What does Pettis have to do to surpass BJ Penn?

[TheComebackKid]

He already has. BJ isn't even top 5 at lw all time

BJ has 8 top 10 wins at LW plus 3 title defenses. He also beat 3 UFC/Pride champions at LW.

Please qualify your statement.

 

[Billthebutcher2]

Have 4-5 defenses and beat Aldo. I think Aldo wins though.

 

[ThunderStruck]

Chill out dude. BJ Penn had one of the best boxing, footwork, and head movement in the game. He's known for having one of the best jabs ever. He didn't start getting beat up til the Diaz fight. If you really want to compare Penn/Pettis then I say BJ finishing Hughes was bigger than Pettis sub'ing Bendo. BJ's early championship days were better than Pettis by far.

BJ had good boxing but footwork wasn't his thing. You say he had one of the best footwork. I say he had one of the worst footwork.

 

[jlazer]

BJ has 8 top 10 wins at LW plus 3 title defenses. He also beat 3 UFC/Pride champions at LW.

Please qualify your statement.

The guys you must be counting as top 10 weren't top 10.

Aoki
Gomi
Pettis
Bendo
Edgar

are all ahead of him.

 

[Uncommon Valor]

Keep winning.

 

[jlazer]

Have 4-5 defenses and beat Aldo. I think Aldo wins though.

Why? BJ didn't defend that many times

 

[BJ@LW&WW]

pettis has had one title defense so far, no?

he is the best lw in the world atm no doubt, but is far from exerting dominance over the division, let alone enough dominance to become the lw goat.

 

[TheComebackKid]

The guys you must be counting as top 10 weren't top 10.

Aoki
Gomi
Pettis
Bendo
Edgar

are all ahead of him.

They absolutely were. Thomas, Uno, Stevenson, Serra, Gomi, Sherk, Florian, Sanchez...all top 10 when BJ beat them.

So with all of these top 10 wins and title defenses how can you justify keeping him out of the top 5?

 

[613]

BJ is the best LW ever for the things he did outside LW. Weird but true.

Beating Hughes.

Beating GSP in the first fight (terrible decision)

Sakuraba.

machida.

etc.

How the fuck could anyone possibly score round 2 and 3 for Penn. Even round one was closer then people remember. BJ did most of his damage from an illegal eye poke (that was the reason GSP went to the hospital) and the one uppercut that clipped GSPs nose. Round one was Penns but rounds 2 and 3 were clearly GSPs.


And what GSP did outside of LW boosts his all time rankings but not his LW rankings

I have Penn as #1LW pretty clearly but not for any of your foolish reasons

 

[punky brewster]

After a bloody fight, he should lick his own gloves AND lick the tops of his feet.

 

[613]

When your one of the greats, your always going to have haters man. BJ haters look like fools when you open his career up. He's fought some of the most talented and dominating guys ranging from 155-170 his entire career. Not to mention he held gold in both WW and LW, AND fought Lyoto Machida. The former 205 champ and current 185 top contender.

Need I say more?

BJ did fight Machida and it was very impressive, but lets not pretend like Machida was even close to as good a fighter he is now

 

[ArtemV]

Chill out dude. BJ Penn had one of the best boxing, footwork, and head movement in the game. He's known for having one of the best jabs ever. He didn't start getting beat up til the Diaz fight. If you really want to compare Penn/Pettis then I say BJ finishing Hughes was bigger than Pettis sub'ing Bendo. BJ's early championship days were better than Pettis by far.

Ok, that was harsh. But I agree, but he just got tired (or unmotivated lol), he was real hard to beat when he was on his game, but as of 2010? He just started to lose pretty badly. But I rate Henderson > Hughes, Ben would finish Hughes pretty easily imo. He would beat Penn, but no finish.

 

[jlazer]

They absolutely were. Thomas, Uno, Stevenson, Serra, Gomi, Sherk, Florian, Sanchez...all top 10 when BJ beat them.

So with all of these top 10 wins and title defenses how can you justify keeping him out of the top 5?

How can you justify keeping who i listed out if the top 5? Not to mention Gil .

Uno had just lost twice,

it was Thomas' first fight in the ufc.

Sherk had like 1 fight at lw, against a non ranked fighter and hadn't fought in over a year .

Kenny Florian had never beat a top 10 fighter in his life.

Diego hadn't done anything at all at lw .

And this was when most the top fighters were outside the ufc.

So how can you call them top 10?

 

[adamsilva]

not lose to low level competition anymore. keep beating top guys

 

[613]

Penn would of had much more title defences but kept moving up to fight the best.

Would he? He only held the LW belt once and he only moved up for one fight with GSP. If he didn't move up he still would have had to fight. At most he gets one more title defense, not much more

 

[Brock Sapp]

Be cool to see him take a super fight against a bigger fighter like B.J did, albeit he got whooped by GSP

 

[TheComebackKid]

How can you justify keeping who i listed out if the top 5? Not to mention Gil .

Easy. Aoki although he does have 9 top 10 wins they weren't against the greatest guys and he did it in Japan where the competition is easier. He never held a major title at LW. Not a UFC, Pride, Strikeforce, WEC, Shooto, Bellator, ect...he won his belt in Dream.

Melendez is top 5 all time imo but he doesn't have the wins BJ does nor does he have a UFC belt. He was also never considered the #1 LW in the world.

Gomi has one more top 10 win than BJ but 2 less title defenses. BJ not only beat Gomi head to head but he also beat better fighters than Gomi.

Although Edgar beat BJ twice one could argue it was at the end of BJ's career. Edgar is sitting at a whopping 4 top 10 wins at LW with 2 defenses. Edgar would need to do a little bit more to pass BJ all time.

I do think Pettis and Bendo have strong cases for being ahead of BJ. I still have BJ #1 tho.

Uno had just lost twice,

it was Thomas' first fight in the ufc.

Sherk had like 1 fight at lw, against a non ranked fighter and hadn't fought in over a year .

Kenny Florian had never beat a top 10 fighter in his life.

Diego hadn't done anything at all at lw .

And this was when most the top fighters were outside the ufc.

So how can you call them top 10?

Are you serious? You can go through anyone's record and do this. Going through and trying to discredit every single opponent is a tactic only a novice would use. Also, I'm not saying these guys were top 10 based on my opinion...no, it is a fact that these guys were rated in the top 10.

Kenny Florian has 2 top 10 wins.

Diego beat Stevenson and Guida prior to his title shot. Neither were top 10 at the time but both have been in and out of the top 10 for years.

Sherk actually had two fights at LW. Two fights both of which he dominated in jaw dropping fashion.

I know its fashionable to hate on BJ these days and I must admit he had a horrendous fanbase during his peak but don't let any of that blind you from the fact that BJ does have an excellent resume up until he started getting routinely destroyed at WW.

 

[jlazer]

Easy. Aoki although he does have 9 top 10 wins they weren't against the greatest guys and he did it in Japan where the competition is easier. He never held a major title at LW. Not a UFC, Pride, Strikeforce, WEC, Shooto, Bellator, ect...he won his belt in Dream.

Melendez is top 5 all time imo but he doesn't have the wins BJ does nor does he have a UFC belt. He was also never considered the #1 LW in the world.

Gomi has one more top 10 win than BJ but 2 less title defenses. BJ not only beat Gomi head to head but he also beat better fighters than Gomi.

Although Edgar beat BJ twice one could argue it was at the end of BJ's career. Edgar is sitting at a whopping 4 top 10 wins at LW with 2 defenses. Edgar would need to do a little bit more to pass BJ all time.

I do think Pettis and Bendo have strong cases for being ahead of BJ. I still have BJ #1 tho.



Are you serious? You can go through anyone's record and do this. Going through and trying to discredit every single opponent is a tactic only a novice would use. Also, I'm not saying these guys were top 10 based on my opinion...no, it is a fact that these guys were rated in the top 10.

Kenny Florian has 2 top 10 wins.

Diego beat Stevenson and Guida prior to his title shot. Neither were top 10 at the time but both have been in and out of the top 10 for years.

Sherk actually had two fights at LW. Two fights both of which he dominated in jaw dropping fashion.

I know its fashionable to hate on BJ these days and I must admit he had a horrendous fanbase during his peak but don't let any of that blind you from the fact that BJ does have an excellent resume up until he started getting routinely destroyed at WW.

BJ is 11-3 at lw and his competition wasn't that great.

Lol at Edgar beating him while he was out of his prime, he was still the champ. Ridiculous putting Edgar behind bj when bj was 0-3 against him and Edgar has a lot of the same wins.

Aoki has 3 times the wins as bj and the same amount of losses.

Most of the top LWs were outside of the ufc when bj was in the division.

Who are Florians top 10 wins? Cuz they weren't at lw and weren't before firing bj.

BJ is a product of the ufc trying to market their new lw division

 

[TheComebackKid]

BJ is 11-3 at lw and his competition wasn't that great.

Lol at Edgar beating him while he was out of his prime, he was still the champ. Ridiculous putting Edgar behind bj when bj was 0-3 against him and Edgar has a lot of the same wins.

Edgar is sitting at a whopping 4 Top 10 wins two of which are against the same person. Imo the LW GOAT needs to do more than that.

Also, look at BJ's fights at LW. They were almost all against ranked opponents. No can crushing for BJ.

Aoki has 3 times the wins as bj and the same amount of losses.

Aoki did a lot of can crushing. Plus like I said he never won a major title nor was he ever considered the #1 LW.

Also, the eye test alone tells you BJ is on another level. Have you ever seen Melendez vs Aoki?

Most of the top LWs were outside of the ufc when bj was in the division.

Valid point.

Who are Florians top 10 wins? Cuz they weren't at lw and weren't before firing bj.

Joe Stevenson and Roger Huerta. I'm pretty versed in rankings history and don't just throw things out there like that. Florian had two top 10 wins at LW and was looking very good up until he fought BJ.

BJ is a product of the ufc trying to market their new lw division

Sure but it doesn't take away the fact that he beat 8 top 10 LWs and defended his UFC belt 3 times. Men lie, women lie...numbers don't.

 

[jlazer]

Edgar is sitting at a whopping 4 Top 10 wins two of which are against the same person. Imo the LW GOAT needs to do more than that.

Also, look at BJ's fights at LW. They were almost all against ranked opponents. No can crushing for BJ.



Aoki did a lot of can crushing. Plus like I said he never won a major title nor was he ever considered the #1 LW.

Also, the eye test alone tells you BJ is on another level. Have you ever seen Melendez vs Aoki?



Valid point.



Joe Stevenson and Roger Huerta. I'm pretty versed in rankings history and don't just throw things out there like that. Florian had two top 10 wins at LW and was looking very good up until he fought BJ.



Sure but it doesn't take away the fact that he beat 8 top 10 LWs and defended his UFC belt 3 times. Men lie, women lie...numbers don't.

Your numbers aren't facts, they are opinions. I had Aoki at #1 for quite some time actually, then Sherdog and other sites had bj jumping him for some reason after beating Joe Stevenson.

You must hold what's two wins over bj in very high regard of you consider bj the goat right? BJ beat Gomi (not even sure if that was at lw) , but other than that, what wins stack up to beating bj?


I'm not calling Edgar the goat. I think it's Gomi or aoki