Would you leave your Academy/Gym if they promote too fast?

[Evenflow80]

As the title says, would you leave your academy if they promoted based on minimum IBJJF time standards?

I am considering leaving my academy because I don't want my purple at exactly 3 years of training. There is also no way I can request my professor to hold off on it because he will definitely get offended. For the time and effort you put into this sport, as a purple belt I want to be be able to walk into any academy on Earth and hang with other purples, but that is simply not possible simply due to the fact that the average time to get a purple belt is about 5+ years at best.

I'd like to hear people's thoughts and experiences with getting promoted too quick, and its not based on competition results or anything like that, just time training and coming in 4-5 days a week.

FYI, the academy I am thinking of switching over to is Atos HQ. Its less convienent than the one I am at right now, and it means I won't see my family 4 nights a week at all since by time I get home after night classes my youngest will be in asleep, but at least I will know for a fact that when Galvao says I am a purple belt, it will be without question that I am a purple belt and able to hang with any purple in the world (that's not a world champ or anything like that)

Thank you for your thoughts

Edit: I should clarify that not seeing my 6 year old 4 nights a week if I switch to Atos is weighing heavily on me, and its probably why I will NOT switch, but the temptation is really there and its extremely strong. Also despite my dissatisfaction with my current academy, I still do consider my teammates to be the closest friends I've ever had, so leaving them behind is extremely hard as well.

 

[Dilan Cummingsworth]

As the title says, would you leave your academy if they promoted based on minimum IBJJF time standards?

I am considering leaving my academy because I don't want my purple at exactly 3 years of training. There is also no way I can request my professor to hold off on it because he will definitely get offended. For the time and effort you put into this sport, as a purple belt I want to be be able to walk into any academy on Earth and hang with other purples, but that is simply not possible simply due to the fact that the average time to get a purple belt is about 5+ years at best.

I'd like to hear people's thoughts and experiences with getting promoted too quick, and its not based on competition results or anything like that, just time training and coming in 4-5 days a week.

FYI, the academy I am thinking of switching over to is Atos HQ. Its less convienent than the one I am at right now, and it means I won't see my family 4 nights a week at all since by time I get home after night classes my youngest will be in asleep, but at least I will know for a fact that when Galvao says I am a purple belt, it will be without question that I am a purple belt and able to hang with any purple in the world (that's not a world champ or anything like that)

Thank you for your thoughts

Edit: I should clarify that not seeing my 6 year old 4 nights a week if I switch to Atos is weighing heavily on me, and its probably why I will NOT switch, but the temptation is really there and its extremely strong.

Accept the promotion and try to stay loyal but when you sign up for competition just register as a blue belt

 

[Evenflow80]

Accept the promotion and try to stay loyal but when you sign up for competition just register as a blue belt

Thanks for the reply man, appreciate it.

I have basically 4 options:

1) Stay at current academy and stay loyal as you say. There are a ton of advantages of staying where I am, not least it allows more time with my family.

2) Move to Atos and get best instruction in the world. Not everyone is lucky enough to live in same city as such a good academy. Downside is like I said I can then only make the night classes and so won't see my 6 year old 4 nights a week as he will be asleep by time I get home.

3) Stay in current academy and try my best to work with what I have. Accept promotion to purple even though I feel strongly its not earned. However, attend open mats at Atos each Saturday to test myself against legit blues and purples. Iron sharpens iron and all that.

4) risk my marriage by joining BOTH. That is $350 a month. Attend equally each week or whenever possible, favor Atos.

 

[SUPERGRAPPLER]

Atos

 

[Evenflow80]

Atos

Sounds like a no brainer, I know, and its only $50 more a month than what I currently pay, but I do have a wife and kid so my current schedule at my academy, which is down the street from where I work and live is:

M+W+F : noon lunch time class
Thursday: night class
Saturday: open mat day

This allows me time after work with my family M, T, W, and Friday during the week. If I go to Atos there is no class that I can go to during work hours so best I can do is:

M, T, W, TH : night classes, 6:15-7:45, realistically I have to leave to go there straight from work and by time I get home it will be at least 8:30, my young son would be in bed by that point.

Its hard. If I had no kid switching to Atos would be a no brainer. Sure I can be in my 40s with a legit black belt from Galvao one day, but at the expense of missing out all these valuable moments with my kid? Where after I get my black belt I realize suddenly my kid is a teenager who doesnt want to do anything with me and I missed out on something I will never experience ever again?

I dont know, maybe I can take him with me to class, he can just watch and hopefully get into it.

 

[asian-glow]

I think this is pretty easy to solve.

You eat the insane monthly cost + price of gis/patches/rash guards and sign up for a month at Atos. You'll figure out whether the school environment and opportunity cost of seeing your son more often is worth it.

I have never met anyone who is doing what you're trying to do - that is, training that often with kids. Everyone I know falls off to focus on their kids and shows up very sporadically. There is one person I know who trains everyday and is heavily involved in the bjj scene; she gave up custody of her kid to the ex-husband. After they're a certain age, I then see people integrate their entire family into bjj. Not trying to discourage you, just giving examples from real life.

With that said I went through exactly what you did. I trained/still train at a very small school, where the average class size is 5 people. I got my brown belt in 7 years, which to some people is fast considering I don't compete. (I don't think it takes 10 years to get a black belt anymore but that's a story for another day). I explored a lot of open mats (9+). I was also a brown belt so I knew people would try to kill me. I haven't been to Atos yet but I found that the level was similar everywhere I went. I have, however, trained with (not big name) dudes from Atos and it was the same thing. I also live in San Diego.

If this is a personal insecurity, like it was for me, go to a bunch of open mats and get it out of your system. Inflate your ego by tapping out as many people as you can. Better yet, compete.

If this is a lack of faith in your instructor's judgment then try to understand that what your instructor sees and what you see may be different. You see the belt as a metric of comparison to others at that belt level - it's honestly not a bad tool for that. Your instructor probably sees it as an indication of how much of your potential he thinks you've achieved given that you have a job and two kids.

If you want to create artificial barriers for yourself, however, then just move schools. You can do it cheaper by going anywhere other than Atos. I know this because I recently trained at a different school for a month and everyone got promoted but me.

 

[lechien]

3 years to purple .
So it is like one years to blue and then purple after 2 years at blue.

I usually give 1 stripes per 6 months of training .
If you do well at a competition, I will promote to next belt because I don't like sandbagging .Well and as long as it is between the minimum time requirements.
Otherwise, you have to earn at least your third stripe before I consider you for the next belt .if I have a doubt, I will waiting until the fourth stripes.

So yeah, 3 years seems quick.

But even if he takes you 5 years to purple, you still will not match a blue belt that trains twice a day, 5 days a week ...anyway .

But if it the validation of having a famous lineage makes you feel better, why not?

 

[EGDM]

Obvious problems like even entertaining the idea of neglecting a young family for a hobby aside:

I had the same issue in reverse moving from a big competition school to a smaller gym. In terms of training time I had just got my purple belt the month before (it had been two calendar years off the mat due to injury, though), and once I got back into shape I was handily beating up on their brown belts. The next promotion cycle I got my brown belt after only 4-5 months of training time (2.5 years calendar), despite having asked the coach to wait. I felt super sketchy about that since I knew I could not hang with browns at more conservative gyms. I grew into the belt eventually, but looking forward I knew the standards were similarly lower for black belt and that was a really scary prospect.

Sadly, the complete destruction of my right knee solved the issue for me and I don't train at all.

 

[KikoJones]

What exactly is your goal?? Do you plan to compete at the elite level?
Why do you think you're not worthy of Purple? What are you basing this on? Only time in Belt??
I love BJJ but if I were going to miss seeing my kids grown up for a hobby, I'd have deeper issues than just belt promotion.
No offense intended.
I train at a relatively small academy and when I do drop ins while I travel for business, I've never had an issue holding my own against other hobbyists. I would definitely have my lunch money taken from a competitive Blue.
It's great to say you were promoted by Andre Galvao but what is that going to cost you?

 

[Cappy Goodtime]

Galvao isn't gonna know who you are. Someone is gonna check your attendance card and eventually hand him a belt to give to you. Almost no one cares about the color of old guys belts. For me, if I was going to be a dead-beat dad, it would be only for really important things -- like surfing.

 

[3879]

I vote for this option:

3) Stay in current academy and try my best to work with what I have. Accept promotion to purple even though I feel strongly its not earned. However, attend open mats at Atos each Saturday to test myself against legit blues and purples. Iron sharpens iron and all that.

Also, compete at purple.

• Why is it so important to you that you are able to hang with purples no matter where you go?

Other than not seeing your son before he goes to sleep during the week, you choosing ATOS means that your wife is going to have the sole burden of taking care of him while your at class. Guarantee she's going to be more stressed out by this fact, which will put more stress on your marriage. Have you talked to your wife about the possibility of doing this? What does she think?

 

[Evenflow80]

I think this is pretty easy to solve.

You eat the insane monthly cost + price of gis/patches/rash guards and sign up for a month at Atos. You'll figure out whether the school environment and opportunity cost of seeing your son more often is worth it.

I have never met anyone who is doing what you're trying to do - that is, training that often with kids. Everyone I know falls off to focus on their kids and shows up very sporadically. There is one person I know who trains everyday and is heavily involved in the bjj scene; she gave up custody of her kid to the ex-husband. After they're a certain age, I then see people integrate their entire family into bjj. Not trying to discourage you, just giving examples from real life.

With that said I went through exactly what you did. I trained/still train at a very small school, where the average class size is 5 people. I got my brown belt in 7 years, which to some people is fast considering I don't compete. (I don't think it takes 10 years to get a black belt anymore but that's a story for another day). I explored a lot of open mats (9+). I was also a brown belt so I knew people would try to kill me. I haven't been to Atos yet but I found that the level was similar everywhere I went. I have, however, trained with (not big name) dudes from Atos and it was the same thing. I also live in San Diego.

If this is a personal insecurity, like it was for me, go to a bunch of open mats and get it out of your system. Inflate your ego by tapping out as many people as you can. Better yet, compete.

If this is a lack of faith in your instructor's judgment then try to understand that what your instructor sees and what you see may be different. You see the belt as a metric of comparison to others at that belt level - it's honestly not a bad tool for that. Your instructor probably sees it as an indication of how much of your potential he thinks you've achieved given that you have a job and two kids.

If you want to create artificial barriers for yourself, however, then just move schools. You can do it cheaper by going anywhere other than Atos. I know this because I recently trained at a different school for a month and everyone got promoted but me.

Well heres the thing: at my current gym the ONLY times I am away from my family is Thursday nights 7-8:30 and Saturday noon for about 2 hours. Thats it. Every other of the remaining days I train (3 more days) are noon during my work lunch hour. So in a way, impact on my family time is minimal. This is BIG HUGE MASSIVE advantage I have at my current gym, that there are noon classes during my lunch break AND its down the street from where I work. Reason I do lunch classes (even though night classes are WAY better and I have more time to roll/spar more), is precisley to spend time with my son after work.

Let me be honest with you: this whole mess started when a brand new but pretty good blue at our academy left for Atos. He is way younger than me (15 years younger) but we were pretty evenly matched when we rolled. On the down low he told me that the blues at Atos are way way way better than any of the blues at our academy. He listed a laundry list of why its so much better there, and I AM human and the temptation got to me. Now when I got to my academy I feel so deflated, the motivation is gone where there was fire before.

My instructor as far as lineage and competition record is legit. He has been teaching BJJ as a black belt for 20+ years now, and started training 30 years ago. He is as old school as they come, but the guy seems to put money above all else. I get it, its hard to keep a gym open, but my impression is that he uses IBJJF minimal standards in order to keep people coming , and having a relatively easy carrot to chase.

BTW he promotes based on nothing but attendance. If you attend 3 classes per week on average, we will all get the stripes, belts etc at the exact same time, regardless of actual skill. This bothers the hell out of me, but again he either does this to retain members or, even worse, just doesnt care as much as I like to think and just does it the easy way.

 

[Evenflow80]

3 years to purple .
So it is like one years to blue and then purple after 2 years at blue.

I usually give 1 stripes per 6 months of training .
If you do well at a competition, I will promote to next belt because I don't like sandbagging .Well and as long as it is between the minimum time requirements.
Otherwise, you have to earn at least your third stripe before I consider you for the next belt .if I have a doubt, I will waiting until the fourth stripes.

So yeah, 3 years seems quick.

But even if he takes you 5 years to purple, you still will not match a blue belt that trains twice a day, 5 days a week ...anyway .

But if it the validation of having a famous lineage makes you feel better, why not?

Thats exactly it: 1 year to blue and 2 more to purple. Based on nothing at all except 3X a week average attendance. Actual skill seems to have zero bearing on it, neither does competing. I have not seen anyone consistent NOT get promoted either a stripe or belt on time. This bothers the hell out of me to be honest.

 

[Evenflow80]

What exactly is your goal?? Do you plan to compete at the elite level?
Why do you think you're not worthy of Purple? What are you basing this on? Only time in Belt??
I love BJJ but if I were going to miss seeing my kids grown up for a hobby, I'd have deeper issues than just belt promotion.
No offense intended.
I train at a relatively small academy and when I do drop ins while I travel for business, I've never had an issue holding my own against other hobbyists. I would definitely have my lunch money taken from a competitive Blue.
It's great to say you were promoted by Andre Galvao but what is that going to cost you?

My goal is when I am rated a purple, that means I am a purple belt who can hang with all other purple belts from any academy with exception of exceptional competitors and/or way younger or bigger than me. I hesitate to use the term "hobbyist" because I do complete. Not at Worlds or Pan levels, mind you, but things like Grappling X and IBJJF opens, etc.

I dont want to be called a purple, go do open mats at X academy (bonus: I am in San Diego and I don't need to tell you the quality of well know academies here), and feel like a white belt rolling against other purple belts.

I dont want to be a world champ (that ship has sailed a long time ago), I don't care about submitting people, and I don't even care about winning rolls per se, I just don't want to get smashed by others who, for some reason or another, are ranked at my same rank. This devalues what I earned and it means what I have isn't worth the cloth thats wrapped around my waist after years of training.

 

[Evenflow80]

I vote for this option:



Also, compete at purple.

• Why is it so important to you that you are able to hang with purples no matter where you go?

Other than not seeing your son before he goes to sleep during the week, you choosing ATOS means that your wife is going to have the sole burden of taking care of him while your at class. Guarantee she's going to be more stressed out by this fact, which will put more stress on your marriage. Have you talked to your wife about the possibility of doing this? What does she think?

She was upset, naturally.

I know, I can't do it. Or if I do maybe train 2 nights a week max. I am a family man and derive a lot of my happiness from being with family. Its just seeing how much happier my former teammate is doing at Atos and how much better he says it is, well, I am human and the temptation is strong.

To answer your question re: hanging with other purple belts: Wouldn't you be upset if you get your purple (considered the belt where you officially an "Expert" at BJJ), and you go do open mats at other academies, and then consistently get smashed by other purples? After all that time, effort, money, and commitment put into your training?

Also why the **** rush through the belt ranks anyways? Why would I want my black belt at 7 years? Whats the rush? Wish I can ask my professor that simple question. The belt doesnt mean anything if the expected skill level isn't there to back it up

 

[maximus__]

My goal is when I am rated a purple, that means I am a purple belt who can hang with all other purple belts from any academy with exception of exceptional competitors and/or way younger or bigger than me. I hesitate to use the term "hobbyist" because I do complete. Not at Worlds or Pan levels, mind you, but things like Grappling X and IBJJF opens, etc.

I dont want to be called a purple, go do open mats at X academy (bonus: I am in San Diego and I don't need to tell you the quality of well know academies here), and feel like a white belt rolling against other purple belts.

I dont want to be a world champ (that ship has sailed a long time ago), I don't care about submitting people, and I don't even care about winning rolls per se, I just don't want to get smashed by others who, for some reason or another, are ranked at my same rank. This devalues what I earned and it means what I have isn't worth the cloth thats wrapped around my waist after years of training.

Then get better and grow into the belt. You are a hobbyist who attends regularly. You will lose to someone of the same belt who trains 12 x a week and competes and medals at higher level competitions.
A belt is just a belt mate. The only thing it does is place you into a certain bracket in a competition. It doesn't mean anything in a class setting.

You can go train at ATOS and earn "your purple belt" in an extra year or two from now. The other option is realise this is a hobby, it doesn't pay your bills and your family should come first. You have an awesome situation and can get on the mat pretty regularly where you are without it causing any issues in your personal life. I would love your situation.

I think you should stay where you are and pick up an extra open mat here and there. Go in and get your arse kicked by some competition level ATOS "purple belts". Those same guys would tap recreational black belts aswell so who cares.

 

[HansDavidian]

My goal is when I am rated a purple, that means I am a purple belt who can hang with all other purple belts from any academy with exception of exceptional competitors and/or way younger or bigger than me. I hesitate to use the term "hobbyist" because I do complete. Not at Worlds or Pan levels, mind you, but things like Grappling X and IBJJF opens, etc.

I dont want to be called a purple, go do open mats at X academy (bonus: I am in San Diego and I don't need to tell you the quality of well know academies here), and feel like a white belt rolling against other purple belts.

I dont want to be a world champ (that ship has sailed a long time ago), I don't care about submitting people, and I don't even care about winning rolls per se, I just don't want to get smashed by others who, for some reason or another, are ranked at my same rank. This devalues what I earned and it means what I have isn't worth the cloth thats wrapped around my waist after years of training.

For me personally, family comes first.

If you are a young single dude, I will suggest you to go to Atos.

But you have kids. I know that you somehow feel your purple belt valued much more if you get it from Galvao but does it really worth not seeing your kids & risking your marriage?

 

[QingTian]

The belt you will have the longest is the black belt. Who cares about all others.

Actually, who cares about a black belt too.

WTF?

 

[Foppa21]

Thanks for the reply man, appreciate it.

I have basically 4 options:

1) Stay at current academy and stay loyal as you say. There are a ton of advantages of staying where I am, not least it allows more time with my family.

2) Move to Atos and get best instruction in the world. Not everyone is lucky enough to live in same city as such a good academy. Downside is like I said I can then only make the night classes and so won't see my 6 year old 4 nights a week as he will be asleep by time I get home.

3) Stay in current academy and try my best to work with what I have. Accept promotion to purple even though I feel strongly its not earned. However, attend open mats at Atos each Saturday to test myself against legit blues and purples. Iron sharpens iron and all that.

4) risk my marriage by joining BOTH. That is $350 a month. Attend equally each week or whenever possible, favor Atos.

What do you want to get out of it/life? If BJJ is at the very top and you think you have a chance to be a world beater, go for it. Otherwise, remember BJJ is part of life, not life itself

 

[Foppa21]

Accept the promotion and try to stay loyal but when you sign up for competition just register as a blue belt

That's not a option.. If you're promoted, you move up and cannot compete in a lower rank.