Video Braziian Jiu-Jitsu Sport vs. Self Defense debate - BJJ Weekly Throwdown

[nni]

As a fan (or enemy) of stats, I am not happy with these guys just throwing numbers out there like 95 percent of fights go to the ground, 84 percent of fighters are wrestlers etc.

My experience has taught me that when people start throwing out numbers, they can't really be trusted.

I'm sure I've read someone in this forum talk about that statistic some time ago. The person mentioned that that statistic included all the fights where one of the persons was knocked down/out. Hardly what you'd call a grappling scenario and one that would've been avoided with simple boxing.

Who gets into street fights anyway?

 

[Calibur]

Who gets into street fights anyway?

I know right? Seriously, can we get a show of hands for people who actually go to bars on a regular basis?

Me, I go to clubs ALL the time. At least once a month. 3 or 4 times a week when I was in college. In that time I never got into a fight, and that's because I don't instigate them. Fights are almost always avoidable. This is coming from a guy who is often in those "high risk" environements. Most people I have trained with don't even like going to crowded bars, clubs, frat parties, so the chances of them getting into a fight is even lower.

IMO planning for a street fight is only slightly more realistic than planning for a zombie invasion.

People don't get into fights if they really don't want to.

 

[HardEight]

As a fan (or enemy) of stats, I am not happy with these guys just throwing numbers out there like 95 percent of fights go to the ground, 84 percent of fighters are wrestlers etc.

My experience has taught me that when people start throwing out numbers, they can't really be trusted.

YouTube - Professor Scott Steiner math lesson

Well 80% of statistics are made up right on the spot.
48% of those statistics are true.
97% of the people believe them.
54% of the people believe that figure is just an old wives tale and 60 - 77 % of people know that.
So 27% of all statistics are skewed by 14% to achieve a 76% accuracy rate.
But in the end 43% of all statistics are worthless.
We know this through studies that have proven that death is 99% fatal in all laboratory mice.

 

[Kozbot]

if train to perform your grappling against other trained grapplers then fighting an untrained should be no problem

a grappler in a self defense situation wouldn't look anything like a grappling match. it would be takedown=>achieve mount=>TKO 99% of the time.

just being able to achieve and maintain mount is 90% of the grappling you need for the street

 

[MMA junkie]

"Most fights go to the ground."

Most people are chumps with no training who either fall over because of nonexistent wrestling skills or get knocked down because of nonexistent boxing skills. Sure, nearly all fights turn into grappling (in the clinch), but that doesn't mean you have to go to the ground to finish the fight. If MMA fighters can sprawl 'n' brawl against trained professionals, so can you against some belligerent drunkard.

Obviously, I'm a proponent of learning the ground game for the FUBAR scenarios, I just don't think it's healthy to preach that the ground is inevitable, because it certainly isn't, and staying on your feet will always be safer strategically speaking.

Staying on your feet will not always be safer. It might be if you are in a scenario where your opponent has friends. If he does not have friends, why is it always better? What if you standup sucks? If you standup sucks, then strategically speaking, going to the ground will be better.

 

[LocalNmass]

I'm going to disagree with the guy on the right, saying its all a sport. Then sighting the typical armed attacker or multiple attacker scenario to support his perspective is wrong.
Whether is works/has validity or is bogus Helio's JJ has defense for weapons,disarms etc.
When I'm getting attacked for no reason, other than the other guys entertainment, its no sport to me, it's a time when i need to know how to defend myself.

IMO the difference between Sport BJJ and self defense is DEFENSE, no part of sport BJJ deals with a no rules/weight/time situation. Sport BJJ's defense is defending against attacks from a trained grappler.

I do agree any style is better than no style.

I do believe BJJ is for everyone, and even more for people with fewer physical athletic attributes.

 

[Joose]

I'd argue that most street fights are probably over in 10 seconds if they're not broken up by then. The first guy to get a clean hit (usually the first guy to throw a punch) usually wins.

I wouldn't disagree. I guess the best art would be to just practice throwing a super hook or stun jab and work on it until its lightning fast.

 

[Joose]

From my real life experiences most fights hit the floor! And FYI I have seen plenty of fights go past 10 seconds on the street. Our society has been castrated most men are not willing to break up anything. Even if a girl is getting beat up. Sad but true.

Where do you live that has these awesome streetbrawls? Most fights I've seen are two dudes throwing haymakers and uppercuts at each other for 5-8 secs and then its broken up.


You're castrating reference is just plain bullshit.

 

[Kozbot]

MMA has already solved this debate anyway

pure arts by themselves no longer work in MMA. same goes for the streets. if you wanna be a good fighter you need to be well rounded

 

[Joose]

No, what doesn't make sense is there BEING clean slates at the end of a round. In boxing it makes sense...rounds are meant to give the boxers a rest so that they can keep the fight exciting so that they don't get so tired that they can't even generate enough power to knock each other out and you end up with the audience watching two exhausted guys barely throw horrible punches.

It makes sense in boxing because there is only one position....standing. MMA is different, there are multiple positions but this should still be simulating a fight. The rounds are fine..keep them to give the fighters a break and allow them to recuperate so that can continue the fight invigorated and keep the fight exciting...but don't erase everything one person has done up to that point.

That logically doesn't make any sense. Why should a guy who got dominated and put in a bad position like being mounted with 10 seconds to go, be allowed to escape? Thats like a get out of jail free card just because the round for them to rest HAPPENED to be there. No..I don't think you have to start them hand for hand exactly the position they were in..but they should have a general position for all mounts, side control half guard restarts at the round.

I think this would make more sense and keep the fight more realistic, which is what the UFC was supposed to be anyway, right?

You could argue that, however both men know they have a limited amount of time to do what they need to do during the round. Starting them off in the same position doesn't make sense. What if a guy is about to escape the hold and the bell rings, should that guy that was about to escape be put back into the hold at the start of the next round, only this time the guy on top is fresher?

The same reasons you gave for restarts in boxing are exactly the same reasons we should have them in mma.