Would a win over Islam for Volk rank higher than BJ's win over prime Hughes?

VanMMA

VanMMA

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For me the answer is 'No' because Hughes defended his title 5 times when BJ beat him. However, I see an argument for 'Yes' because Islam has been very dominant over the LWs of his division. The win over Oliveira was sensational.
Thoughts?
 
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Davidjacksonjones said:
Agreed with your answer
Beating islam is a crazy accomplishment no doubt.
But beating someone with 5 title defences seems harder. It means 5 hungry contenders studied and trained trying to specifically beat the champ but failed
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Thanks for the response David. I think people really underrate the past legends. Hughes was legit and beat a younger GSP, a guy who went on to dominate the division and become the GOAT.
 
VanMMA said:
For me the answer is 'No' because Hughes defended his title 5 times when BJ beat him. However, I see an argument for 'Yes' because Islam has been very dominant over the LWs of his division. The win over Oliveira was sensational.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...

I think a win over Islam at this stage is either on par or slightly less impressive than BJ Penn submitting Hughes to be honest.
 
I think it’s as impressive, if not more. The size difference alone would make it an amazing accomplishment for Volk to get the win. And when BJ fought Hughes, there wasn’t the perceived gap in any of the skills between them that we see with the wrestling of Islam compared to
Alex. Matt was a great wrestler with serviceable striking, BJ was a grappling prodigy with good, creative striking. I’m leaning toward Volk being the more impressive win, just because of what he’s going to have to overcome to get the W.
 
As high octane and fun as those classic fights were, and as educational and inspiring as they've been to the next generation of fighters to follow, they are a much earlier stage in the development of MMA techniques and implementation in competition. Islam and Volk are now masters over the former masters.

Today's accomplishments are as impressive or more so than yesterday's in this instance. Volk & Islam face so many more simultaneous threats from one another in the octagon and can't afford to make any mistakes. They know more than Hughes/Penn could ever have known and their training is more intense by orders of magnitude. I might add that drug testing is more robust than back then as well.
 
VanMMA said:
For me the answer is 'No' because Hughes defended his title 5 times when BJ beat him. However, I see an argument for 'Yes' because Islam has been very dominant over the LWs of his division. The win over Oliveira was sensational.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...

at present, my answer is also “no,” for reasons you and others have stated.

however, that could change depending on what islam does afterward. unlike matt hughes, islam has not been dominant over the lw division, because he has faced few (if any) ranked fighters outside of his lone title fight. and as sherdoggers, we all ought to know better than to confer the coveted “aura of invincibility” upon a fighter without proof. time and time again we have seen the formerly “invincible” fighter fall to the previously unknown or overlooked contender. what fools we would be at this juncture to accept islam makhachev’s “greatness” on faith. if islam, after losing to volk, reclaims and repeatedly defends the lw title (either by beating volk in a rematch, or claiming a vacated title), then volk’s “upset” win could overtake bj’s win over hughes in terms of significance.
 
VanMMA said:
Thanks for the response David. I think people really underrate the past legends. Hughes was legit and beat a younger GSP, a guy who went on to dominate the division and become the GOAT.
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I might be missing the point in my post. I'm comparing today's talent to yesterday's even though I get that it's all relative and the fighters back then were on a level playing field just like the fighters are now. It just seems to me that regardless of title defences, there is a razor thin margin of error for these dudes compared to back then. The talent is in another stratosphere today. These 2 are complete assassins where as Hughes & Penn were more like pioneers. Like comparing muskets to today's assault rifles. No disrespect to BJ or Matt.
 
VanMMA said:
For me the answer is 'No' because Hughes defended his title 5 times when BJ beat him. However, I see an argument for 'Yes' because Islam has been very dominant over the LWs of his division. The win over Oliveira was sensational.
Thoughts?
Click to expand...

If it is, I think it would be only because Volk is moving up after cleaning out his division whereas BJ got his LW title after.

This is a difficult question. I'm leaning no, but it'd be a hell of an accomplishment, so I don't necessarily wanna say no.

We will see if he wins first I guess.

Regardless, it'd be one of the most impressive wins ever if he does pull it off. BJ beating Hughes on Burrito diet is just already up there.
 
No but it would rank above Conor beating Alvarez.
 
No. Hughes was a dominant champion. Penn was basically a puffed up Featherweight. It'll be incredibly impressive, but just right beneath it.

Also, considering Islam's lack of accomplishments in comparison to Hughes, the context really matters in this situation. Perception is reality in relation to skill, but it's all assumptions. Accomplishments are not.
 
VanMMA said:
I don't think it's laughable. At one point, Hughes was dominant at 170, a weight class higher than Islam. I think it'd be very competitive. Not like they are light years apart in terms of skill.
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Islam is miles ahead of Hughes.
 
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