who doesnt eat grains, carb questions

[KILL KILL]

1. For the last several months I've been in ketosis (minus a few cheat meals). But i've also been out of jiu jitsu due to moving to a new location. Once I start back up, I may jump back on the grains wagon if I feel like my performance is lagging. The only time I was keto and training for a competition I felt like shit. BUT I was very new to no carb eating. I believe it was due to a mix of overtraining and not eating enough fats.

2. I love fruit. Try to take that away from me and I will kick you

3. I have not done the proper research but from what I've noticed noticed blueberries are awesome. My favorite blueberry drink is Blue Machine by Naked. I would drink one while on in the marines during a long work day and would instantly feel reenergized and focused. I can almost swear by it. But the drink is also loaded with B vitamins I believe so that may have been why.

4. Why would they help with mass gains and not strength gains? carbs are broken down into glycogen which is then used for energy in the muscles and brain. Glycogen supports the body functions including muscle growth and strength. they aren't the direct reason for muscle size and strength

5. In a way yes. They help slow the breakdown of muscle protein.

6. I eat dairy and see no problem with it. The main arguement against it from a no carb stance is that the body is not made specifically to digest large amounts of lactose in adults. I use it to get the proper amounts of fat.

 

[immovablestone]

I keep my diet principles pretty basic. No matter what, get enough protein, eat green veggies, and take fish oil. Other than that, I'm pretty much a calorie in vs. calorie out coupled with common sense type guy.

I have no problem with people eating however they want, but I guess I'm like the devil's advocate on this forum. I like to be the guy to point out that you don't have to drastically alter your diet unless you eat like a complete fucktard. Most of the debates seem to be about such minor things. I would say a very small percent of the population that is near their genetic potential need to worry about such small alterations.

Yep, that's the best diet perspective one can have in my opinion. That's how I do it, I just happen to throw in some bad thoughts regarding grains that have made their way into my head through various channels.

I also really hate when the debates get down to minutia when both sides are saying the same thing essentially, specially in the odd thread where it actually may be someone intelligent trying to learn what's best for them from a perspective where reinforcement of the basic dietary ideas you mention is FAR better than debating the minutia in front of them.

 

[Clint07]

You know it was a question, don't pretend to be even more stupid then you already are. So here in idiot proof form : How effectively does the body use fat and protein as energy, what does the body do with all the extra fat (fat consumed above the minimal nutritional fat needs)? Also +95 of top athletes do eat high carb.

You are confusing things like Ketosis with the oxidation of lipids.

Most of the body can use carbs or fat for energy (ATP creation) based on what is available. Your Brain and CNS however require glucose or Ketones.

Ketosis is the point where your body runs out of available glucose and begins to produce Ketones (using fat cells as the source of the ketones) for the brain. Now the brain can't fully run on ketones, it still needs glucose which is then created out of protein (hence why you need to eat more protein while dieting to help spare muscle)

So presuming that you are eating fewer calories than you are burning, the carbs you eat will either be used by the brain or stored as muscle glycogen where it will be burned for energy, the fat will be burned as fuel or converted into ketones, and the protein will be converted into glucose or used for other protein specific things. Body fat or muscle protein will then be used for any remaining gaps in the bodies nutritional needs.

 

[immovablestone]

You know it was a question, don't pretend to be even more stupid then you already are. So here in idiot proof form : How effectively does the body use fat and protein as energy, what does the body do with all the extra fat (fat consumed above the minimal nutritional fat needs)? Also +95 of top athletes do eat high carb.

This would require explaining shit to you that would be largely beyond the scope of someone who can barely form complete thoughts and sentences. I'm sure someone else may bite, but from my perspective until you can form and articulate actual thoughts, you get pics.

 

[Jaedong]

This would require explaining shit to you that would be largely beyond the scope of someone who can barely form complete thoughts and sentences. I'm sure someone else may bite, but from my perspective until you can form and articulate actual thoughts, you get pics.

I am much smarter, better, more beautiful then you. And you got a fatty in your avatar which means that you probably are a fat f*ck too and eat beef dripped in butter all day. Fat ass being rude on the internet cause he thinks because he watches mma that he is hardcore. Good thing about you is that now I don't even get angry when someone annoys me no the internet. Have a good day bitch and read sherdog for the next 6 hours, I'm off to the gym

 

[IDRISCKY]

You know it was a question, don't pretend to be even more stupid then you already are. So here in idiot proof form : How effectively does the body use fat and protein as energy, what does the body do with all the extra fat (fat consumed above the minimal nutritional fat needs)? Also +95 of top athletes do eat high carb.

It obviously makes you fat. If you eat 1 gram over the "minimal nutritional fat needs" you're going to become a fat fuck.

Show me where you got this 95% from. Then show me the quality of life and average lifespan on a "top" athlete.

 

[KILL KILL]

I am much smarter, better, more beautiful then you. And you got a fatty in your avatar which means that you probably are a fat f*ck too and eat beef dripped in butter all day. Fat ass being rude on the internet cause he thinks because he watches mma that he is hardcore. Good thing about you is that now I don't even get angry when someone annoys me no the internet. Have a good day bitch and read sherdog for the next 6 hours, I'm off to the gym

dude......come on

 

[IDRISCKY]

I am much smarter, better, more beautiful then you.

Yet, you still don't know the difference between than and then.

 

[Oblivian]

I am much smarter, better, more beautiful then you. And you got a fatty in your avatar which means that you probably are a fat f*ck too and eat beef dripped in butter all day. Fat ass being rude on the internet cause he thinks because he watches mma that he is hardcore. Good thing about you is that now I don't even get angry when someone annoys me no the internet. Have a good day bitch and read sherdog for the next 6 hours, I'm off to the gym

I take offense to this.

 

[curb1850]

I'm eating a lot of grains at the moment and my strength gains are better than ever.

this was my experience... helped a lot

 

[skreenaim]

I'll play along:

1 I don't eat grains except rye. (its too good) I've never liked the damn 'fluff' and Paleo gave me an excuse to stop eating it. Definately feel and perform better without the grain.

2 Its August and fruit is cheap. I ate a 6 pound melon today it was $2.00. Most of the year I eat very little fruit however.

3 Most any food will help a starving man think better. Blueberries are amazing from an anti-oxidant and gout perspective (important to me). Oats are for horses.

4 Sufficent calories help strength gains.

5 As above. I do not consume them PWO however.

6 Both seem to be good sources of protien and fats with a most of the lactose pre-digested. I get violently ill from milk but real yogurt is fine. Both are slow to digest/put in use.

i have been living a primal diet for the last 4 months and i feel, and train fantastic but these questions remain, thanks for the feedback -

Same here. Do outside sources like your instructor and the numbers on the weights agree that you are performing well?

 

[Jaedong]

It obviously makes you fat. If you eat 1 gram over the "minimal nutritional fat needs" you're going to become a fat fuck.

Show me where you got this 95% from. Then show me the quality of life and average lifespan on a "top" athlete.

dude......come on

Yet, you still don't know the difference between than and then.

I take offense to this.

Ok sorry...


But however if I say something that is incorrect then people can shortly correct me instead of being offensive and calling me retarded.

Lol, Imbovablestone (? spelling) didn't respond, he is probably crying ni the corner eating potato chips. Can't wait to get in a little better shape and then make a post a picture of you thread to see how fat imbovable is, that is if he does post a picture of himself.

I love how popular I am on sherdog and all the "positive" feedback. Funny thing is I am a super nice guy in RL, but what can you do when some primal nutrition elitist thinks your views on diet are so stupid that he has to call you retarded all the time. Also then and than are speed mistakes, ingrish is not my first language, actually third after Croatian and German, so don't be a grammar nazi, if nothing resort to call me a stupid retard. / rant

 

[maravillin]

1. For the last several months I've been in ketosis (minus a few cheat meals). But i've also been out of jiu jitsu due to moving to a new location. Once I start back up, I may jump back on the grains wagon if I feel like my performance is lagging. The only time I was keto and training for a competition I felt like shit. BUT I was very new to no carb eating. I believe it was due to a mix of overtraining and not eating enough fats.

2. I love fruit. Try to take that away from me and I will kick you

3. I have not done the proper research but from what I've noticed noticed blueberries are awesome. My favorite blueberry drink is Blue Machine by Naked. I would drink one while on in the marines during a long work day and would instantly feel reenergized and focused. I can almost swear by it. But the drink is also loaded with B vitamins I believe so that may have been why.

4. Why would they help with mass gains and not strength gains? carbs are broken down into glycogen which is then used for energy in the muscles and brain. Glycogen supports the body functions including muscle growth and strength. they aren't the direct reason for muscle size and strength

5. In a way yes. They help slow the breakdown of muscle protein.

6. I eat dairy and see no problem with it. The main arguement against it from a no carb stance is that the body is not made specifically to digest large amounts of lactose in adults. I use it to get the proper amounts of fat.

thanks devil, im a marine as well. i figure il just stay off the grains unless its before a serious mma trainning session, and have some carbs postworkout of my lifting and mma sessions. Il also prob have some greek yogurt or cottage cheese in the evenings all of this while maintaining my carbs at about 50g.. im in ketosis as i type this and my muscles are extremely sore im not recovering as fast as normal my mouth feels dry as fuck no matter how much i hydrate, im still performing well, although thats due more to a pride issue as i refuse to let down my trainers when rolling, working bag/pads, or sparring.. but yeah it kinda sucks

 

[maravillin]

6 Both seem to be good sources of protien and fats with a most of the lactose pre-digested. I get violently ill from milk but real yogurt is fine. Both are slow to digest/put in use.

quick clarification, are cotttage cheese and greek yogurt easily digested because the lactose is pre digested? milk kinda fucks me up as well so this would help me greatly, thanks

 

[skreenaim]

quick clarification, are cotttage cheese and greek yogurt easily digested because the lactose is pre digested? milk kinda fucks me up as well so this would help me greatly, thanks

Most dairy problems are from either lactose (a carb) or casin (a protien). In yogurt and cottage cheese (greek or not) most of the lactose is digested by the bactira. The more fermented the product, the easier it is on the digestive system. I still cannot pigout on the stuff but I can have a good size serving and enjoy some creamier sauces. (needed varity for sanity) If your problem is casin these foods are still off limits.

 

[miaou]

I keep my diet principles pretty basic. No matter what, get enough protein, eat green veggies, and take fish oil. Other than that, I'm pretty much a calorie in vs. calorie out coupled with common sense type guy.

I have no problem with people eating however they want, but I guess I'm like the devil's advocate on this forum. I like to be the guy to point out that you don't have to drastically alter your diet unless you eat like a complete fucktard. Most of the debates seem to be about such minor things. I would say a very small percent of the population that is near their genetic potential need to worry about such small alterations.

And yes...I am also starting to think that Jaedong is special.

I agree with this.

The basic idea is to get an adequate amount of protein according to your BW and activity and goals (bulking/maintaining/cutting), then get an adequate amount of essential fatty acids according to the rest of your diet, then get an adequate amount of carbs again according to your activity/goals (for instance if you are cutting you will want to get just enough for glucose replenishment). On top of this you want to get an adequate amount of micronutrients.

As long as the above are in order, any extra calories you need to reach your daily quota can be from whatever you enjoy the most. Whether that be grains, milk, beef dripped in butter, or whatever have you would make no major difference (barring allergies, medical conditions etc.).

The main argument regarding grains is that you will get less micronutrients for the same amount of calories compared to other sources like fruit and vegetables. If your overall macros and micros are in order, then there is no reason this would be an issue.

 

[maravillin]

thanks..

 

[KILL KILL]

thanks devil, im a marine as well. i figure il just stay off the grains unless its before a serious mma trainning session, and have some carbs postworkout of my lifting and mma sessions. Il also prob have some greek yogurt or cottage cheese in the evenings all of this while maintaining my carbs at about 50g.. im in ketosis as i type this and my muscles are extremely sore im not recovering as fast as normal my mouth feels dry as fuck no matter how much i hydrate, im still performing well, although thats due more to a pride issue as i refuse to let down my trainers when rolling, working bag/pads, or sparring.. but yeah it kinda sucks

If you're not recovering properly I would suggest eating more. More protein and more fats will help. and yes the dry mouth is an annoying side effect. I drink about a gallon of water throughout the day as opposed to about half that when not in ketosis

 

[rubberducky27]

1just interested in who doesnt eat grains and why?
I don't. I looked at my diet log, bought a glucometer and decided I'd go keto given the way my body reacted to carbs in general.

2 who eats low carb, avoiding fruit?
I do. As above.

3 will blueberries and steel cut oats help brain function?
I have no idea what you're looking for here. I don't think there has been a scientific study on oats & blueberries and their impact on brain function. Most studies on the impact of fat, carbs, protein and their impact on brain function have been done in a manner they will always support the company that is paying for them.

4 i know carbs help mass gain but do they help Strength gain?
Calories help mass gain. Strength gains are achieved in the gym, diet is only to ensure you have the energy to perform in the gym.

5 do carbs help recovery?
Yes they do.

6 does dairy like full fat cottage cheese or greek yogurt help any of the above and will it hurt my diet?
Depends.

i have been living a primal diet for the last 4 months and i feel, and train fantastic but these questions remain, thanks for the feedback.

You're welcome, if you're feeling and training fantastic make changes and look at the impact on how you feel and train. Things may or may not get better.

 

[rubberducky27]

thanks devil, im a marine as well. i figure il just stay off the grains unless its before a serious mma trainning session, and have some carbs postworkout of my lifting and mma sessions. Il also prob have some greek yogurt or cottage cheese in the evenings all of this while maintaining my carbs at about 50g.. im in ketosis as i type this and my muscles are extremely sore im not recovering as fast as normal my mouth feels dry as fuck no matter how much i hydrate, im still performing well, although thats due more to a pride issue as i refuse to let down my trainers when rolling, working bag/pads, or sparring.. but yeah it kinda sucks

It doesn't have to suck.

I understand the thinking that we 'eat to refuel' and 'do what it takes'. But food can be enjoyable no matter what your goals are.

If you're not recovering then something isn't working. I've been low carb for quite sometime now, I recover better than ever, I train better, everything works and I love the ay I eat. If it didn't work for me I wouldn't do it.

Recovery and Performance are both about diet and rest. If you're sleeping enough then you've got to look at the diet. Do you need more protein, more fat, are you eating enough greens. Does your body simply need more carbs to operate efficiently for your demands.

Other than major weigh cuts and some transition periods I don't think anything should suck. You should feel sore enough to know you pushed your limits, but not sore to a point you feel you can't recover in time to get going the next session.