Movies What's your thoughts on Joaquin Phoenix Oscar speech?

[Bloody Pulp]

 

[God_Emperor_Of_Mankind]

If he's a great actor fine ok he's a great actor. I'll watch him act in movies. That doesn't mean he's a great human being. I'll try taking advice from elsewhere, thanks.

 

[General_Speckz]

On the whole, I would say coyotes and foxes have much better lives than cows and chickens. One day their luck runs out and they get a bullet through the heart, but up until then, not too bad. Even setting aside the quality of life the whole way through, I'd rather go out like a coyote, fox or feral pig than the way most livestock does.

I don't think Joaquin thinks he's 100% correct or most animal activists for that matter. They're just aware of the horrors that happen within the industry and have chosen to speak out about it. Like you yourself mentioned about the caged chickens having their beaks cut off, that's not even scratching the surface of what actually goes on within the live stock industry.

It's all what about what matters to you as an invividual. We can't all see things the same.

Can you guys enlighten me? I've actually lived on a farm for a while (no animals, that's a ranch) and helped some other ranchers feed cows, and even do some branding and so forth. (Don't take this to mean I'm a country boy at the core. ) They seemed like they were treated pragmatically, though these were small ranches and not the big ones.

The cows I saw had big open fields to graze and huge salt licks. Looked like heaven compared to being a foraging fox or coyote.

 

[FinalFight]

Can you guys enlighten me? I've actually lived on a farm for a while (no animals, that's a ranch) and helped some other ranchers feed cows, and even do some branding and so forth. (Don't take this to mean I'm a country boy at the core. ) They seemed like they were treated pragmatically, though these were small ranches and not the big ones.

The cows I saw had big open fields to graze and huge salt licks. Looked like heaven compared to being a foraging fox or coyote.

I don't think a cow needs to go through this so I can have milk with my cereal. Pretty much that simple really.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

These celebs are all delusional. They make millions upon millions of dollars, have circle jerk award shows every other month to praise themselves. They get on stage and want to tell your Average Joe how he/she should live their lives.

No one has given a speech like that in the Oscars ever. So he set a precedent.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

If he's a great actor fine ok he's a great actor. I'll watch him act in movies. That doesn't mean he's a great human being. I'll try taking advice from elsewhere, thanks.

What did he say that was bad?

 

[supnmunm]

I don't think a cow needs to go through this so I can have milk with my cereal. Pretty much that simple really.

Not to mention that this is the best of the best as far as farm conditions go. 99% of it is factory farmed shit where the animals suffer horribly. Unfortunately those farms will always be around simply because of the demand, there's just too many people who want to eat animal products and not enough room for free range grass fed yada yada. I recommend people watches Joaquin's other film "Dominion" to get a good look at the reality of animal agriculture.. ag gag laws exist for a reason.

 

[General_Speckz]

I don't think a cow needs to go through this so I can have milk with my cereal. Pretty much that simple really.

I mean I guess you could prefer the mother see her calf ripped apart by wolves. Or, never having been alive at all. Shrug

This is what we usually eat:

Here's a cow licking a salt block - timestamped (music is a little different)



Look at those fuckers go. Betchya a wild cow looks at that and says FML.

 

[BisexualMMA]

Can you guys enlighten me? I've actually lived on a farm for a while (no animals, that's a ranch) and helped some other ranchers feed cows, and even do some branding and so forth. (Don't take this to mean I'm a country boy at the core. ) They seemed like they were treated pragmatically, though these were small ranches and not the big ones.

The cows I saw had big open fields to graze and huge salt licks. Looked like heaven compared to being a foraging fox or coyote.

It probably goes without saying that there is a wide range in terms of quality of life for a chicken or cow, depending on the farm / setting and the owner / corporation.

I suppose you could say I was applying the veil of ignorance.

If you could be born into the life of the average randomly selected coyote, or the randomly selected chicken or cow (with the appropriate chance of being on a relatively benevolent farm and also the appropriate chance of ending up on a production line horror show) which would you choose?

 

[bref]

For Hollywood, I thought it wasn't bad. He seems a lot smarter and more grounded than most celebs. He didn't just stand at the front and basically say 'orange man bad' like most.

 

[FinalFight]

I mean I guess you could prefer the mother see her calf ripped apart by wolves. Or, never having been alive at all. Shrug

This is what we usually eat:

Here's a cow licking a salt block - timestamped (music is a little different)



Look at those fuckers go. Betchya a wild cow looks at that and says FML.

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around your logic in regards to the animals at least having a better life on a farm than they would in the wild or never being alive at all. Do you think if a human is brought into this world to be a slave that at least that life was better than no life? Could a slave master make that argument? And we don't let the cows just live out their lives after they've stopped having their calfs taken from them, They'll be bolt gunned or stunned with electrical prods in the head and have their throat cut. If people were to stop consuming dairy products it would be a gradual process taking years, then all we'd have to do is stop breeding the cows and then there wouldn't be lots of cows wandering in the wild or whatever.

Not to mention that this is the best of the best as far as farm conditions go. 99% of it is factory farmed shit where the animals suffer horribly. Unfortunately those farms will always be around simply because of the demand, there's just too many people who want to eat animal products and not enough room for free range grass fed yada yada. I recommend people watches Joaquin's other film "Dominion" to get a good look at the reality of animal agriculture.. ag gag laws exist for a reason.

Yes, you're right. That looks like a nice place compared to most dairy farms.

This is an industrial dairy farm and where most dairy products come from.

 

[General_Speckz]

It probably goes without saying that there is a wide range in terms of quality of life for a chicken or cow, depending on the farm / setting and the owner / corporation.

I suppose you could say I was applying the veil of ignorance.

If you could be born into the life of the average randomly selected coyote, or the randomly selected chicken or cow (with the appropriate chance of being on a relatively benevolent farm and also the appropriate chance of ending up on a production line horror show) which would you choose?

Bingo.

But, it also depends on if the big cattle farms are even very "immoral" or are just "pragmatic". Just reading some websites, the people trying to demonize the cattle industry are throwing out all these terms like "metabolic disorders". Like, Ok, they're American, of course they have metabolic disorders, lol. If you want to convince me don't muddy the water with shit that doesn't really matter.

The veal situation is pretty bad, but those guys only live for about 4 months, anyway. Just don't drink milk and don't eat hotdogs, I suppose. I was drinking milk recently because there was no organic alternative milks at our stores, but now it seems there are. Organic gets to be expensive, though, too... But, in this case probably worth it from a moral standpoint. Not sure about meat, cattle will be slaughtered regardless of dairy farmers.

Thanks for the dialogue.

 

[General_Speckz]

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around your logic in regards to the animals at least having a better life on a farm than they would in the wild or never being alive at all. Do you think if a human is brought into this world to be a slave that at least that life was better than no life? Could a slave master make that argument? And we don't let the cows just live out their lives after they've stopped having their calfs taken from them, They'll be bolt gunned or stunned with electrical prods in the head and have their throat cut. If people were to stop consuming dairy products it would be a gradual process taking years, then all we'd have to do is stop breeding the cows and then there wouldn't be lots of cows wandering in the wild or whatever.

I mean humans are forced to go to school for at least the first 10-12 years of their lives? Does that sound like freedom to you because they get to go home at the end of the day? Not saying its slavery, but just throwing that out there first to get the gears working as to what we are actually contrasting, here.

Also, we're not really making the cows a "slave", they're more like imprisoned. They don't have to necessarily "work" for us. We do all the work, they just sit around and eat and get milked and so forth.

We're getting divided in the points we're talking about here, but to address the last sentence, yes I'm saying a wild cow isn't necessarily going to be happier being wild. In fact, I would bet if most cows were sentient they would choose the farm life! Look at those salt licks, all the food you can eat, and protection against predators, baby! Sure, you don't get to raise your calf, but who wants to raise a calf that might get eaten by wolves nightmarishly right in front of your face!

But again, it depends if we're talking about small farms or nightmare factory farms, and what part of a cow's life is spent on either.

Yes, you're right. That looks like a nice place compared to most dairy farms.

This is an industrial dairy farm and where most dairy products come from. I'm more disturbed by living in small spaces for years than I am about a calf being taken away. Just like I'm more disturbed by a small calf having to live 4 months in a box... Separation isn't as big of a deal as just living in a tiny prison.

I addressed the dairy issue, and I have to agree with you that it doesn't really make sense to drink dairy, morally. Thanks for replying.

 

[God_Emperor_Of_Mankind]

What did he say that was bad?

He seems like an insufferable prick. That's just my opinion though. He's got his head shoved far up his own ass. Again I don't give a shit about actors in general. You'll never see me praise them. The average doctor or engineer in your community contributes more to humanity than these self important millionaires.

 

[FinalFight]

I mean humans are forced to go to school for at least the first 10-12 years of their lives? Does that sound like freedom to you because they get to go home at the end of the day? Not saying its slavery, but just throwing that out there first to get the gears working as to what we are actually contrasting, here.

Also, we're not really making the cows a "slave", they're more like imprisoned. They don't have to necessarily "work" for us. We do all the work, they just sit around and eat and get milked and so forth.

We're getting divided in the points we're talking about here, but to address the last sentence, yes I'm saying a wild cow isn't necessarily going to be happier being wild. In fact, I would bet if most cows were sentient they would choose the farm life! Look at those salt licks, all the food you can eat, and protection against predators, baby! Sure, you don't get to raise your calf, but who wants to raise a calf that might get eaten by wolves nightmarishly right in front of your face!





I addressed the dairy issue, and I have to agree with you that it doesn't really make sense to drink dairy, morally.

Cows are born into farms, they don't live in the wild. If we didn't raise these animals in farms they wouldn't be alive to begin with. We're not raising these animals to give them the gift of life, we're raising them as a product. They exist purely for our own use.

In regards to humans owning animals, I have no issue with that if they see the animal as a companion or if the animal is a guide dog for example. So, I could see someone owning a cow that they keep as a sort of pet but they treat it as a companion.

 

[closequarters]

Award shows are boring so I welcome speeches where they don’t just thank a bunch of people.

 

[squeezewax]

Actors should just shut up, each one is a no one.

I've never understood why actors[pretenders] are held so highly in society? I'm sure if the ones we see weren't paid such big amounts of money people wouldn't feel quite the same about them. I think to be an actor you have to have some kind of mental disability. To spend your career pretending to be people you aren't is ridiculous.
I find it hard to see well known actors in roles as anything else but actors. Here's 'so and so' in yet another role that we're supposed to believe in.
I hate the bastards!

 

[General_Speckz]

Cows are born into farms, they don't live in the wild. If we didn't raise these animals in farms they wouldn't be alive to begin with. We're not raising these animals to give them the gift of life, we're raising them as a product. They exist purely for our own use.

In regards to humans owning animals, I have no issue with that if they see the animal as a companion or if the animal is a guide dog for example. So, I could see someone owning a cow that they keep as a sort of pet but they treat it as a companion.

I'm saying it doesn't matter if we're raising them to be... competitors in a cow bodybuilding contest!

They get the gift of life (and pain of life) regardless. Intent only goes so far.

 

[Streeter]

Was okay other than the vegan Peta shit.

 

[TeTe]

I mean I guess you could prefer the mother see her calf ripped apart by wolves. Or, never having been alive at all. Shrug

This is what we usually eat:

Here's a cow licking a salt block - timestamped (music is a little different)



Look at those fuckers go. Betchya a wild cow looks at that and says FML.

I buy the 96/4 grass fed from the store. Gotta keep it lean