi away and start hitting them in the face.

MMA is its own sport, the guys winning are great MMA fighters, some of them just happen to be great at other sports as well.

 

[dazed863]

my point is frankie did in fact use wrestling to win that fight.

he sure as hell didn't out grapple a bjj world champ with his awesome bjjz skillz

in the frankie and penn fight it was won in the standup. yes frankie was able to take penn down repeatably but just as easily penn was able to nullify the GNP and eventually stand right back up. i would even go so far as to say frankie had a lot harder time on the ground than penn did when he was on bottom...

the maynard florian fight lets not forget when florian was still a BJJ white belt learning how to shrimp maynard was 135

 

[fourfif**]

if anything it says a lot of BJJ when a guy can pick up the sport at 22 and do as well has florian has.

I agree with this actually. I am amazed at how well some of these BJJ guys can learn takedowns as well. Maia for example. His stand up grappling is world class, based on his fights with Miranda and Sonnen. I see it in class too.

Plus guys know how to scramble into submissions off of takedown attempts or defenses so it ads another element to their takedown game that makes them extra dangerous.

 

[fourfif**]

edit: I love wrestling, no doubt, but train in bjj and judo and respect all three arts equally. it's just a discussion about grappling that thankfully so far hasn't devolved into a style hugging vs thread. kudos, f12. if it does, I'll ask a mod to kindly dump it.

 

[platfox]

fourfiff - sorry off topic question. I saw on the 10th Planet web site that you guys have a saturday members only class. Is that for the competition team, just open mat...or to discuss the revolution.:icon_chee

Just curious, I might be in SF on a weekend next month wanted to roll while I was there. I was at the Ralph Gracie school not to long ago and it was cool, but no one wanted to do no gi. I;m sure it wasn't for any reason in particular.

I just wanted to visit a strictly no -gi school to see the differences.

Also an important question is, are you guys strict on the members only?

 

[fourfif**]

fourfiff - sorry off topic question. I saw on the 10th Planet web site that you guys have a saturday members only class. Is that for the competition team, just open mat...or to discuss the revolution.:icon_chee

Just curious, I might be in SF on a weekend next month wanted to roll while I was there. I was at the Ralph Gracie school not to long ago and it was cool, but no one wanted to do no gi. I;m sure it wasn't for any reason in particular.

I just wanted to visit a strictly no -gi school to see the differences.

Also an important question is, are you guys strict on the members only?

honestly, qtip that posts here from time to time would know better than I. But if you just called or just came by during the week and asked Denny I don't think they'd mind. that would be fresh though. you'll love the area, if you want we can grab a beer and some pupusas after practice if they give you the green light.

 

[platfox]

Thats the only problem, I don't think I'll be there on a weekday. I'll try to call instead. Thanks for the heads up, and I'll PM you if I make it through. Thanks.

 

[fourfif**]

Thats the only problem, I don't think I'll be there on a weekday. I'll try to call instead. Thanks for the heads up, and I'll PM you if I make it through. Thanks.

or email em,.... i'll pm you number and email..


aw fuck it, it's on the website.

[email protected], or call 650.784.1839

 

[Grappler111]

Wrestling is the ancient martial art with a lot of styles. Olympic styles (Greco and Freestyle = takedowns, throws and control), submission styles (Grappling No-Gi and GI, Catch Wrestling, Brazilian Wrestling...) and mixed styles like Combat Grappling, Pankration amateur and pro (russian pankration full contact without gloves...).

Wrestling rulez!

 

[SuperSuperRambo]

It's nearly impossible to claim any fight as a style victory at the point MMA is at today, where everybody is cross trained, with the exceptions of new converts like a Toney vs. Couture situation. And even that case, it was more of a MMA beating boxing, or grappling beating boxing. These guys didn't just take down BJJ black belts and score points, they avoided submissions and tried to work their own. These are wrestlers who themselves have trained in BJJ. It's not like you take a collegiate wrestling champ, take a bjj champ, and throw them in a fight with no other training. We have not learned anything new.

 

[Belatucadros]

It's nearly impossible to claim any fight as a style victory at the point MMA is at today, where everybody is cross trained, with the exceptions of new converts like a Toney vs. Couture situation. And even that case, it was more of a MMA beating boxing, or grappling beating boxing. These guys didn't just take down BJJ black belts and score points, they avoided submissions and tried to work their own. These are wrestlers who themselves have trained in BJJ. It's not like you take a collegiate wrestling champ, take a bjj champ, and throw them in a fight with no other training. We have not learned anything new.

Was hoping for somewhere to post this....

Comments Thread For: Randy Couture-James Toney Results From Boston - Boxing Forum

Looks like a choke "doesn't settle anything" lol. Because anyone can choke somebody.

Ugh. Boxing diehards.

MMA fans have debates about wrestling, judo, whatever - but we all understand that there's more to fighting than just jabbing.

 

[knoxpk]

It's nearly impossible to claim any fight as a style victory at the point MMA is at today, where everybody is cross trained, with the exceptions of new converts like a Toney vs. Couture situation. And even that case, it was more of a MMA beating boxing, or grappling beating boxing. These guys didn't just take down BJJ black belts and score points, they avoided submissions and tried to work their own. These are wrestlers who themselves have trained in BJJ. It's not like you take a collegiate wrestling champ, take a bjj champ, and throw them in a fight with no other training. We have not learned anything new.

I agree with you. However it should work both ways...This was just after the Sonnen v Silva fight. As you recall it was even more blatant after the Fedor v Werdum fight.

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f12/jiu-jitsu-reigns-again-1306283/

 

[joe90210]

I agree with you. However it should work both ways...This was just after the Sonnen v Silva fight. As you recall it was even more blatant after the Fedor v Werdum fight.

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f12/jiu-jitsu-reigns-again-1306283/

They are all definitely cross-training but the art they use to win the fight should get the credit so if they win by subs then the credit goes to BJJ\SW, by KO\TKO then it goes to boxing\MT\GnP and if they win by lay and pray or wall and stall then it's wrestling, pretty simple.