Why are people still calling Jon Jones the GOAT?

It's hilarious how I see the exact same people who hate on Jones call Cyborg the greatest woman fighter ever

Lmao
 
ped's enabled jones to increase his reach by 5.32 inches.
no goat.
 
most of his big wins are over guys far past their peak... I didnt consider him the GOAT but maybe the GOAT LHW, but yes now all that is thrown out the window blind nut hangers are gonna take a while to fall off if ever. Their god is a proven cheater and overall scumbag of a human.
 
FlyThaiMMA said:
It's hilarious how I see the exact same people who hate on Jones call Cyborg the greatest woman fighter ever

Lmao
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megumi is the best eva!/ WMMA isnt a real sport so it doesnt matter
 
delemnas? fair enough, your spelling isn't great but where the fuck did you get an "n" from?
 
he should have just stopped taking after USADA integration, he already had GOAT resume by that time. he just reeeaally didn't wanna lose to DC and didn't think it would be the best time to start weaning off
 
rraaju said:
delemnas? fair enough, your spelling isn't great but where the fuck did you get an "n" from?
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LOL @ pointing out typos in 2016. That happens when you type 150+ wpm.

go back to 1995. it was still cool to point out typos back then.
 
Melas Chasma said:
You own locig is very flawed. Just because under 10% of fighters have been caught does not mean "the locig tells us that as many as 80% of haveen using PEDs", even if that happened to be true.
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You can't read apparently. As I said before that 80 % ESTIMATE is not mine but from a number of fighters in professional MMA. Up until USADA the testing has been light years behind in detecting PEDs. The illogical part of the OP is that Jones and only Jones should have his achievements scrutinized for PED use. You are either a Jones hater (I consider myself to be one as well but just not blind) or extremely naive to think he is the only one who used in his Prime.
 
Acceptance takes time. It's not going to happen overnight.

You can't expect people who elevated a fighter in their minds to immediately stop seeing him as great/GOAT shortly after he gets popped.

Think about how Jones, himself, cried like a baby at the USADA press conference. I think even for him it was a difficult "wow, this is real and it's over for me" thing to realize that any GOAT shot was done.

Many people had a lot of emotional investment in Jones (I'm thinking like a Luke Thomas here). Once their "God" is dead, you can expect rationalizations and a lengthy road to acceptance.

It's like how Luke Thomas suddenly found "PED religion" and now PED's apparently really don't matter to him. Anything to try to retain his previous mindset regarding Jones without suffering cognitive dissonance.
 
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synyster said:
most of his big wins are over guys far past their peak... I didnt consider him the GOAT but maybe the GOAT LHW, but yes now all that is thrown out the window blind nut hangers are gonna take a while to fall off if ever. Their god is a proven cheater and overall scumbag of a human.
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Pretty much, Shogun and Rampage were not close to their best at the time he fought them and generally he benefitef from being the first really big elite LHW fighting guys like Shogun, Rashad and Machida who would liklely be(or indeed are) MW's if they started today.
 
dipstickjimmy said:
You can't read apparently. As I said before that 80 % ESTIMATE is not mine but from a number of fighters in professional MMA. Up until USADA the testing has been light years behind in detecting PEDs. The illogical part of the OP is that Jones and only Jones should have his achievements scrutinized for PED use. You are either a Jones hater (I consider myself to be one as well but just not blind) or extremely naive to think he is the only one who used in his Prime.
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I never said I think he is the only one who used in his prime. There are, and should be, still a difference how we should view fighters who are proven cheaters, and fighters who arent. Also:

A) Its possible fighters are justifying their own use by saying 80% (or more).
B) People in general are bad using %s, and no matter the subject most of the time they are exaggerating to make a point (or for some other reason, see point A).
C) The fact that so small % (less than 5%?) of fighters in the history of the sport have been caught even once does not imply that even close to 80% are using, no matter what you think about the testing before.
D) The higher the level a fighter is fighting, the higher the probability the said fighter is using PEDs, since the whole reason to use PEDs is that they help you to become a better fighter. Therefore, and now this is real locig for you, it is logical to think that Jones has been more likely using his whole career than some lesser fighter, because he fights on a level (almost) no-one has been able to. It is logical to assume the probability of Jones using PEDs is higher than almost all other fighters. This is a somewhat moot point in a light of the topic of this thread, because other GOAT - candidates are suspect to this aswell.
E) Jones has been busted while the vast majority of other fighters arent.

Thanks for playing.

Ps.And Im not saying you cant be right, it is possible. Just bringing you some different perspective. Bye.
 
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OneGloveGracie said:
PEDs can change a fighters career BIG TIME.
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I think this is how some people view Cyborg, fair or unfair. That is, I think people feel Cyborg might be benefiting from long-term usage of "vitamins" that ends up having a cumulative effect.
 
OneGloveGracie said:
.... I don't get it.

Before he got caught by USADA I considered Jon the greatest all-time. In fact I didn't even think there was a close 2nd. The wins that he had on his resume were in no doubt the best all-time.

BUT, all that is meaningless now after he got caught by USADA. I have a hard time believing that he only started using PEDs recently. Why would you go on this incredible unbeaten streak and then in the prime of your career decide to start taking? The answer is, OF COURSE he didn't just start taking recently. He had to have been doing it his whole career. You don't start taking AFTER you've had a dominant career. You only start taking when you think you aren't good enough to compete against the best or that you're getting too old. And Jon was in neither of those delemnas.

So IMO 100% of the wins in his career deserve an asterisk. Therefore automatically taking him out of the running for even a top 1000 ranking. He does not deserve to be considered anywhere near the top of the all-time ranks.
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Its impossible to tell who was juicing before USADA, it was ridiculously easy to beat the tests by all accounts.
 
They don't even like me....
They just hate Jon Jones
ummm
 
The same thing applies to Anderson and Fedor.
 
OneGloveGracie said:
.... I don't get it.

Before he got caught by USADA I considered Jon the greatest all-time. In fact I didn't even think there was a close 2nd. The wins that he had on his resume were in no doubt the best all-time.

BUT, all that is meaningless now after he got caught by USADA. I have a hard time believing that he only started using PEDs recently. Why would you go on this incredible unbeaten streak and then in the prime of your career decide to start taking? The answer is, OF COURSE he didn't just start taking recently. He had to have been doing it his whole career. You don't start taking AFTER you've had a dominant career. You only start taking when you think you aren't good enough to compete against the best or that you're getting too old. And Jon was in neither of those delemnas.

So IMO 100% of the wins in his career deserve an asterisk. Therefore automatically taking him out of the running for even a top 1000 ranking. He does not deserve to be considered anywhere near the top of the all-time ranks.
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Just some delusional Jones fans call him the goat with tears in their eyes.. He drop #2 to #4 badly after PEDs..

fedorgoatpoll.png


And He will drop to #5 if/when Aldo became FW champ again.
 
Hard to consider Jones the GOAT when he had close fights against two guys who have never popped.

It's not like Bones just easily ran over everyone he fought.
 
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