Where to go to train BJJ at Olympic level intensity

[Cid]

What?

Rickson quote. It's in here somewhere.

 

[Uchi Mata]

That is true but I think that could be a moot point because Maia and Jacare both showed they could neutralize the grappling of numerous wrestlers and judoka at the Olympic level even if said wrestlers or judoka were superior athletes. And it sure seemed like it was the BJJ training that they had to have obtained somewhere that allowed them to do this. This shows how athleticism also has to be expanded to include skill level too; it was the combination of skills and other athletic components that Jacare and Maia did develop that allowed them to, at least in an MMA fight scenario, pick apart piece by piece quite a few Olympic level wrestlers and judoka who may have had more speed and power.

So to go back to an original question, working from the notion that a BJJ training center gave Maia and Jacare the kind of skills they needed, where would such training centers exist in the US and what would be some possible names of some of them?

If you think that, then there's not really an independent definition of athleticism.

Personally I think athleticism and skill are totally separate things and there are few if any really A level athelets in BJJ. Jacare, Galvao, maybe Buchecha. That's about it. BJJ is a sport that rewards technique more than athleticism, as opposed to something like track which is almost 100% athleticism or basketball which is more of a mix.

If you want a training center where you're going to have A level athletes training like Olympians, there isn't one. If you want a training center where you can acquire high level skills in an intense training environment, Atos, AOJ, Cicero Costha, Checkmat HQ, or any of the GB gyms owned by their top competitors (Braulio, Romulo, Otavio wherever he ends up), or Alliance HQ in Atlanta or Sao Paulo are your best bets. I've heard the training is also very intense at Marcelo's in NYC, Cobrinha's in LA, and Renzo's in NYC.

 

[Normot]

Rod1: Do you have a link to that study about local competitors being just as athletic as international competitors? I believe it, I just need to see it and I am having trouble finding it.

 

[Pro Killer]

Rod1: Do you have a link to that study about local competitors being just as athletic as international competitors? I believe it, I just need to see it and I am having trouble finding it.

I'd also like to see this study please?

Also I'm very disappointed Holt isn't planning on opening up a gym. Even though I live in a different country I would've moved to the states to train there and I'm 33% serious!

 

[Kalma]

Olympic athletes as i have said, at least in the sport of judo, dont have the freak athleticism that you see in physical sports, as i have said there are studies that show that they are really not stronger or faster than their non-olympic counterparts, they just have far far better judo.

Yes,yes,yes!!! As mentioned here, at this level the small things are making the difference. So the general physical attributes are not going to be making too much of a significant difference between those that are selected for the wider Olympic training squads (provided the pool to select from is large enough)

Also you have to realize that olympic athletes are extremely specialized and periodized to win specific tournaments....

And again yes, yes , yes!!!

Those selected to train in wider Olympic squads are pooled together to be the best a country can provide. This does not happen in BJJ, and to the best of my knowledge the R&D involved with Olympic teams/athletes is not present in BJJ.

eg Team A may have a handful of world class BJJ athletes amongst it ranks. Team B may have 1, Team C has 3, Team has 0 etc etc / So the high caliber athletes are scattered amongst different locations. Where as an Olympic training facilty is concentrated. i.e all the athlketes in the same place for the same purpose with the same resources.

For a BJJ team the question is where and how is said team going to get the funding and resources to design and structure a plan similar to an Olympic prep plan , how will they fund R&D etc etc ?

Not to say it wont happen and I believe there will be a time where it does, just not in the near future.

So for the OP I guess the question shoudl be "where can you get the highest level of BJJ training ?" and not neccessarliy compare it to Olympic training....

but I do like the idea and look forward to a future where it does occur.

In fact, it remind me of another though I often have , why doesn't the country I live in produce a world champ ?? It's not the level of athletic ability , because lets face it, I'm confident the majority of countries have someone in them that demonstrates the same physical qualities as those that are at the top ....is it the coaching ? the level of competition in the country ? the mindset ? and on the questions go

 

[deadlizard]

Come to my gym. I guarantee you I can give you a level of intensity that an Olympic level wrestler brings. Moving to socal in the next 2 months.

Where in So Cal exactly?

 

[Rod1]

Rod1: Do you have a link to that study about local competitors being just as athletic as international competitors? I believe it, I just need to see it and I am having trouble finding it.

Here is one between the A team and the reserves

http://www.judoliitto.fi/site/asset...l_profile_of_the_brazilian_male_judo_team.pdf

The other one im having trouble finding it complete, so ill post the abstract.

http://www.researchgate.net/publica...NCES_BETWEEN_ELITE_AND_NON-ELITE_JUDO_PLAYERS

Notice that non-elite refers to competitors that participate in national tournaments in Brazil but dont win, not your recreational judoka.

 

[Kalma]

The other one im having trouble finding it complete, so ill post the abstract.

http://www.researchgate.net/publica...NCES_BETWEEN_ELITE_AND_NON-ELITE_JUDO_PLAYERS

It is a 2005 article published in Biology of Sport
...Biology of Sport 2005: Vol. 22 Issue 4. p. 315-328 if you want specifics

 

[Ivaylo Ivanov]

Here is one between the A team and the reserves

http://www.judoliitto.fi/site/asset...l_profile_of_the_brazilian_male_judo_team.pdf

The other one im having trouble finding it complete, so ill post the abstract.

http://www.researchgate.net/publica...NCES_BETWEEN_ELITE_AND_NON-ELITE_JUDO_PLAYERS

Notice that non-elite refers to competitors that participate in national tournaments in Brazil but dont win, not your recreational judoka.

I'm sorry, but I will have to disagree.
In my opinion, Brazil has never been a country with great development in strength and conditioning for any Olympic sport.
Particularly in judo, they follow the Japanese way of preparation (might be because of the huge Japanese diaspora living there).
I don't believe you would find the same results, if you compare athletes from Germany, Russia and a few other countries, well known for their research in the field of athlete preparation. Have witnessed first hand world and Olympic level athletes conditioning and they have nothing to do with the middle level practitioner. Even comparing only the nutrition plans (yes, steroids included).

 

[Dirty Holt]

Where in So Cal exactly?

Somewhere in between Temecula and IE/Chino Hills. Need to find a coaching gig outside of HS wrestling

 

[emax]

Somewhere in between Temecula and IE/Chino Hills. Need to find a coaching gig outside of HS wrestling

If you are coaching high school wrestling, why is that not doing it for you? need greener pastures or need to be with wrestlers who have more of your experience?

 

[Kalma]

I'm sorry, but I will have to disagree.
In my opinion, Brazil has never been a country with great development in strength and conditioning for any Olympic sport.
Particularly in judo, they follow the Japanese way of preparation (might be because of the huge Japanese diaspora living there).
I don't believe you would find the same results, if you compare athletes from Germany, Russia and a few other countries, well known for their research in the field of athlete preparation. Have witnessed first hand world and Olympic level athletes conditioning and they have nothing to do with the middle level practitioner. Even comparing only the nutrition plans (yes, steroids included).

I'm interested in what you have to say ,but I don't quite get what you are disagreeing with , can you clarify??? Also I don't 100% get you are trying to say .You state Brazil never has been a country with great development in S&C for any Olympic sport..but that isn't the point of the linked articles. In the first linked article it is comparing the A-Team athletes to the B and C-team athletes (the latter are the reserves) i.e all participants are from Brazil so the comparison is only between Brazilian judoka.

 

[Kalma]

OP, perhaps you could try and make your training more intense and 'elite' focussed to the best of your abilities and with what resources you have.

Do you have an S&C coach, have you done some research into periodization, been to a nutritionist, got a recovery plan, have a massage or physical therapist ? etc .

 

[Pirat]

Come to Poland (National Cup this weekend over a thousand competitors and still growing

 

[Ivaylo Ivanov]

I'm interested in what you have to say ,but I don't quite get what you are disagreeing with , can you clarify??? Also I don't 100% get you are trying to say .You state Brazil never has been a country with great development in S&C for any Olympic sport..but that isn't the point of the linked articles. In the first linked article it is comparing the A-Team athletes to the B and C-team athletes (the latter are the reserves) i.e all participants are from Brazil so the comparison is only between Brazilian judoka.

The studies are done with brazilian judokas, even if brazilians have never been known to excel in the conditioning of their athletes.
The topic is for training center with Olympic intensity (AKA conditioning, Im leaving the confusion of the author regarding technical skills on the side).
If I would like to make a study regarding winter sports, I woudlnt publish results from Uganda.

 

[Lobo]

Somewhere in between Temecula and IE/Chino Hills. Need to find a coaching gig outside of HS wrestling

Open mats Sundays at Carlson Gracie Temecula. I'd love to roll with you bro. It's usually gi but we can do whatever. I'll bring no-gi gear.

 

[Dirty Holt]

Open mats Sundays at Carlson Gracie Temecula. I'd love to roll with you bro. It's usually gi but we can do whatever. I'll bring no-gi gear.

I only train nogi maybe 3 times a week and gi at least 6. Wrestling doesnt really count as nogi. I looked up CS Temecula today, seemed ok. Wonder if anyone around would hire a brown belt with slightly above average wrestling skills?

If you are coaching high school wrestling, why is that not doing it for you? need greener pastures or need to be with wrestlers who have more of your experience?

I coach HS wrestling because its an easy 4k a year and I owe the wrestling community. I am leaving because it has been sunny less than 3 times since October. Its been over 70 three times since September. California pays exactly double for a teachers salary and rent is more expensive here than IE to boot.

 

[ironwolf]

I only train nogi maybe 3 times a week and gi at least 6. Wrestling doesnt really count as nogi. I looked up CS Temecula today, seemed ok. Wonder if anyone around would hire a brown belt with slightly above average wrestling skills?



I coach HS wrestling because its an easy 4k a year and I owe the wrestling community. I am leaving because it has been sunny less than 3 times since October. Its been over 70 three times since September. California pays exactly double for a teachers salary and rent is more expensive here than IE to boot.

So your going to be a teacher???...in the USA???

 

[German Supplex]

Let's say I wanted to find a place where I can train BJJ at the intensity and with grappler's of a similar caliber and athleticism that one would find for Olympic medalists in wrestling or Judo

You won't find it because such a thing does not exist and your premise that BJJ is an intense combat sport is inaccurate.

Have you ever seen high level matches? Many of them are very slow to mid paced (especially in the gi), not very explosive or intense. So asking for intense BJJ training is a bit of an oxymoron.

 

[Uchi Mata]

You won't find it because such a thing does not exist and your premise that BJJ is an intense combat sport is inaccurate.

Have you ever seen high level matches? Many of them are very slow to mid paced (especially in the gi), not very explosive or intense. So asking for intense BJJ training is a bit of an oxymoron.

Totally wrong. They look slow, but the level of effort being expended by both competitors to maintain the balance is immense. You see the same thing in all grappling sports. Clinching in freestyle wrestling can look pretty slow and dull, but there's a lot of energy being expended the entire time. BJJ can be light, easy rolling, or it can be intense. It's not inherent to the art that matches or sparring are low intensity. Confusing tons of constant motion with intensity is pretty shallow.