Why are so many bjj black belts so inactive on the bottom??

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by bjjwar, Oct 11, 2013.

  1. bjjwar

    bjjwar Brown Belt

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    In mma when you're in the bottom,you're losing.Many black belts seem happy being at the bottom "controlling" the damage without even trying to get up or attempt a sub.

    I've seen countless times guys that aren't near their level just throw their legs up as if they're going for an armbar or triangle and the guy on top is forced to back away and most times he even gets up.
    By doing that,even if you know you're not really going for a sub,it creates space to get up or at least nobody can punch you when your legs are in between.

    Why are so many guys inactive at the bottom??Don't they train that kind of situation at all??
     
  2. eatthisjerry

    eatthisjerry Brown Belt

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    If you're talking about Demian there were two factors:

    1st - Shields controlled him on top masterfully. He didn't look for submissions, like a BJJ guy is supposed to do but he totally frustrated Maia's ground game. If Maia had a pure wrestler on top, maybe he'd get a sweep or two. Also, Shields made good use of the fence.

    2nd - Maia gassed early, by trying (and eventually getting success) take Shields down and transitioning excessively in the ground when on top. This is one of the flaws I saw in his game and he said it too afterwards.
     
  3. Rusk

    Rusk Black Belt

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    Because they are "black belts".
     
  4. joeyjoejoe

    joeyjoejoe Silver Belt

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    Submission defense is at an all time high in the UFC, u can be as active as u want from the bottom and still lose a decision if you don't lock on a sub.
     
  5. TobikanJudan94

    TobikanJudan94 Never be game over

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    A good eough wrestler usually shuts down attacks from the bottom.

    There are very few fighters left that work good from the bottom in term of subs.
     
  6. Kaffe

    Kaffe Brown Belt

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    Many don't want to go for stuff without knowing they " already " have it. Getting passed because you just threw up your legs for a futile triangle sucks ass. If Maia had done that, Shields would have been in side control or back in guard in seconds.
     
  7. bjpenngoat

    bjpenngoat Red Belt

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    nah I think Demian was terrified to give up any positioning to Jake because he knew he would be stuck in perpetuity there. It was an absolutely terrible performance by demian imo. Jake is an ace on the ground but guys get subbed in adcc all the time, its not written in stone that you cant go for any submission or at least WORK for them on the bottom in mma or grappling even if the guy in your guard is a black belt too.
     
  8. GordaoPreguico

    GordaoPreguico Red Belt

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    There are only so many attacks from the bottom that are possible in MMA. Because of this people become well versed in how to defend them.
     
  9. BuffaloEmperor

    BuffaloEmperor Brown Belt

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    its probably because jake shields is the brendan schaub of the welterweight division. (not counting GSP) and just shuts u down .
    jakes the type of dude that goes threw a toll booth and parks his car just to block traffic b/c he enjoys shutting people down.
     
  10. sllimkcaj

    sllimkcaj Blue Belt

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    Frank mir are you paying attention
     
  11. JOdrummerSH

    JOdrummerSH Polyrhythmic Preposter

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    Im honestly baffled that more people dont at least attempt florians old attack; feet on hips, make space, elbow the fuck out of top of head.

    theres not a big risk of counterattacks here or being open to get submitted and i think the payoff can be big
     
  12. Kazuya Mishima

    Kazuya Mishima Brown Belt

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    Stalling in hopes of a stand up.

    Which actually propells the myth that the wrestler on top is usually stalling when it is the other way around. Watch Sonnen/Silva 2, in the eyes of my casual friend Sonnen tried to hold him down and nothing else.
     
  13. BrazilianDude

    BrazilianDude Gold Belt

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    I agree they should be more active. Some guys don't seem to understand the unified files.
    Above all else, O blame it on the habit of using closed guard. Butterfly guard is far better to sweep or stand up.. Guys who use it well have been more succesful lately.

    Maia vs Shields is a very particular case though, cause Shields really has great top control andy takes zero risk.

    EDIT: one more factor is many bjj guys come from Brazil. Shields vs Maia would have caused at the ref to stop and stand them up at least 5 times in a brazilian org.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2013
  14. Kazuya Mishima

    Kazuya Mishima Brown Belt

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    Ahhhh he passed Maia's guard quite a few times...
     
  15. Area809

    Area809 Black Belt

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    I think it just depends on who is on top. You might see more attempts from the bottom, say against someone like Chael, who has been submitted from there a few times because he leaves space open to do so. Someone like Shields, I think was probably thinking position before anything else.
     
  16. JJWrestler

    JJWrestler Blue Belt

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    I've said it before, and I am seeing being posted by more and more people on Sherdog...

    In MMA now, the best guard is an attacking/aggressive one. Guys like Carlos Condit and Anthony Pettis are great examples. They are constantly attacking off their backs with strikes and submissions. The Diaz brothers are pretty good examples as well.

    Also, something we are seeing more of is a wrestling stand-up. Frankie Edgar did it to BJ Penn. He basically gives up the back but uses it to scramble to his feet and break the grip. Chuck Liddell was one of the first guys I have seen do it.
     
  17. Sanshou Kid

    Sanshou Kid Brown Belt

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    The only guy I can think of who does that regularly is Condit.

    It is a very underutilised weapon. Look how much damage Mousasi did to King Mo and those weren't even elbows.
     
  18. Kazuya Mishima

    Kazuya Mishima Brown Belt

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    This is becoming a trend on Sherdog. Fighter on bottom defends really well or defends and completely shuts shit down by stalling in hopes of a stand up and it's the fighter on top fault.
     
  19. ALISHOGUN88

    ALISHOGUN88 Orange Belt

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    because strong wrestlers are putting them on their back, heavy top control.
     
  20. Kazuya Mishima

    Kazuya Mishima Brown Belt

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    I didn't mention Maia specifically, but that proves my point. Although Maia shut down a lot of Jake's top game Jake still tried some GnP and passed guard quite a few times. Yet in a lot of people's minds Jake played it safe and didn't try much.
     

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