When to go pro

ya i'm just saying, like football and other sports have semi-pro leagues for the level of pay that most fighters get, maybe we should call them semi-pro...

honestly i'd probably just stay an amateur until i got discovered by a real promotion.
bellator contracts start at 6-10k to show, and the same to win. UFC is about the same. You generally have to be at a gym or with a team/manager who knows the right people to get your shot in a big show. You’ll still need a few pro wins at least to get there unless you are a super star in a different combat sport. Otherwise you have to grind out 8-10 wins with good stoppages and keep your losses down to 1 or 2 and earn your way in the old fashioned way.
 
I was an amateur until I retired from combat sports 2 years ago aged 27 lol. I left it too late to bother going pro. After I got stopped in the 1st round of my last fight (via referee stoppage and body shots, I was just completely outmatched and also outweighed by 15lbs because my trainer/manager/fight finder told me it was only going to be a 6lb weight difference when I took the fight on a days notice.) I knew I'd never fight again.

My advice is, Go pro the moment you're confident in your abilities. Don't go pro when people tell you you're ready, but when you feel you're ready. Last thing you want to do is regret not going pro when you're older. (or having that sweet sweet boxrec to show off).
27...bro you're still young and plenty of time to go pro...especially if pro only means a few hundred dollars per fight
 
ya i'm just saying, like football and other sports have semi-pro leagues for the level of pay that most fighters get, maybe we should call them semi-pro...

honestly i'd probably just stay an amateur until i got discovered by a real promotion.
Combat sports is so niche that it'll be awhile before there are offical titles for pro and semi-pro. Majority of people I've come across in life in the sport that are pro, are semi-pro

27...bro you're still young and plenty of time to go pro...especially if pro only means a few hundred dollars per fight
I dunno, 27 is a bit late, when you see at the door peeps who are 20-23 with 6+ fights under their belt being the avg, 27's a bit late. Not too late, but a sprint to catch up

I was an amateur until I retired from combat sports 2 years ago aged 27 lol. I left it too late to bother going pro. After I got stopped in the 1st round of my last fight (via referee stoppage and body shots, I was just completely outmatched and also outweighed by 15lbs because my trainer/manager/fight finder told me it was only going to be a 6lb weight difference when I took the fight on a days notice.) I knew I'd never fight again.

My advice is, Go pro the moment you're confident in your abilities. Don't go pro when people tell you you're ready, but when you feel you're ready. Last thing you want to do is regret not going pro when you're older. (or having that sweet sweet boxrec to show off).
A good indicator is when you KO people in your ammy days frequently. Waiting out on that is basically ducking pro, of which I know a few who are like that. The issue is controlling type coaches who don't know what the fuck they're doing and waiting for the perfect time for your debut. Of course when they've wasted half your career's life, they just learn the mistake and move on to the next 19 year old hot shot that walks in their door.

bellator contracts start at 6-10k to show, and the same to win. UFC is about the same. You generally have to be at a gym or with a team/manager who knows the right people to get your shot in a big show. You’ll still need a few pro wins at least to get there unless you are a super star in a different combat sport. Otherwise you have to grind out 8-10 wins with good stoppages and keep your losses down to 1 or 2 and earn your way in the old fashioned way.
Yeah, a few of my mates have fought on KOTC and still to me seems like dog shit when we're looking at a livable income ($1500 : $2500), and that's a gateway promotion that's been in the industry since forever.
MMA is more forgiving than boxing though, overall higher pay outside of the top superstars, and its more who you have wins over than forging the perfect record.
 
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27...bro you're still young and plenty of time to go pro...especially if pro only means a few hundred dollars per fight

Over here you earn about $1000.00 per fight as a 0-0 fighter. Of course by the time you've paid cornermen you get about $600.00 this is AUD not USD.
I'm 29 now and the fire is completely gone, I've been competing since I was 12. I'm just burnt out I guess, I don't even watch the fights anymore unless it's Canelo, Pacquiao or Rosado fighting.
 
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Over here you earn about $1000.00 per fight as a 0-0 fighter. Of course by the time you've paid cornermen you get about $600.00 this is AUD not USD.
I'm 29 now and the fire is completely gone, I've been competing since I was 12. I'm just burnt out I guess, I don't even watch the fights anymore unless it's Canelo, Pacquiao or Rosado fighting.
if the fire isn't there then thats different lol.
 
Combat sports is so niche that it'll be awhile before there are offical titles for pro and semi-pro. Majority of people I've come across in life in the sport that are pro, are semi-pro


I dunno, 27 is a bit late, when you see at the door peeps who are 20-23 with 6+ fights under their belt being the avg, 27's a bit late. Not too late, but a sprint to catch up


A good indicator is when you KO people in your ammy days frequently. Waiting out on that is basically ducking pro, of which I know a few who are like that. The issue is controlling type coaches who don't know what the fuck they're doing and waiting for the perfect time for your debut. Of course when they've wasted half your career's life, they just learn the mistake and move on to the next 19 year old hot shot that walks in their door.


Yeah, a few of my mates have fought on KOTC and still to me seems like dog shit when we're looking at a livable income ($1500 : $2500), and that's a gateway promotion that's been in the industry since forever.
MMA is more forgiving than boxing though, overall higher pay outside of the top superstars, and its more who you have wins over than forging the perfect record.
KOTC is 300-700 to show, same if you win. They do let you keep 20% of the cash you make selling tickets though which helps if you can hustle.
 
I don't know about boxing but it's almost impossible to live off regional MMA without having at least a part time job on the side.

It is possible if you manage to be a big local draw with a big following and sell a lot of tickets and manage to find sponsors with money who are willing to support you (this part is key). It's rare but I've seen a few guys manage to do it over the years. I've never been one of those guys though I've always had a full time job and just trained after work.

For reference my winnings from my last fight:
1800$ show
1800$ win
Ticket sale commission 10$ per ticket x 100 tickets = 1000$
Sponsors = $500 (family friend with money gave me 500$ to put his company logo on my shorts and walkout shirt.)

Total = 5100$

I got injured and only fought once that year so that was my total earnings for the year. Even if I fought 4 times and won each time I'd still be making like 22000/year, pretty much living in poverty.
 
I don't know about boxing but it's almost impossible to live off regional MMA without having at least a part time job on the side.

It is possible if you manage to be a big local draw with a big following and sell a lot of tickets and manage to find sponsors with money who are willing to support you (this part is key). It's rare but I've seen a few guys manage to do it over the years. I've never been one of those guys though I've always had a full time job and just trained after work.

For reference my winnings from my last fight:
1800$ show
1800$ win
Ticket sale commission 10$ per ticket x 100 tickets = 1000$
Sponsors = $500 (family friend with money gave me 500$ to put his company logo on my shorts and walkout shirt.)

Total = 5100$

I got injured and only fought once that year so that was my total earnings for the year. Even if I fought 4 times and won each time I'd still be making like 22000/year, pretty much living in poverty.
thats 22000 before taxes, gym dues, paying your coaches, corner, cut man, management, etc
 
thats 22000 before taxes, gym dues, paying your coaches, corner, cut man, management, etc
Yea its shit pay, I don't blame the promoters though their not making bank either it's just the nature of the business there's just not a lot of money in smaller promotions. I've been pretty lucky too in that I have almost always fought locally and been able to sell tickets so the promoter wants me to fight. If your an out of town fighter being brought in to lose to the local guy you can expect to make less being that the promoter will have to pay for your travel and hotel for you and your corner man.
 
I work with a good number of pros and only one who didn’t have a day job. His wife made a ton of cash so he could train to his hearts content

I think a lot of guys despite working still get support in other ways. My buddy works fulltime, trains fight and coaches, even has a kid, but lives with his parents. Which is a big help. Even just small things people overlook. Stopping by the store to run errands and buy things you ran out of at home after a long day of work and a long night of training just turned your 14 hour day into a 15 hour day.

Training was so much easier when I was younger and worked part time.

When I didn't work and trained 2 x day, I was always 1 of 2 places. In the gym, or asleep.
 
If your an out of town fighter being brought in to lose to the local guy you can expect to make less being that the promoter will have to pay for your travel and hotel for you and your corner man.
That's pretty lucky already. I still remember most of my pro teammates still having to shell out for travel and hotel costs

It's a bit harder for us up north to get fights in American shows becuase promos usually try to squeeze out locals who have no standards willing to fight for 300:600
 
Combat sports is so niche that it'll be awhile before there are offical titles for pro and semi-pro. Majority of people I've come across in life in the sport that are pro, are semi-pro


I dunno, 27 is a bit late, when you see at the door peeps who are 20-23 with 6+ fights under their belt being the avg, 27's a bit late. Not too late, but a sprint to catch up


A good indicator is when you KO people in your ammy days frequently. Waiting out on that is basically ducking pro, of which I know a few who are like that. The issue is controlling type coaches who don't know what the fuck they're doing and waiting for the perfect time for your debut. Of course when they've wasted half your career's life, they just learn the mistake and move on to the next 19 year old hot shot that walks in their door.


Yeah, a few of my mates have fought on KOTC and still to me seems like dog shit when we're looking at a livable income ($1500 : $2500), and that's a gateway promotion that's been in the industry since forever.
MMA is more forgiving than boxing though, overall higher pay outside of the top superstars, and its more who you have wins over than forging the perfect record.
i'm 30 now and figured if i won the TBA-SA event i'd make a serious consideration at trying to go pro, still at that mind set even though this year's event got cancelled meaning i'll have my first sanctioned full contact fight at 31. i'm a realist chances of me making some big time like ONE are unlikely, but if i can pack in a few 'professional' fights between now and the time i'm 40 that would be cool if for no other reason to say i was a professional fighter when i was younger lol
 
That's pretty lucky already. I still remember most of my pro teammates still having to shell out for travel and hotel costs

It's a bit harder for us up north to get fights in American shows becuase promos usually try to squeeze out locals who have no standards willing to fight for 300:600
ya one of the worst things about american culture that i've learned from my gf is that we've been brainwashed to think we're pretty worthless, particularly if we don't have a degree, and even more so if you're not in a traditional trade, leading to americans just being grateful and thinking they're lucky if they get to make $300-600 doing something they love.
 
Boxe is a bit different.
If you are an A side guy, there still depends how irl they wish to handle you.
You sell tickets, bring attention, do have some value locally + preferably someone wish invest in your development.
Calculated value that you bring to promotion in this event - part of this to event's prom's expenses – opponents purse = sum.....
The problem is that the higher ranked and with better record your opponent will be, the more he will cost for event's promoter.
Short notice too not rarerly adds price.
& then ofc also is preferable to properly select these opponents.
In B side price depends from record, last fights record and ranking + plenty of other variables.
It is possible to win, usually if you are able finish the guy.
They usually properly select B side guys and to win on cards rarerly is possible too, if you are on B side.
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Still, yeah, sometimes B side guys gets more than a prospect because prospect needs bump up.
The better ranked opponent you will have, the more expensive training and longer prep will be needed, this makes expenses higher than in lowest levels.
However since an opponent in better level will cost more, if you bring in the same sum as previously, you might get lesser than perviously for bums bangup if you also then sold a lot of tickets etc.
If you wish not to become a journeyman, better perpare invest more than you will get from fights, at least during first year - two years - 2 1/2 years.
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MMA too in smaller promotions might happen pretty different, like with boxing.
Sometimes might be better to pick up easy fight with guy you can bang up for 500 than dangerous opponent for 1500 for example.
Sometimes is valuable better to pay opponent more and agree with lesser payment than he will get, also accept more dangeros fight if you are sure that you will beat him up. With pro MMA loss will not be that career impacting than pro boxing, sometimes better is not to accept offer in pro boxing than agree, regardless how lucrative it might sound and regret then whole life.
pro MMA usually records are less important, u now are 22 and had lost to someone when you were 18? No one will judge that harsh, okey, guy is for example 12-2 now and last 8 fights had won? Possibly next top prospect, let's look who he had fought?
the same record for pro boxer if he did not had fought big names or at least in top 100 might mean very bad impact on career.
MMA ofc is a big risk due to injuries risk : get damaged.
/ a pro boxer not rarerly does have some other income, preferably work in gym etc alike, plus support from parents, relatives, good if some investor + some sponsors.
There ofc everything depends and sponsors might be not less harsh than fans. Prefereable is to support undefeated guy, some beginners might have some support from local supplements ( legal ) or / and sprot equipment sales business, not rarerly it is their stuff with discount or for free in exchange of a bit advertise them etc, allow list that they support you etc.
& higher ranked and especially well known guys might get a lot from such deals, not well known: good if discounts etc.
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In pro mma record numbers doesn't matters that much like in boxing.
In pro boxing these B side guys not rarerly get not lesser purse than if they fought in hometown, might be even higher + paid travel + hotel. This ofc reduces sum that is possible to pay to the A side guy. :(
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Paid sparring partners usually gets purse for gig + travel and accomodation expenses covered + perks ( paid meals etc ).
Therefore for a pro more comfortable is to be in large country with dense population and a lot of athletes.
If a pro is in smaller country and not close to large countries, this increases expenses on sparring, training camps.
U then travel aboard or pay them to travel to your location and help you to improve, spar etc.
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Yeah, in US happens pro boxing fights for 200 or even 100 bucks too. If bearing in mind how dangerous for career is even 1 loss on cards, it is ridiculous. Unless opponent is very easily to beatup with almost 0 risk.
 
i'm 30 now and figured if i won the TBA-SA event i'd make a serious consideration at trying to go pro, still at that mind set even though this year's event got cancelled meaning i'll have my first sanctioned full contact fight at 31. i'm a realist chances of me making some big time like ONE are unlikely, but if i can pack in a few 'professional' fights between now and the time i'm 40 that would be cool if for no other reason to say i was a professional fighter when i was younger lol
TBA is a fun tournament, I've seen some LOLz there though, I remember one guy bringing and IV in after weighing in. I mean It technically legal, but I mean c'mon man, all that for an ammy tournament? Then there was the other time just for kicks looking at the FBI's website for most wanted, and a guy who fought on TBA was wanted for financial fraud or cyber crimes. Diff name, but it was the exact same display pic. FUCKING LOL

Their belts are nice, my favorite ones were the 2014 and 2016 ones.
 
Looks that in US this might help get clients as a coach/ trainer/ instructor too.
i decided to enter to just for the experience and to have a record, i'm confident i could end an ammy tournament no worse than 1-1, but wanted to start having a bit of a record because ya, if people see a good record it will make you more desirable to them as an instructor.
 
Never, unless you're the top 10%

Avg starting pay of $600-1000 per fight. 3-5x a year. Local hero gets better down the line I guess, clearing $2-5k; and that's actually pushing it. Still worse than a 16 year old working part time at McDonalds or Starbucks

Exactly this. Even with the top 10%, it happens where you can get injured in a freak accident and not be able to make money for a long time (ex. Dominick Cruz, TJ Grant, and the list goes on)
 
I think a lot of guys despite working still get support in other ways. My buddy works fulltime, trains fight and coaches, even has a kid, but lives with his parents. Which is a big help. Even just small things people overlook. Stopping by the store to run errands and buy things you ran out of at home after a long day of work and a long night of training just turned your 14 hour day into a 15 hour day.

Training was so much easier when I was younger and worked part time.

When I didn't work and trained 2 x day, I was always 1 of 2 places. In the gym, or asleep.
I tell all my new amateurs 4 things in order to give themselves the opportunity to succeed:

1. find a job that doesn’t get in the way of training.

2. stay out of debt. No credit cards, no car payments, nothing. The lower your monthly nut is The more time you will have to train.

3. Don’t get pregnant, and don’t get anybody else pregnant.

4. If you are going to date somebody and make sure they don’t hate that you fight. Also make sure that they don’t love that you fight. Find a partner who doesn’t really care, that’s the sweet spot
 

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