what are your strategies for closing distance vs a taller opponent

[ChairmanJo]

Nice replies and suggestions so far....

My sparring experience is novice so I guess it just takes time to build the flex and reactionary rhythm that comes with more ring and mat time....

Thx !!!!

 

[Discipulus]

Our hips are too high in comparison.

Exactly. Not that a judoka can't be a tall guy, and plenty have been. There are plenty of techniques that work best for tall judoka, too. But being short has its own obvious advantages in terms of leverage that apply to boxing as well as wrestling or judo. Sinister's Digger diagram comes to mind.

 

[Nuclearlandmine]

Coming low and attack from below. It sorted of worked when I was light sparring this huge 6'3 something kickboxer.
http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f11/art-getting-low-612852/

 

[ssullivan80]

What are your suggestions for a very tall guy who predominantly kicks?

If you can time it well, jam him up when he kicks. In short, if you see the kick coming step into it and smother it. Alternatively, bait the kick and attack/close distance during the retraction or reset to stance. This is one of the few times that it's not necessarily a good idea to attack at angles. A taller longer guy who is a good kicker is typically better to attack straight down the centerline, as he's likely carrying his weight much higher in his stance and his hands don't pose the same threat. Working at angles often moves you into the "power" of the kick.

 

[Discipulus]

If you can time it well, jam him up when he kicks. In short, if you see the kick coming step into it and smother it. Alternatively, bait the kick and attack/close distance during the retraction or reset to stance. This is one of the few times that it's not necessarily a good idea to attack at angles. A taller longer guy who is a good kicker is typically better to attack straight down the centerline, as he's likely carrying his weight much higher in his stance and his hands don't pose the same threat. Working at angles often moves you into the "power" of the kick.

I definitely understand that. I slipped myself into a few head kicks trying to angle myself inside. I became very wary of his side kick, though, and couldn't stop trying to get around it. Next time I may just wait for the leg to chamber and sidestep the kick and then shoot straight in. Or catch the kick, though I know everyone hates that in light sparring.

 

[SummerStriker]

I definitely understand that. I slipped myself into a few head kicks trying to angle myself inside. I became very wary of his side kick, though, and couldn't stop trying to get around it. Next time I may just wait for the leg to chamber and sidestep the kick and then shoot straight in. Or catch the kick, though I know everyone hates that in light sparring.

Be careful jamming the side kick. I don't know your guy's method but if he pulls his chamber in deep and is really good with it, he doesn't need full extension. The last time I knocked the wind out of someone with it, they stepped into the kick and my knee was still bent 90 degrees.

If you get a feel for how far away he can hit you without sliding forward, try standing right on the cusp of it. If he comes forward to kick you, your job is done because you just have to survive the one kick and you are inside. You can bait that by giving him the perfect range, and then be ready to step when he moves.

Side kicks can be parried to the side with your forearm pretty easy. Bend your elbow 90 degrees, point your closed fist at the ground, and twist to use your arm to knock the kick to the side.

So when you decide to step in, a round house kick can't stop you. It can hurt, but it can't stop you from entering. Only a side or push kick can, and both come in straight. That is probably what he will throw when you step in, so when he does, be ready to parry it to the side. What you don't want to do is step in and let him kick you with the side kick from any distance.

 

[Phaiym]

it sucks for us shorter people, but i think the best way is to work on your timing. if you see his move and counter before he completes it to get to where you are (which is inside in this situation) you can work him and disable his biggest advantage (reach)

but then i guess...timing works for every situation...lol

feints do help a lot.

since i'm not that tall, i'm trying to focus on my footwork, reaction time and timing in general since reach will rarely be to my advantage

 

[PeterPain]

Being a tall guy who like to fight in the pocket more then snipeing shots from miles away. I love to let people get in range that said. As others pointed out THE JAB

jab jab jab........ till you get there. if your out of range for your jab dont bother throwing anything else. This is the simplest and most effective ways to learn to get inside on the taller and longer guys. Once you've got the jabbing in down, start adding level changes and feint, jab jab...... get this first, then move on to other techniques.

Note: your jab doesn't have to land on the chin, gut of the taller guy. Land that jab at the closest thing to you (gloves, arm) and keep jabbing until you get it to him, than jab the chin/gut, and put together your power shots in your range. Don't try closing the gap by launching in out of range with 1 big step into your jab. instead, cut that distance down to 2-3 smaller quicker steps and add a jab with each step trying to hit the closest thing to you and work your way in. Simple, basic, but nonetheless effective against both novices and experienced guys that are taller and longer.

This works in MT also, despite popular opinion (of some). Good thing to add in MT for the shorter reach/height fighter is to throw your leg kicks at the end of your combos as the taller guys trying to get out, then jab, jab, jab, repeat............ That low kick at the end of your combo as the taller guy retreats will cut down the time and distance you'll have to cover going back in.

I eat alot of jabs because... it's about the only thing I will eat. Here is why it's also more efficiant. Nothing else work fine.

The Kicks, if you try to ''Kick your way in'' to a taller opponant. You have much more chances of having your feet getting caught. Worst part is that your opponant will now have full controle of the range and may be able to reach you and you won't.

Exotic combinations, if you comit your balence from afar. You become a target.
In opposition, the jab let you keep your composure and let you capitalise on the tall guy's oppennings, steps, kicks, punches.

As a whole, is it nice as a tall guy to be fighting a shorter fellow who does the Jab'athon? No. It's much more demanding than anything else. You have to rely on everything else BUT your range. Right kick to calf, tight, ribs. Left kick without getting block. Clinch or dirty boxe.

There are planty of tools in the shed but that Jab may be the ideal one for the job.

 

[slip slip hook]

I'm usually taller than my opponents. This is what gives me the most trouble:
Since I'm tall and thin for my weight my legs aren't as thick as my opponents so I really focus on avoiding/checking leg kicks.
Side most punches have to travel up to get me I feel comfortable defending hands but leg kicks really bother me.

That being said a quick two or three punch combo with a heavy leg kick at the end works well to get in on me.
Since I really focus on the leg kick this gives opponents a time gap to close distance right as I check the kick or evade it
Also after a couple legs kicks you can fake one and as I check you move in.

Hope this helps

Also there nothing I like more than someone trying to jab they're way inside. Nothing is universal but IMO tall lanky guys usually are good at straight shots so you don't wanna play that game with them.

 

[PeterPain]

Exactly. Not that a judoka can't be a tall guy, and plenty have been. There are plenty of techniques that work best for tall judoka, too. But being short has its own obvious advantages in terms of leverage that apply to boxing as well as wrestling or judo. Sinister's Digger diagram comes to mind.

We are much much better at sweep than trows.
That diagram was for Stand up trading and does not apply here.

That said, yes it's much hader to go under your oppenent's weight line if you are taller and you need to ''reach down'' for it but you can press on him to controle exactly WHERE on each leg is his leg/weight distribution. Kind of how you would set up a Ashi Waza.

To be specific, If you can make me shift most of my weight on one leg and sweep it...
How is on his ass with a sore calf?

By creating an imbalence you can also create a oppenning to go down under the smaller guy's hip line. This is where people get airborn. I never do it tho because it isn't efficiant for a tall guy. Why work hader to create an oppenning when I can just get a wider base, get one leg in between you, bend you on the side and lunch a knee to exposed ribs? Or just slip you the elbow like Nathan Corbet would.

***About the Judoka not being lanky.
When all you do is mostly pull stuff toward you, get big round shoulders and mad trapezius. The triceps won't show but they deffinitively will be there.

 

[Frode Falch]

i like to shut them down by swarming them with long ass combinations. overwelm them diaz / valavelasquez style.

 

[Krimzon]

something I've been using with with some success (albeit against novices) is jab/feint jab -> dash in with body cross

that's the only string i consciously go for, the rest is in the moment feeling and reaction. I'm going to employ the fake step in move suggested earlier to add to the arsenal of preset moves.

 

[Kickzilla]

I really like Sullivan's advice. It's simple, effective, and is a good foundation on building the other skills and strategies people are talking about like lateral movement, countering, aggression, etc.

I think proper head movement and footwork and parries have their place in closing the distance as well.

I'd like to add another thing which I think is fairly simple as well. In Muay Thai there tends to be a hit, block, hit back rhythm. Learning to pounce and be aggressive to get in your combos as soon as the taller opponent stops hitting you can teach the importance of capitalizing on openings as well.

For example the taller guy throws a 1, 2 and maybe a head kick. Soon as that kick is blocked or evaded you get in there immediately land a combination and have a number of options: step to the side, or clinch, or stay in the pocket, or step back out.

Edit:
- I like to throw jabs and crosses to the body a lot too against taller opponents. Teeps and leg kicks in a muay thai/kb setting of course have their place as well. Sullivan's advice on jabbing to get them back peddling to time a leg kick is actually REALLY good as leg kicks are excellent on retreating opponents.

 

[Kframe]

I have seen it mentioned that you should use the jab to get in. Umm, i am all of 5'8" so i short. I sparred with a guy that was around 6'5". I can tell you that working that jab did not help me at all. I dont see how it could either. Think about it, the very reason your using the jab, he is as well. How can you use the jab when they have longer reach. There jabs will reach you first.

So what i found was using deflections and parries, as well as movement to get in side our to there outside. Its almost like, there advantage in reach, and keeping you on the outside, is a disadvantage when you finealy get close and stay in the "melee" range.(as defined by Dan jurdjevic in one of his blogs)

 

[DaGenius]

If you are fighting a taller guy with good kicks:

First sit out of range. I know, you can't hit him be he cant hit you. For his teeps, parry them then attack the leg that's hitting the ground. Bait him into leg kicks. Those are the kicks you want to catch from him. Don't catch and sweep, throw his leg downward and away and attack that leg, right for example. Don't catch body kicks because he will pull you into the clinch which is your biggest disadvantage vs a taller muay Thai fighter. When you see him head kick, crouch and push kick his standing leg. Either he is way off balance or you push him back just a little and you are set up for a perfect body kick.

I still don't understand the logic of jabbing your way in against someone who has a longer jab. The guys who try to do that seems to eat a ton of jabs. With two guys at the same approximate level of MT it's hard to imagine how it turns out differently. In pure boxing it might be different and I don't know enough western boxing to say.

 

[cms9690]

Boxing:

Some of my go-to techniques for pulling the taller guys in are:

-Slipping punches, Work on slipping passed their offensive punches in hopes of attaining a comfortable range for yourself. A great exercise for this is to tie a rope from one corner of your ring to the other that is about head level with you (maybe lower) and work on slipping unerneath it while mostly bending at the knees (bending down at the back will set you up for a nasty uppercut :wink.

-Cutting Off the Ring, A guy who is taller than you will probably want to stay on the outside of you, which you can use to your advantage. Work your angles and back him into a corner, and when he finally has no where else to go, he will have to fight you at YOUR range. Find a sparring partner who will help you work on just the foot movement of cutting off the ring and maybe incorporate some of the punches to keeping them inside of the corner as well.

-Take Some to Give Some, Self explanatory, pull up your guard and eat some of his puches in hopes of obtaining your comfortable range. This should really coincide with a combination of cutting of the ring and slipping his punches and is probably a last resort. If the guy doesn't have have a lot of power behind his punches and you feel you can take it, give it a shot.

In all honesty though, you said you don't have much experience and this guy you're sparring could just be better than you.. and nothing will really help you in that type of situation aside from building your reaction time and technique.

 

[Mooner]

Joe Rogan, "Why is he not throwing leg kicks?"

 

[KarateStylist]

KS, being smaller is not necessarily a physical disadvantage. In terms of reach, that's nearly always the case. But being smaller also offers unique advantages in terms of leverage. The best judoka, for example, are almost never very lanky. Compact guys make great takedown artists as well, and for the same reason, such as Lloyd Irvin's DJ Jackson and Mike Easton.

^^^ Nice take Big D....

KarateStylist

 

[Pugilistic]

I still don't understand the logic of jabbing your way in against someone who has a longer jab. The guys who try to do that seems to eat a ton of jabs. With two guys at the same approximate level of MT it's hard to imagine how it turns out differently. In pure boxing it might be different and I don't know enough western boxing to say.

Well you gotta give him something to be occupied with. Doesn't always have to be a jab but it's the most obvious one. If you're jabbing with him from the outside you'll be at a disadvantage but the point is blind him or distract him with it. Go low and jab under his jab, step in with the jab as he retracts his jab, slip his jab and jab your way in, jab with him your head off center so his jab flies between your arm and your head, etc. Of course if you go in straight with your head center from the outside with jabs, you'll eat counters and counter jabs but that's the same with any punch. Even jabs need set ups.

One thing I like to do is feint and if he reacts defensively, I'll use that window to jab my way closer. If I'm close enough I'll just throw a hook though.

Sullivan's advice is spot on I think. Especially the part of jabbing anywhere you can. Some outside boxers like to move their head a lot from the outside and jabbing to shoulders, chest, and body can disrupt their movement.

Another trick I was told by national kickboxing champ who is really short is to tuck your chin in low and intercept the guy's jab with your forehead and throw the right hand over it simultaneously. It's not something you want to use often but it'll mess with the guy's rhythm and confidence in the jab since he's getting hit with a harder punch even as he thinks he catching you with the jab.

I also use a lot of slipping from the outside to make the guy miss. Depends on the guy but making him miss has the effect of taking away the jab, which makes it easier to get in closer.

It's important to mix up a lot of these tricks and methods. If you do the same thing over and over again, the guy will catch on and start to time you or know what to expect. Start with a body attack, then maybe later feint to the body and go to the head instead, or slip punches and when he doesn't expect it, throw a counter shot off the slip.

 

[DaGenius]

Pugilistic

Interesting response. I'm not the tallest guy at my gym but at 6-2 I have a reach advantage against a lot of my sparring partners. A jabbing contest usually goes my way.

We agree on slipping and feints. That's what I feel is the best way to get inside.