Would Diaz and Condit have won against Fitch and Kos???

bjjwar

bjjwar

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I just can't get over the fact that in WW we have the most deserving of every contender right now(McDonald,Frankie,Chael,Cain didn't really deserved their shot)who went through Fitch,Kos and Kampmann and now Ellenberger and he's the only one not getting his shot.

Hardy had to go through Marcus Davis and Swick,Condit through DHK and Hardy,and Diaz only BJ.This makes no sense at all.

Do you think Diaz and Condit would have won those fights that Hendricks went through?Personally i see both of them getting wrestlef.... very easily by Fitch and Kos to an UD.

I just hate the fact that guys like Erick Silva are not in the mix anymore because they fought top guys and other's are just sliding past everyone taking an easy road where you look good knocking someone out(Condit) or winning in impressive fashion(Diaz) only because you're opponent is much easier.
 
Fitch would probably beat both of them but Condit would beat Koscheck, Nick wouldn't have. Fitch is tailor made to shut down Condit and Diaz.

Ellenberger/Diaz is 50/50 and Kampmann if he fought smart like he did when he fought Condit could beat Nick.
 
I think that Condit or Diaz could win a fight against either of those guys, why not? I'm not saying they would win, but all are excellent fighters and would have a good chance against anybody....except maybe GSP! All would be excellent fights also.
 
I'd favor Fitch over both guys - Too grimey, too dirty, too tough he's Fitch, Bitch.
I'd favor both over Kos - though only slightly, Kos isn't "usually" stupid Fight IQ wise, he knows when he's outgunned unless he's fighting Alves, lots of takedowns especially against Diaz who is flatfooted could lead him to decisions, though I see either guy catching and punishing him standing
 
Nick beating the living shit out of BJ spoke volumes.
 
Local Plata said:
Nick beating the living shit out of BJ spoke volumes.
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The main thing it said to me was BJ should go back down to lightweight or should retire. Everyone beats the shit out of Mr. Penn these days. True, Diaz did look good in that fight, but I don't think his performance was good enough to answer whether he could beat Fitch.
 
I think Fitch would've beat both those guys tbh. Condit's trepidation (from fear of the TD) would result in him having the same gameplan he's used in the last two fights and he would get taken down. Diaz would welcome the ground battle but couldn't submit Fitch.
Both guys might be able to beat Kos, but it'd still be a tough matchup due to wrestling strength.
 
i think that wrestlers like kos, fitch and now ellenburger and hendricks are important gatekeepers at 170 - especially for guys like condit and diaz or kampman. if you can't beat the highest level wrestlers, you're not going to beat gsp.

that being said, i still think it's weak that the rules reward wrestling to such an extreme these days. you can't hold someone down forever to death. you're just holding them down. that's not winning a fight, that's stalling. whatever. it's what we got for now.
 
black cod said:
i think that wrestlers like kos, fitch and now ellenburger and hendricks are important gatekeepers at 170 - especially for guys like condit and diaz or kampman. if you can't beat the highest level wrestlers, you're not going to beat gsp.

that being said, i still think it's weak that the rules reward wrestling to such an extreme these days. you can't hold someone down forever to death. you're just holding them down. that's not winning a fight, that's stalling. whatever. it's what we got for now.
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The rules don't reward wrestling so much as they reward takedowns, and not nearly as much as they once did
 
The Real Pedro said:
The main thing it said to me was BJ should go back down to lightweight or should retire. Everyone beats the shit out of Mr. Penn these days. True, Diaz did look good in that fight, but I don't think his performance was good enough to answer whether he could beat Fitch.
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It also showed Fitch isn't all he's cracked up to be. Fitch had a rough go with an aged BJ as were Diaz flatout whiped BJ.
 
Fitch would Fitch them both of them easily. Kos could win those fights if he approached them smart and used his wrestling. But for some reason in recent years he's been thinking he is some elite striker.
 
thatKid said:
The rules don't reward wrestling so much as they reward takedowns, and not nearly as much as they once did
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I think you're missing his point. You can't takedown someone to death either.

Takedown != Slam
 
solyhhit said:
I think you're missing his point. You can't takedown someone to death either.

Takedown != Slam
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I never said either of those things.
And yes I see his point, just don't agree - the rules don't reward wrestling that much, not as much as before.
Actually the rules don't reward unfairly at all, though most judges do.
 
thatKid said:
I'd favor Fitch over both guys - Too grimey, too dirty, too tough he's Fitch, Bitch.
I'd favor both over Kos - though only slightly, Kos isn't "usually" stupid Fight IQ wise, he knows when he's outgunned unless he's fighting Alves, lots of takedowns especially against Diaz who is flatfooted could lead him to decisions, though I see either guy catching and punishing him standing
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This made me double over. I think Condit has a better shot at beating Fitch and Kos, because Condit has the ability to put any fighter on dream street with 1 shot, from any limb. And we know he's a killer once he smells blood. Neither Condit nor Diaz could stay on their feet very long, and that's why I favor Condit's greater power.

Diaz vs. Fitch - I take Fitch all day. He won't allow Diaz to sucker him into a firefight, his chin is good enough to take some heavy shots, and Diaz can't submit him.

Diaz vs. Kos - I go 50/50 here. Kos can get suckered into a brawl, where Diaz will beat him senseless. But if he wants to wrestle, Diaz gets dominated positionally. Kos relies a lot on athleticism though, and seems to be losing a step.

Condit vs. Fitch - I go 50/50 here too. I don't dare pick this one. Both guys are extremely tough and as well rounded as they come.

Condit vs. Kos - I've got Condit. Kos will likely stand just long enough to get his lights put out like DHK did.
 
MadTitan said:
This made me double over. I think Condit has a better shot at beating Fitch and Kos, because Condit has the ability to put any fighter on dream street with 1 shot, from any limb. And we know he's a killer once he smells blood. Neither Condit nor Diaz could stay on their feet very long, and that's why I favor Condit's greater power.

Diaz vs. Fitch - I take Fitch all day. He won't allow Diaz to sucker him into a firefight, his chin is good enough to take some heavy shots, and Diaz can't submit him.

Diaz vs. Kos - I go 50/50 here. Kos can get suckered into a brawl, where Diaz will beat him senseless. But if he wants to wrestle, Diaz gets dominated positionally. Kos relies a lot on athleticism though, and seems to be losing a step.

Condit vs. Fitch - I go 50/50 here too. I don't dare pick this one. Both guys are extremely tough and as well rounded as they come.

Condit vs. Kos - I've got Condit. Kos will likely stand just long enough to get his lights put out like DHK did.
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What part made you double over? You pretty much said the same thing except you have Condit vs Fitch 50/50
 
black cod said:
i think that wrestlers like kos, fitch and now ellenburger and hendricks are important gatekeepers at 170 - especially for guys like condit and diaz or kampman. if you can't beat the highest level wrestlers, you're not going to beat gsp.

that being said, i still think it's weak that the rules reward wrestling to such an extreme these days. you can't hold someone down forever to death. you're just holding them down. that's not winning a fight, that's stalling. whatever. it's what we got for now.
Click to expand...

There's a very simple solution to that. Just avoid fighting them! Hardy didn't have to for a title shot. Neither did Condit or Diaz. Rory could potentially get a title shot without beating any elite wrestlers.
 
thatKid said:
What part made you double over? You pretty much said the same thing except you have Condit vs Fitch 50/50
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I think he means the number of synonyms of dirty you used to describe Fitch coupled with the Fitch/Bitch rhyme
 
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