Was Pride FC not that good?

[RetiredSlave]

@Greta

 

[HHJ]

Exactly.

This is what I was referring to in my initial post...

Although I think, in Kaneko’s case, it is more about entertainment value of seeing a celebrity fight in an MMA contest more than anything.

I mean, even after Pride, dream booked a fight with Jose Canseco.

Dream was a different story than Pride imo.

Dream had to make due with losing 80% of their Pride roster to the UFC.

Also Kaneko was one of their own. That means something to them.

Krazy horse said "I thought youd be afraid of me,but the way you fuckin attacked me,you arent afraid of me"

That probably means the most to those fans.

 

[BabyBlue_Bomber]

ok, that´s the point: Kaneko was realistically more 'impressive' [against a legit opponent like Krazy] than Punk who showed absolutely nuthin´ (borderline ridiculous) against 2 rookies.

No argument from me on this.

My point is that I don’t think any of those fights should have been booked in the first place.

But it was something that would happen more often in Pride than in the UFC.

That being said, the UFC did feed that guy who beat Kimbo in a street fight to Brandon Lee Hinkle as well.

 

[gono btw]

No argument from me on this.

My point is that I don’t think any of those fights should have been booked in the first place.

But it was something that would happen often in Pride than in the UFC.

That being said, the UFC did feed that guy who beat Kimbo in a street fight to Brandon Lee Hinkle as well.

I mean... if you truly go through UFC´s history from day 1, you´ll find weird mismatches too, and an awful lot (especially in the early years).

 

[mitch316]

It had some good fighters and some good fights, but other than that 90% of the roster wouldn't even get considered for the UFC, leading to cards full of horrible fights, can crushing and freak shows. Then there was the rampant steroid abuse, fixed fights, constant resets, Yakuza influence... The list goes on.

The irony of complaining about steroid abuse whilst having a Jones AV.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

Pride from around 2003-2005 was the pinnacle of MMA imo.

 

[usmctanker242]

PRIDE FC has a slow start as their first few events were slow and pretty boring (IMO, of course). But once they built up a solid roster they had some amazing fights, and I liked their ruleset a lot more compared to the UFC. The first round being 10 minutes, followed by a 5 minute final round, gave fighters a better opportunity to get a submission. MOST of my favorite fights from during those times came from Pride, rather than the UFC. Wanderlei, Shogun, Mirko, Fedor, Nogueira bros, and of course the MMA beast himself : Kazushi Sakuraba. Sakuraba was one of the most interesting and entertaining fighters on the planet at that time. His fights versus the Gracies were legendary and he was incredibly crafty and tough.

During that era I just felt like the UFC was stale and full of wrestlers who were waiting for the final bell to ring. Just my IMO, of course, but Pride was better. Shougn won the LHW title, Nogueira won the HW title, Anderson Silva originally came from Pride to destroy everyone he fought in the UFC.

 

[Make Sherdog Great Again]

The irony of complaining about steroid abuse whilst having a Jones AV.

Yeah Jones is basically Mark Kerr isn't he kid.

 

[tramendous]

They had the best HW guys at the time but they mainly one dimensional type fighters. Now we know that a lot of their guys couldn't hold up when coming off supplements. A lot of folks will say Nog became champion but if memory serves me right; it was an interim belt. It's almost 15 years ago. You see so many guys come and go in the UFC. There aren't many streaks because they make everyone fight each other as opposed to crushing cans and fighting at the end of the year.

Not sure what you mean

Anderson Silva,
Rampage
Shogun
Werdum
Nogueira
All of them won belts

Henderson
Hunt
Overeem
All fought for belts or were contenders. Hendo especially since he was only stopped by other Pride guys in Silva and Jackson from winning UFC gold.

The only fighters to not deliver were Wanderlei (who got brutally KO'd back to back before coming to UFC) and Cro Cop

 

[Make Sherdog Great Again]

Even if you pretend the UFC had an equal talent level, everything about Pride was superior:

- Ruleset
- Ring
- Judging criteria
- Tournaments
- Fighter activity
- Far less pullouts
- No testing
- Presentation/production

- Ruleset: No elbows on the ground sucked. Knees to grounded opponents and stomps had to be removed so that MMA could be accepted.
- Ring: Constant resets completely sucked. There's a reason why 99% of MMA fights today are in a cage.
- Judging criteria: 10 point must system is far fairer.
- Tournaments: Terrible for fighter safety.
- Fighter activity: Fighters competing when they should have been medically suspended.
- Far less pullouts: Fights had less meaning so wasn't a big deal to fight when one shouldn't have.
- No testing: Fighters forced to take drugs or not be competitive.
- Presentation/production: Vastly inferior in every way possible.

 

[tramendous]

- Ruleset: No elbows on the ground sucked. Knees to grounded opponents and stomps had to be removed so that MMA could be accepted.
- Ring: Constant resets completely sucked. There's a reason why 99% of MMA fights today are in a cage.
- Judging criteria: 10 point must system is far fairer.
- Tournaments: Terrible for fighter safety.
- Fighter activity: Fighters competing when they should have been medically suspended.
- Far less pullouts: Fights had less meaning so wasn't a big deal to fight when one shouldn't have.
- No testing: Fighters forced to take drugs or not be competitive.
- Presentation/production: Vastly inferior in every way possible.

 

[moreorless87]

The point is Japan is nothing. It’s a meaningless market compared to where UFC has the privilege of operating out of. Pride should have never gotten anywhere near as big as it got, and when it tried to expand, it was clear that it was too big for its britches. Most of its “fighters” were Japanese cab drivers for fucks sake

Plus it was barely a sporting promotion. It was run like complete shit because it was a glorified pro rasslin circus “promotion” that grew from illegal, unsustainable roots. The two aren’t even comparable. UFC is a global juggernaut

The ironic thing of course is that actually the UFC promotes much more like a pro wrestling org when you get past the visuals, as with the WWE theres an obsession with keeping the product "in house" so most of the promotion of events comes from UFC employees. With Pride this was much less the case, they ran shows but they did not look to control how fighters were hyped to anything like the same degree.

You can go back and find quotes from Dana himself on his admiration of the way McMahon promoted the WWE and I think its clear the UFC targets the same market in the same fashion, its basically "grown up pro wrestling" with a thin mask of legitimacy in terms of how its promoted even if its a legit sport rather than predetermined shows.

This basically results in a situation were you have two realities in the fanbase, knowledge of the actual sport of MMA which people might disagree on specifics(such as say who the GOAT is) but broadly agree on basic ideas and those who believe the UFC spiel as reality, that todays product is always the best ever, that evolution is rapidly happening still and that nobody declines their just exposed.

I think were seeing much the same problem as pro wrestling has had with the WWE's dominance as well, a near monopoly led to a lack of investment in the sports future and a declining talent base. All that UFC success was basically helping to prop up the Fertitta's casinos, it wasn't being invested in the talent base but I spose if you fell in love with a Mr MacMahon like character rather than a sport that doesn't really matter?

 

[dnmb]

I have heard of no one who watched it at the time say this. In fact most of us think it was glorious.
People that did not get to experience it are the ones you are thinking of. Stop listening to them

 

[Prutfis]

Pride >>> UFC.

 

[SandaKicker]

Fedor easily the HW GOAT.

 

[waldywaldy]

Yeah Jones is basically Mark Kerr isn't he kid.

He would be if steroids were not banned but encouraged, like they were in Pride.

Or do you think he'd still be ducking HW if that were the case?

 

[kyochi]

 

[loyalyolayal]

It was good. The nostalgic lie is that it was all good. Lots of boring fights and events. It wasn't all Fedor/Cro Cop.

Matsui and Shoji always brings it.

 

[mmadeewana]

People that jump up and down companies dicks are stupid. Enjoy the sport and not organizations

 

[dnmb]

It is not Pride the company I like. It is Pride the experience. The events to be more specific