Was Rousey's & Edmund's critique exaggerated/undeserved?(gameplan and execution)

[piepie]

After seeing Werdum a potential HW GOAT, lose his title without defending it succesfully once in a rather reckless way yesterday/today, i wonder if people were being to harsh on Ronda and Edmund.

1) Did Rousey had the worst gameplan and fight execution in a title fight ever? If not who did worst?

2) Did Rousey show the worst fight IQ of a UFC champ? If not who had worst?

3) Is Edmund the worst in preparing his champs for opponents and for adjusting during fights or are other trainers worst?

Im seeing a lot of experienced dudes lose quite helpless and not able to adjust. I see a lot of champs losing their belts easy and quick, without putting up a good fight.

IMO, you get a pass if you lose against an awkward unknown fighting style that hasnt really been figured out yet. Yet it seems Sherdog, considers Rousey & Edmund losing to the best standup fighter in the history of WMMA @ 135 a shame. Holly was a darkhorse as awkward as a prime machida and undefeated in the standup @ 135 WMMA.

If the Rousey loss was stupid and she needs another trainer what does that say about the other fighters?

 

[KSchwarz]

No. Werdum can do better than that and he was doing well before going retarded.

Ronda, being unable to clinch, did NOTHING but bum rushing Holm.

 

[Tormund]

The level of striking in MMA is just infinitely lower than combat sports where only striking is involved, everybody wanted to believe Werdum had world class muay thai but it's sloppy and I have been saying that all week, that was embarrassing from Werdum.

 

[Loko3]

When I think about bad fight IQ in title fights Zingano's across the distance of the cage fully telegraphed flying knee against a Judoka comes to mind.

 

[ortizgnp]

The only thing Ronda showed against Holly was warrior spirit. She continued til she went out.

With Edmond she's not getting any better as a fighter.

 

[piepie]

When I think about bad fight IQ in title fights Zingano's across the distance of the cage fully telegraphed flying knee against a Judoka comes to mind.

Or Aldo losing his title even quicker vs Conor?
Fedor losing on the ground vs Werdum first round?

Let me ask this question then who is harder to prepare for an awkward Holm Pre-Rousey or a simple rugged straightforward brawler like Miocic??? There is nothing genius about Miocic, there is nothing sophisticated about Miocic there are a 100 rugged fighters out there who look the same and there is only one Holly Holm in WMMA IMO...

 

[Timurd123]

Edmund actually said after that Ronda was winning the exchanges on the feet

He actually said that

Those words came out of his mouth

Anything after that is well deserved

 

[BJ@LW&WW]

i would say it was exaggerated, especially coming from people who have no idea how to compete in a combat sport/martial art. but at the end of the day, the criticisms were accurate imo, just blown out of proportion.

 

[piepie]

No. Werdum can do better than that and he was doing well before going retarded.

Ronda, being unable to clinch, did NOTHING but bum rushing Holm.

1) she landed multiple strikes
2) first clinch at 3:47 first round a clinch against the cage with some dirty boxing from both
3) second clinch 2:45 first round attempts judo takedown and both fall to the ground anttempts a sub(armbar).
4) @ 1:44 she couldnt get a clinch but landed some dirty boxing combination
5) 0:52 Rousey gets close after a holm legkick and tries to clinch to judo takedown, Holm defends herself by pulling Rousey in the air and slamming rousey on the mat now Rousey has Holm in her guard(for a few seconds)
6) 0:25 rousey and Holm both exchange sloppy punches, rousey clinches and knees holm to the stomach 2 times. Rousey tries to get in a judo takedown but Holm has blueprint to stop those hiptosses from Rousey with her hands. so Holm breaks free.

First rounds ended. Rousey was damaged badly by the time the first round ended!!!

second round more damaged by the stiking of the best WMMA standup fighter in history and Rousey is KO-ed very quickly in the second round.

 

[Siesta]

Imo, Ronda's sh*tty attitude is why she got so much hate after her loss. As for her game plan, I think she tried to prove her doubters wrong(that she had good striking), and payed the price.

I'm not sure what Werdum was thinking.

 

[BigMuffler]

Let me ask this question then who is harder to prepare for an awkward Holm Pre-Rousey or a simple rugged straightforward brawler like Miocic??? There is nothing genius about Miocic, there is nothing sophisticated about Miocic there are a 100 rugged fighters out there who look the same and there is only one Holly Holm in WMMA IMO...

Miocic is a skilled striker and wrestler plus, if 'simple' style fighters were easy to prepare for then Tate would also have been easy to prepare for for Holly, also Lawler should be easy to prepare for. It doesn't work that way, sometimes simple is best it's all in the execution.

 

[KSchwarz]

1) she landed multiple strikes
2) first clinch at 3:47 first round a clinch against the cage with some dirty boxing from both
3) second clinch 2:45 first round attempts judo takedown and both fall to the ground anttempts a sub(armbar).
4) @ 1:44 she couldnt get a clinch but landed some dirty boxing combination
5) 0:52 Rousey gets close after a holm legkick and tries to clinch to judo takedown, Holm defends herself by pulling Rousey in the air and slamming rousey on the mat now Rousey has Holm in her guard(for a few seconds)
6) 0:25 rousey and Holm both exchange sloppy punches, rousey clinches and knees holm to the stomach 2 times. Rousey tries to get in a judo takedown but Holm has blueprint to stop those hiptosses from Rousey with her hands. so Holm breaks free.

First rounds ended. Rousey was damaged badly by the time the first round ended!!!

second round more damaged by the stiking of the best WMMA standup fighter in history and Rousey is KO-ed very quickly in the second round.

She's lucky for not fighting in a division where you can be KTFO'd with a single punch at any moment.

 

[piepie]

i would say it was exaggerated, especially coming from people who have no idea how to compete in a combat sport/martial art. but at the end of the day, the criticisms were accurate imo, just blown out of proportion.

to me it sounded that with Rousey the expectations shifted...
It looks to me that everyone was saying in the aftermath that Rousey should train some boxing, to go beat the best female boxer in WMMA @ 135. Isnt that crazy? im not expecting a sub-artist to ever become as good in striking as an elite boxer/kickboxer as Holm. that are crazy demands IMO. Was Brock lesnar's standup elite and were people asking Brock to go train with Mayweather because a K1 champ(Overeem) beat him in the standup?

Do people now also expect that Maia will defeat a Wonderboy in the standup? And if he doesnt will they also ask for him to train boxing with the Mayweather's and Roaches?

Honestly when Rousey was Ko-ed she was extremely damaged i take that into consideration. When Aldo and Werdum got Ko-ed they were FRESH IMO... I would say Rousey's & Edmund's fight IQ is better than most champs who have a hard time defending their belts...

Im gonna be honest with yall by saying that i consider Holm standup superior to Miocic's and Rousey managed to do more than other's in her lost title fight...

Regarding Edmund i think we'll have to wait to see what Travis Browne does vs Cain...

 

[kahymo]

if you are a female fighter,
and you dropped boxing world champions during sparring,
you are doing something right. Right?

 

[Jon Lock]

no

 

[Headkicktoleg]

Ronda is actually worse with Edmond than if she was just going to a judo gym and throwing around white belts. She was over confidant in her stand up and didn't prepare to focus 100% of her effort to get Holly on the ground.

 

[Superzorro]

Or Aldo losing his title even quicker vs Conor?
Fedor losing on the ground vs Werdum first round?

Let me ask this question then who is harder to prepare for an awkward Holm Pre-Rousey or a simple rugged straightforward brawler like Miocic??? There is nothing genius about Miocic, there is nothing sophisticated about Miocic there are a 100 rugged fighters out there who look the same and there is only one Holly Holm in WMMA IMO...

Miocic couldn't be any further from a brawler. You could argue that he's the best with range at heavyweight. I actually see a lot of similarities between Holm and Miocic in terms of stand-up, I guess if you take away the kicks.
The problem people have with Ronda's loss is that she didn't even make an effort toward adjusting. Werdum didn't have a chance, he got stopped. Ronda spent the greater part of two rounds trying to walk her down, even running at certain points, when it was clear from the get go that Holly is at her best when countering / on the back foot.

 

[Lemmy]

Or Aldo losing his title even quicker vs Conor?
Fedor losing on the ground vs Werdum first round?

Let me ask this question then who is harder to prepare for an awkward Holm Pre-Rousey or a simple rugged straightforward brawler like Miocic??? There is nothing genius about Miocic, there is nothing sophisticated about Miocic there are a 100 rugged fighters out there who look the same and there is only one Holly Holm in WMMA IMO...

There's nothing mysterious about a good boxing technique (which includes footwork, timing, distance and jab), it's amazing how 'sophisitcated' people that spent all their lives training "sophisticated" martial arts still cannot figure how to deal with "simple" things like this.

 

[piepie]

Miocic couldn't be any further from a brawler. You could argue that he's the best with range at heavyweight. I actually see a lot of similarities between Holm and Miocic in terms of stand-up, I guess if you take away the kicks.
The problem people have with Ronda's loss is that she didn't even make an effort toward adjusting. Werdum didn't have a chance, he got stopped. Ronda spent the greater part of two rounds trying to walk her down, even running at certain points, when it was clear from the get go that Holly is at her best when countering / on the back foot.

Dude what are you saying man? Miocic and Holm in one sentence? If there is 1 HW in the UFC that i would compare with Holm it would be JDS. evasive elite footwork IMO, good punches and kicks(Hunt). but okay its ok to have a different opinion. To me i dont see Miocic:
as a good elite point fighter
evasive as a machida
inferior counterpunching ability etc.

Nope to me it wasnt clear that Holm was that dangerous on the backfoot and i did follow Holm Pre-UFC. Holm counterpunching abillity and performance was THE big surprise and also how she would defend Rousey's Takedown attempts which rousey did attempt in the first round.

talking about the second round is kinda weak it was finished in the second round within 54 seconds.
playing devils advocate: wasnt Rousey's BnB to fight how see fought the first round? wouldnt we all stick with the winning fightingstyle/formula if it wasnt broke? whatever anyone is trying to say Holm was a mystery and is still a difficult puzzle to solve. Miesha is lucky to have seen the blueprint of what not to do. Its not that Miesha is an Einstein or her team are so brilliant. D.Cruz, Holm and maybe a wonderboy are difficult because if it goes to the judges they will probably outscore you and the way to defeat their evasiveness is a headache IMO

 

[piepie]

There's nothing mysterious about a good boxing technique (which includes footwork, timing, distance and jab), it's amazing how 'sophisitcated' people that spent all their lives training "sophisticated" martial arts still cannot figure how to deal with "simple" things like this.

tell that to the boxing world who havent cracked the mayweather code. tell that to all the bonafide former and current champs who couldnt solve the evasiveness af mayweather.
Tell that to all the straight forward brawlers that didnt had a chance to beat Klitschko in a decade untill Tyson Fury came with elite footwork himself and awkwardness
Tell that to all the fighters that struggled vs Anderson Silva for years AS is elusive awkward
Tell that to Mosuasi who couldnt crack or adjust vs the machida code
TJ who couldnt crack or adjust vs the D. Cruz code
Rothwell who couldnt crack or adjust vs the JDS code
J. Hendricks who couldnt crack or adjust vs the Wonderboy code
A lot of Dominant champs are awkward and their defense is hard to deal with (Rigondeaux, Andre Ward, Bernard Hopkins)