Wing Chun in MMA

I have no doubt that guy is good in wing chun but nothing in that video makes me think he would be very good in MMA. The guy he is showing stuff on is almost always squared up completely making him way off balance, his hands are usually in bad position.

I would be interested to see this guy spar hard against a live opponent though to see his real effectiveness

I can agree with that. He had a fight clip around somewhere, could not find it this time. Mostly was to say that there is atleast one other flag bearer for WC in MMA. The school is in Belgium, so I don't expect to see a UFC/WEC appearance from him.
 
I can agree with that. He had a fight clip around somewhere, could not find it this time. Mostly was to say that there is atleast one other flag bearer for WC in MMA. The school is in Belgium, so I don't expect to see a UFC/WEC appearance from him.


I'll look aorund and see if i can find a fight clip. I'd like to see him fight
 
well thats the only evidence of wing chun being used in a ACTUAL FIGHT. grasp on to that video.... its all wing chun has.

please prove me wrong... i been dying to see wing chun be used in something besides kung fu flicks.

Ahhh it's MMA, and lower level/local MMA at that, most of the time the techniques won't be that good irregardless of the background - not much elite boxing/wrestling/BJJ/MT either most of the time except at the highest levels, or for the occasional high level specialist oddball trying out a little variety on a less serious basis (like Lyoto Machida's brother did etc)

We'll probably see some more variety in chinese martial arts in MMA with UFC entering into China. Probably not any super subspecialists but likely a number of fighters using it in some form, maybe even a few as their base. Hopefully as MMA gets big in more countries they'll just be more variety in general

Can't for the life of me understand why Kyokushin karate hasn't gotten big in MMA though, it does fine in K1 after all. Eventually
 
you could tell that the wing chun guys they were fighting really didnt like the hard contact

And that, right there, is a big problem that keeps guys from using it effectively. Need to spar heavy to get realistic fighting/timing etc
 
And that, right there, is a big problem that keeps guys from using it effectively. Need to spar heavy to get realistic fighting/timing etc

Agreed thats why I spar hard and think everyone should in every discipline maybe not every day but atleast once a week....
 
I was hesitant to even reply, but here's something short and sweet:

MMA--it means mixed martial arts. As Devante said way back early on in the thread...there is no style, not boxing, not muay thai, not wrestling, not BJJ--that can survive solely on it's own anymore.

Are there elements contained within WC that are useful? Absolutely. Are there elements within wing chun that are detrimental if not modified? Absolutely. Are there elements within WC that are shared with other striking systems--absolutely.

Fighting is fighting people. I don't care how elitest a person wants to be, but a punch is a punch. Facing is facing, footwork is footwork. There are only so many effective ways one can do these things...and that's what MMA is about for me...finding the most effective way for a human to fight, and weeding out the ineffective.
 
All of you, like most people, including many of you who claim to study wing chung, have the wrong idea about wing chung. I have been practicing wing chun for about 20 years and am familiar with different schools of wingchun. I also practice Judo, Taekwondo, and a style of Japanese Jujitsu.

So why no wing chun in mma? Well, why few other Kung Fu styles and Japanese Jujitsu; why no Silat, Ninjitsu, Hapkido, Aikido; Why the hell no freakin KRAV MAGA! Why? These are not sports! These are self defense styles. There is a huge difference. Well... that and... a lot of skilled martial artist are not willing to fight few hundred thousand(if they are lucky) when a boxer can make 10s of millions for losing fight. Quick tangent, Self defence styles are more deadly, but don't work unless you also practice a sport(boxing, mauy tai, etc) so you can feel what it is like to take and gave a real punch.

Now on wing chun specifically. If you studied wing chun and still think it is just chain punching you should join another school. Chain punching is mostly for speed drilling and demonstration. It is a pretty damn silly attack. There are also upercuts and once you know what you are doing there is nothing wrong with throwing in short hook here and there.There are a lot more palm and and even elbow strikes(yes elbow), and a hell of a lot more chops and finger strikes to the neck and eyes(illegal in mma).

Wing chun does have kicks, a lot of kicks, but thet are all low and not practiced much becuase most are easy to exicute and dangerous. There is a front and and low roundhouse kick that are similar to Muay Thai, and a few kicks that... I think are pretty stupid. Then there are the dangerous that would mostly be illigal in the UFC: foot stomps, knee breaks, and droping the foot hard on the the leg just below knee and pressing down(remember this is not a sport, so we wear shoes).

Wing Chun also has a few sweeps/throws and breaks. Nothing compared to judo/jujitsu, just saying they exist.

Chi Sao is a drill!! It is for training sensitivity and learning to use both hands at once. Also, wing chun is not fast, but it is up close with both hands are being used at once. One hand blocks and one attacks. The should be VERY little retracting(chain punch).

So, will you ever see Wing Chun in MMA. Only someone who claims to study it.
 
Why isn't Wing Chun Kung Fu utilized in MMA? I trained under the lineage of Duncan Leung who was taught by Yip Man and we trained in some very effective counterstrike techniques. I don't know if most of it could be translated into MMA but Pak Sao and Lap Sao counterstrikes I believe could be very effective against a boxer. Thoughts?


You should go try your WC against MMA and see how it works out. Go to a decent MMA gym that trains BJJ and MT (primary), this is the majority for MMA. Tell them you're an experienced fighter checking around for an MMA gym and maybe fight for them. They'll at least let you try 1 class free or sometimes even a full week if you're a fighter. They should have separate classes for standup and ground. Since you're mostly standup as WC, go to the MT class first and ask to attend the sparring class. Bring boxing gloves, mouthguard, cup and headgear. This should give you a good idea about WC in MMA as you're training against amateurs similar to yourself. I wouldn't suggest going to the MMA classes yet because the takedowns can seriously injure you if you're not used to break-falling, when and when not to post, etc.

Or you can also go to a boxing gym and ask to spar, although it will only be hands only.
 
So why no wing chun in mma? Well, why few other Kung Fu styles and Japanese Jujitsu; why no Silat, Ninjitsu, Hapkido, Aikido; Why the hell no freakin KRAV MAGA! Why? These are not sports! These are self defense styles. There is a huge difference.

Then why does Wing Chung and all of these others forms of MA you've listed also conduct sporting competitions, pass out medals & trophies, etc.? And not just locally, but internationally. And such WC competitions are much more strict with many, many, many more rules and safety gear than MMA, and especially much less brutal than MMA. When was the last time someone in a WC tournament was allowed take his opponent down and elbow him in the face repeatedly with no padding on?

Well... that and... a lot of skilled martial artist are not willing to fight few hundred thousand(if they are lucky) when a boxer can make 10s of millions for losing fight.

Well only the top boxers makes 10's of millions per fight, guaranteed. Most pro boxers at the bottom have a very difficult time getting a break. While a full time martial artist, is starving even worse and doesn't really make much money at all. Most can't even live off of it, let alone turn down $100,000 fight offers. Most MA'ist will cream their pants if they were given an opportunity to fight for a guaranteed $100,000, let alone a "few hundred thousands". When was the last time people paid money to see a Karate, Kung-Fu, WC, w/e tournament and it sells out every seat? The reason that these martial artists don't fight for money is because they know they'll get their asses whooped in an MMA cage. And they can't just step into the UFC anytime they feel like it, they'd have to prove that they're good fighters by fighting & winning many smaller venues first. Even then, the first fight in the UFC is only going to be for a few thousand dollars.

Quick tangent, Self defence styles are more deadly, but don't work unless you also practice a sport(boxing, mauy tai, etc) so you can feel what it is like to take and gave a real punch.

This is a myth. A garden variety White belt in BJJ can kill anyone once his choke is locked in because a choke is a death move. We just don't make a big deal out of it for marketing purposes. Mike Tyson, who's a sports fighter.....wait, forget Tyson...any nobody, amateur boxer, who knocks you out with 1 punch can then kill you if he wanted to with head stomps as you're lying there on the ground KTFO and helpless.

hell of a lot more chops and finger strikes to the neck and eyes(illegal in mma).

Also illegal in WC tournaments. But I don't see what's the big deal. Someone who trains to punch, especially boxers, can eye poke people just as good or better than any WC. And any MMA can target the neck and eyeballs also. It's not like these moves are exclusive to WC. And WC never pokes anyone for real in the eye nor struck them in the neck during training anyway, you just pretend to. I just got hit with a superman punch right in the neck last week. Didn't even hurt, let alone kill me. Afterwards, felt like I had a sore throat/illness. Sliding sidekick to the throat, now that one hurt but I didn't die neither. Didn't even stop fighting, just got mad.

Then there are the dangerous that would mostly be illigal in the UFC: foot stomps, knee breaks, and droping the foot hard on the the leg just below knee and pressing down(remember this is not a sport, so we wear shoes).

Foot stomps are legal legal in the UFC, may have changed recently, IDK. But I've never seen anyone lose from them. And getting struck on the knee is common. It's not legal, but accidents happen. Never seen anyone lose from such neither. Again, MMA fighters can kick someone's knees out too on the streets as well as eye poke and nut kick, etc...what's the big deal about these techniques?

Again, WC doesn't allow these illegal moves neither in their own WC tournaments.
 
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Then why does Wing Chung and all of these others forms of MA you've listed also conduct sporting competitions, pass out medals & trophies, etc.? And not just locally, but internationally.



Well only the top boxers makes 10's of millions per fight, guaranteed. Most pro boxers at the bottom have a very difficult time getting a break. While a full time martial artist, is starving even worse and doesn't really make much money at all. Most MA'ist will cream their pants if they were given an opportunity to fight for a guaranteed $100,000, let alone a "few hundred thousands". When was the last time people paid money that sells out every seat of a Karate, Kung-Fu, WC, w/e tournament? The reason that these martial artists don't fight for money is because they know they'll get their asses whooped in an MMA cage.



This is a myth. A garden variety White belt in BJJ can kill anyone once his choke is locked in because a choke is a death move. We just don't make a big deal out of it for marketing purposes. Mike Tyson, who's a sports fighter.....wait, forget Tyson...any nobody, amateur boxer, who knocks you out with 1 punch can kill you if he wanted to with head stomps as you're lying on the ground KTFO and helpless.



Also illegal in WC tournaments. But I don't see what's the big deal. Someone who trains to punch, especially boxers, can eye poke people just as good or better than any WC. And any MMA can target the neck also. It's not like these moves are exclusive to WC. And WC never pokes anyone for real in the eye during training anyway, you just pretend to.



Foot stomps are legal legal in the UFC, may have changed recently, IDK. But I've never seen anyone lose from them. And getting struck on the knee is common. It's not legal, but accidents happen. Never seen anyone lose from such neither. Again, MMA fighters can kick someone's knees out too on the streets as well as eye poke and nut kick, etc...what's the big deal about these techniques?

Again, WC doesn't allow these illegal moves neither in their own WC tournaments.

Strikes to the knee are absolutely legal in the Unified Rules, actually, so there's one more.
 
Wing Chun is for dorks who can't fight, but believe that they are deadly.

/Thread
 
All of you, like most people, including many of you who claim to study wing chung, have the wrong idea about wing chung. I have been practicing wing chun for about 20 years and am familiar with different schools of wingchun. I also practice Judo, Taekwondo, and a style of Japanese Jujitsu.

So why no wing chun in mma? Well, why few other Kung Fu styles and Japanese Jujitsu; why no Silat, Ninjitsu, Hapkido, Aikido; Why the hell no freakin KRAV MAGA! Why? These are not sports! These are self defense styles. There is a huge difference. Well... that and... a lot of skilled martial artist are not willing to fight few hundred thousand(if they are lucky) when a boxer can make 10s of millions for losing fight. Quick tangent, Self defence styles are more deadly, but don't work unless you also practice a sport(boxing, mauy tai, etc) so you can feel what it is like to take and gave a real punch.

Now on wing chun specifically. If you studied wing chun and still think it is just chain punching you should join another school. Chain punching is mostly for speed drilling and demonstration. It is a pretty damn silly attack. There are also upercuts and once you know what you are doing there is nothing wrong with throwing in short hook here and there.There are a lot more palm and and even elbow strikes(yes elbow), and a hell of a lot more chops and finger strikes to the neck and eyes(illegal in mma).

Wing chun does have kicks, a lot of kicks, but thet are all low and not practiced much becuase most are easy to exicute and dangerous. There is a front and and low roundhouse kick that are similar to Muay Thai, and a few kicks that... I think are pretty stupid. Then there are the dangerous that would mostly be illigal in the UFC: foot stomps, knee breaks, and droping the foot hard on the the leg just below knee and pressing down(remember this is not a sport, so we wear shoes).

Boxing is still fundamentally "the noble art of self-defence", but it manages to still be effective in sporting contexts.

If your art becomes worthless as soon as "TOO DEADLY" techniques (whether knee-snapping kicks or throat-crushing chops) can't be used then it probably sucks. You don't go straight to plucking eyeballs out of their sockets in "self-defence" scenarios; your art should have some sort of more solid foundation.
 
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Vid makes a pretty decent case for the straight lead punch, I'd say.

Keeping your hands up, too.

The fat dude got rocked by a jab. I'm not sure what kind of people he has been fighting to get to 26-0, but apparently he felt confident to not use basic skills like keeping your hand up and your chin down.
 
here is a video of me training one of my wing chun students and the two of us doing some light sparring starting around 1 min into video. i'm still working on getting some sparring sessions recorded with some really good muay thai and mma fighters.

Brandon, my student, drives every saturday from San Diego to Los Angeles to take privates with me. He has a karate background. and has been studying wing chun with me for about 4 months.

wing chun light sparring video with one of my students
 
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here is a video of me training one of my wing chun students and the two of us doing some light sparring starting around 1 min into video. i'm still working on getting some sparring sessions recorded with some really good muay thai and mma fighters.

Brandon, my student, drives every saturday from San Diego to Los Angeles to take privates with me. He has a karate background. and has been studying wing chun with me for about 4 months.

wing chun light sparring video with one of my students

Hey Chinaboxer, cool to see you finally posting a video with sparring. I know you were going slow and easy but I sincerely can't see a wrestler falling for the trapping stuff, he'd probably just get underhooks right away. Just one man's opinion.
Does anyone from your gym actually compete in MMA?
Really wanna see those sparring sessions against MT/MMA when you film them.
Best of luck!
 
Chinaboxer, did you ask your wing chun instructor Gary Lam about what he thinks about MMA? That big bullshitter said he can beat up any UFC fighters because he claim his wing chun takedown defense is superior to any styles, he said he don't need to learn submission defense because no one can ever take him to the ground. Ask him that. I bet he'll say the same dumb shit.
 
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