D
Drake
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I was confused by what they were showing in the cage.
VIDEO: Ronda vs. Male Wrestler.
- Thread starter kingkshon73
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Funny how she doesn't use double legs to get takedowns in her fights and instead rushes in to clinch while eating punches.
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She wouldn't get close enough to execute an ankle pick on Mayweather.
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Mayweather has far more speed, technique, and power than Conor LOL.
We are talking about a generational athlete vs Conor Mcg here. There is a reason why Mayweather earns 300M in 36 minutes while Mcg is left to trying to ride his name for some cheap publicity.
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So let's get this straight. A little kid who has probably been wrestling for a couple of years for his school team is -by all indications- miles ahead of her in wrestling, yet Rousey is somehow a million times better than Floyd?
Floyd could literally take an afternoon and learn everything he needs to learn in order to defend against Rousey's toss attempts (much like how this little kid literally shrugged them off multiple times in this video) enough to allow him to sweet science her in the first 15 seconds.
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Have either of you guys ever rolled before?
If a pure wrestler decides to use his wrestling against a very good Judoka or BJJ practitioner, that wrestler is going to get submitted because they don't have the correct defense for those submissions.
It happened at my friend's gym all the time when he was doing BJJ there. A lot of pure wrestlers would go in and of course, they would use their wrestling by they got easily handled by the BJJ students because the wrestler doesn't know how to defend those submissions.
You can say that any wrestler above 135 handles her, but if they are just a pure wrestler and don't know how to defend the submissions a Judo or BJJ practitioner has, then that wrestler is going to get submitted.
In order to be successful in MMA, you have to learn submission defense. You have to learn BJJ/Judo, etc. You can't just rely on your wrestling. You can be an amazing wrestler but if you don't have any knowledge about submissions in BJJ/Judo, you're going to get submitted very easily.
That friend of mine, he rolled with tons of pure wrestlers and submitted them very easily. Most of those wrestlers never came back the next day, either.
The only way the wrestler wins is usually if the BJJ/Judoka sucks or the wrestler has experience in defending those kind of submissions/is used to having submissions and sweeps from that style (BJJ/Judo) thrown at them. If they're just purely using their wrestling and don't have the submission defense, they will not win the match, they will get submitted or they will get swept.
Now, if a Judoka or BJJ practitioner went in and tried to wrestle, they likely will not win. If they have to go in and use wrestling instead of their actual base, they will lose. But if you put a pure wrestler against a BJJ or Judoka, the BJJ or Judoka is going to submit them because that wrestler doesn't know how to defend the submissions or the sweeps. If you do BJJ/Judo practitioner vs. pure wrestler, the BJJ/Judo practitioner wins almost every time.
Size has nothing to do with it. A good BJJ or Judo practitioner will submit the wrestler. Royce Gracie proved this already, that BJJ is superior to wrestling if it's pure BJJ (or Judo) vs. pure wrestling. Now wrestling with some BJJ or Judo experience (submission and sweep defense) vs. pure BJJ or Judo, the wrestler will likely win. But, if they don't have that knowledge, they will get submitted or swept quite easily because they don't know anything about that style at all. They aren't used to having armbars, triangles, etc, thrown at them. The BJJ/Judo practitioner > pure wrestler.
EDIT: Don't talk about how the wrestler would just slam them on their head, because it's really not that easy. There are ways to defend being slammed in BJJ and Judo. Look at how Forrest Griffin defended being slammed by Rampage Jackson when he put him a triangle. BJJ/Judo > pure wrestling. Wrestling with BJJ/Judo submission and sweep experience (MMA mix) > pure BJJ or Judo, unless that BJJ/Judo fighter is fucking amazing, like Werdum or Jacare or something.
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well if sports science says so its legit
it has more to do than punching power yes but at that level they all hit really unbelieveably fucking hard compared to the adverage person and harder than most pro male mma guys too
the power comes as much from technique as anything and at that level they can deliver a wide variety of shots and combos , mixing up shots and angles etc all while maintaining enough sting to really hurt even men who have taken punches their whole lives
If you honestly believe there journeymen out there with FAR heavier hands than floyd i dont know what to say
Size has everything to do with it, I'll bite.
When I started BJJ I got caught alot in submissions by smaller grapplers. I'm 1.92 m and was about 110 kg at the time. Any smaller guys from purple belt and higher would constantly catch me in dumb shit because I didn't know what to expect.. Eventually once you learn just the raw basics your power gets you a long way. Look at **** chestnar, he got subbed by mir in that first fight and then even in training camp guys couldnt do shit to him because of his strength not because of any technique he magically achieved. i doubt he was doing omoplatas, knee bars and toe holds
Despite the UFC hype machine Ronda is not an elite level grappler. She is an elite judoka with good arm bar vs subpar competition. It would take a male fighter 6 months of BJJ to avoid that arm bar every single time. Period. And this is purely hypothetically speculating a grappling match. In a real fight scenario a male fighter would just cave her head in from the top, Guard or mount or however the fuck he lands on her
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so you feel a sport where the entire focus is on training to punch wont produce guys on adverage with more punching power than say golfers? or guys who only train boxing as part of their regieme?
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We don't really have any video of her going all-out with any men her size. But if you think women can't hang with skilled men, you should check out Amanda Leve. Below is a competition video, not a light roll or a technique drill.
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Several girls have made it to the state tournament in wrestling against guys. Several have had winning seasons.
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The logic here is astounding. You realize that a 135 pound person can't grow without becoming no longer a 135 pound person right?
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You just proved my point, though.
I'm saying, you can put a pure wrestler with no knowledge on submission/sweep defense against the BJJ/Judoka, and the BJJ/Judoka practitioner is likely going to win. If that wrestler does do BJJ/Judo and learns defense and such, then he will likely be superior because he has a mix of both wrestling and BJJ/Judo. Wrestling is the best base in MMA, but if they don't have the submission defense, they won't be the best guy, they will get submitted.
Size matters if you actually know how to use it. You can be a big guy, and you can still get submitted by a much smaller opponent because you don't know anything about defending those submissions.
I'm saying, PURE wrestling and pure BJJ/Judo, the BJJ/Judo practitioner is likely going to win, even if their opponent is bigger than them because that person doesn't know how to defend submissions.
Like you, I'm guessing you went in purely as a wrestler and you were constantly submitted by smaller guys, as you said, right? Then you eventually mixed it, you learn how to defend those submissions and then your size becomes a plus because now you know how to use your size effectively.
And the Lesnar/Mir 1 thing, it's different because that is an actual fight. There were strikes involved and that changes everything. If Brock and Mir were rolling, no strikes, just Brock's pure wrestling against Mir's BJJ, Mir would've submitted him. In the second fight, it was different because Brock had actually learn some submission defense and took his time instead of just going crazy like the first time.
I get what you're saying - size does matter, but only if you know how to use it. Royce fought tons of much larger guys and still submitted them easily sometimes because his opponent didn't have any knowledge on what Royce was doing. They didn't know how to defend those submissions, they weren't comfortable with his style at all, so their size didn't mean a thing. Now, if you know how to defend those submissions, your size can be a very big factor.
If a wrestler goes in against a BJJ/Judo practitioner, the wrestler will likely lose if he doesn't know how to defend submissions. Even if he (the wrestler) is larger, he will get submitted if he doesn't know how to defend submissions. That's really all there is to it.
But, again, if the wrestler learns submission defense, then his size can actually become a big factor/advantage in it, only if he learns how to defend submissions. If someone goes in with literally no knowledge of submission defense, the BJJ/Judo practitioner is going to have a lot of fun with them. It would make the BJJ/Judo guy look like Werdum against an amateur, until that wrestler learns the correct defense for that style.
You know what I mean?
About Ronda's armbar - I don't believe what you're saying. The armbar is her go-to submission, but she has so many different ways to transition to it. You can defend it, and then next thing you know she's doing some other weird shit and it turns into an armbar again. She has so many slick and beautiful transitions to get that armbar. It would take more than 6 months of BJJ, male or not, to defend being put in an armbar from her because she just has so many ways to get you with it. She doesn't do the same thing every time. It results in the same submission, but she has so many different ways to get it, from so many different positions, she's amazing at it.
I do agree she is facing subpar competition, but being a male with only 6 months BJJ training.. Ronda is going to submit them still because she has many, many years at the highest level in Judo. There's no way someone with 6 months training in BJJ can stop her, that's not even close to enough time, she would make them look like a beginner white belt. Ronda just has too many different ways to get that armbar, especially for someone with only 6 months training, male or not, her technical expertise is on a whole different level. She's facing subpar competition in the UFC, but her grappling really is that damn good.
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masterless
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AHahha, you think any of these SHertards actually train? I can guarantee that most of the Ronda haters don't train and therefore have armchair warrior feedback on everything. "Derp any 135lb man can beat up Rousey. He's just stronger than her derp because Im a 190lb fat slob and cant beat off without sweating so they can beat sum dum gurl."
Those of us who train know better from experience and give credit where credit is due.
It's cute that you think you can deduce anything from a light roll.
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Lol. Sports science. Good one.
