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why dont people ever use the pin the biceps, knee thru the butt guard break in mma?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by hamoom, Dec 28, 2005.

  1. hamoom

    hamoom Purple Belt

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    I don't see why people dont put their knee up straight through the guard. You don't get hit in the face because you pin the guys arms while you bring your knee through. And then when you have your knee all the way through, it's not like he can close a full guard around you again. You could sit there pretty stable and GNP the guy and he can't close his guard around you. Why doesnt anyone ever try this? I think I've only seen it once.
     
  2. flyingknee16

    flyingknee16 Brown Belt

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    it might be too slippery?

    that's a good question.
     
  3. Matt Thornton

    Matt Thornton Amateur Fighter

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    Can you? I've only seen the knee through the butt break once you've done something to loosen the legs. Unless you do that I don't think there's enough space to get your knee through.

    What I have seen is pin the biceps, and stand up in guard. Because you're pinning his biceps down, he can't use his arms to set up sweeps, leg locks, triangles, or arm bars. From there you squeeze your knees together while pushing your hips forward, so that you're almost stacking him. This breaks the guard.

    If what you said works though, that sounds pretty good. I just wasn't sure; I don't think you have the space for the knee. But I could definitely be wrong.
     
  4. FStep

    FStep Brown Belt

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    simply put because those passes are very low % against experienced people ... kneed down the middle at least doesn't really work above blue belt level
     
  5. Aesopian

    Aesopian Brown Belt

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    How would you know that?
     
  6. DMcKayBJJ

    DMcKayBJJ Blue Belt

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    Hmmm...cause the guy on the bottom could just open his legs and work an open guard strategy?
     
  7. knoxpk

    knoxpk Black Belt

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    the knee in the butt pass is a great way to break guard and have done it up against purples. Its a technique thats all not some magic bullet.
     
  8. hamoom

    hamoom Purple Belt

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    i'm not saying its a magic bullet. i'm saying that it's a pretty good option for MMA rather than just sitting in someones guard and not even trying to pass. And I disagree with people in this thread who think it only works against blue belts or whatever. Even if it DOES only work against blue belts, are all the guys who do mma black belt level?
     
  9. lonewolf_454

    lonewolf_454 Blue Belt

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    Do people still pass the gaurd in MMA?
     
  10. johil d'o

    johil d'o Thought Warrior

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    What is this "passing" that you speak of?
     
  11. FStep

    FStep Brown Belt

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    well i think he is refering to the guys in the ufc/pride or we and yea most of them are above blue belt level in most aspects (remember even if a fighter doesn't have/use subs much it doesn't mean he doesn't know how to maintain guard thats something you gotta have to compete at a high level
     
  12. hamoom

    hamoom Purple Belt

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    :( :( :( :(
     
  13. Sauron

    Sauron Red Belt

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    watch josh thompson vs suigihara

    he did pass guard but got punched in the face about 80 times before he he passed.
     
  14. unearth

    unearth Guest

    ive also noticed that fighters rarely stand up in the guard nowadays as well. perhaps they are afraid of sweeps, or upkicks. or perhaps the opponents are just too slippery for them to pin easily without a gi to grip? idk really.
     
  15. Bubble Boy

    Bubble Boy Black Belt

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    Great question. This is my favorite guard pass by far. It seems like I've seen it quite a bit in MMA, I just think it looks different because of all the up kicks and punches and attempted heel hooks and the such. It's not as graceful looking as it is in pure grappling; it gets ghetto style in the cage.

    It's a tough question to quantify.
     
  16. SideofKO

    SideofKO Brown Belt

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    Some people have the theory that passing the guard takes too much energy and that to sit and wait to be stood up or to simply punch from there while stifling sub attempts is a safer way to go. It really just depends on what the guy is comfortable with. When I spar, I like to try and pass the guard but it does seem sort of exhausting when the guy on the bottom is doing his best to keep guard or recover it all the while, hitting you and trying to submit or sweep.
    So I have a rule, basically, if the guy has a tight high guard, I watch for subs more closely and I try and make calculated shots. If the guy has a low guard, almost open, I'm usually not worried about subs (which can get me into trouble) and I will try and pass. I prefer standing passes also.
     
  17. blanko

    blanko Guest

    even mario sperry says to punch out of the guard.
     
  18. Stephan Kesting

    Stephan Kesting Green Belt

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    I think it is because if an MMA fighter has managed to stand up in the guard with his opponent's biceps pinned he usually starts punching, and then the punches open the guard quite by themselves. Keeping your guard closed in MMA vs a standing opponent is generally a bad idea, and if he's pinning your biceps at the same time then you're REALLY in trouble unless you switch to an open guard right away

    Stephan Kesting
    www.grapplearts.com
     
  19. hamoom

    hamoom Purple Belt

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    thats a very good point
     
  20. Matt Thornton

    Matt Thornton Amateur Fighter

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    Stephan, off topic but I got your Grappling Drills DVD for Christmas. Awesome work! I really think this is going to help my grappling a LOT. I have so many instructionals teaching me new moves, but now I have a great system to get better at basic grappling skills and drill moves. It's given me even more motivation to train.

    I'm going to write a review of the DVD in the Gear and Equipment section. Thanks again!
     

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