USMAN

Yeah lol we can’t look that far into the future. I’ve heard that he has knee issues and he’s simply bound to fall off at some point. Beating Burns, WB and then getting another win over one of Mas, Colby or Scott would put him into #2. I’m not a massive GSP fan but I haven’t seen a WW who is as good as him. I think prime GSP beats all of the current WWs. Same deal with prime Anderson at MW.

oh right I completely forgot about usmans knee's it such a shame considering how high level he is.
 
Footstomp footstomp hug hug hug footstomp clinch footstomp lean on that motherfucker hug hug footstomp clinch

and your winner by unanimous decision

Mas should have done something if he didn't wants to get clinched. Don't be mad.
 
nobody wants to fight him anyways, he's going to be champ for a very long time. the guy to beat him has to have world class grappling, so he doesn't even think about wrasslin' (like against Colby) but also has to have striking accurate enough to score. the guy is a fucking tank and his chin has been proven already. burns is the only one who even has anywhere near the skills required to beat him, but he's been chin'd before.
 
But woodley was not the second best welterweight of all time. That was Matt Hughes. The thing you have to understand is that the champions of old had longevity in this sport that’s difficult to compete with. A dominant win over a champion doesn’t always equate to a dominant string of title defenses. Max Holloway was the guy that dethroned Aldo, and he only defended once against Ortega after that. Weidman was the one who beat Silva, and he seemingly fell off the face of the earth. MMA is not as simple as that.
Hughes wouldnt even be top 10 in today's 170 division

Usman surpassed Hughes ages ago
 
Title defense and belt mean nothing. You can have x200 title defense, but if again bus driver it have no value. Adding name to your collection is the only way to be a proven fighter.

Usman record have win over : Maia, RDA, Woodley, Colby and Masvidal. And if he manage to add Gilberto, Edward and Khamzat, and based on how he win those fights, that will cement himself closer to that pound for pound ladder.
 
Hughes wouldnt even be top 10 in today's 170 division

Usman surpassed Hughes ages ago

Yes, and a 15 year old chess player today would be able to crush the Chess Masters of the past.

It's about the gap you create from your competition.
 
Yes, and a 15 year old chess player today would be able to crush the Chess Masters of the past.

It's about the gap you create from your competition.
Not if your competition is trash, being the best welterweight in 2003 is like being the best ping pong player in Delaware

And no, someone like Bobby Fischer would easily be top 2-3 today so even that you got wrong
 
its just tough because he's in GSP's division. I think in alot of peoples minds you have to become the GOAT in your division first before becoming a P4P goat.

best case scenario for him is if Chamaev beats Edwards. Usman beats Chamaev. Then Israel beats Jan and vacates MW. Then we setup Whittaker vs Usman for the MW belt

lots of 'what ifs' here though
 
Hughes wouldnt even be top 10 in today's 170 division

Usman surpassed Hughes ages ago
they are competing under different circumstances. The sports evolved but that doesn’t make Matt Hughes accomplishments irrelevant
 
they are competing under different circumstances. The sports evolved but that doesn’t make Matt Hughes accomplishments irrelevant

That's right but in all fairness, accomplishments should be assessed under the circunstamces as well.

You can't ask Usman to match Hughes tittles defenses, in these evolved times, where he is truly fighting the #1 guy his size fight after fight. Hughes...yes he did, at times, but the circunstamce was that there wasnt a promotion who could afford to hire all the top talent in any division.
As a matter of fact, Usman is yet to be beaten in the elite, while Hughes got KOed by at the time most solid contender for #1 WW in Pele Landi. Hughes fights Sakurai coming off a loss to Anderson Silva...in this times, Usman would fight Silva if you know what I mean. Submitted twice by Hallman and some close decs vs natural LWs.
Usman has barely lost a round.

Said that, I agree Hughes has a case to be #2 WW of all-time today. If Usman dominates a couple more tittle contenders for a 15-0 run in UFC which is absolutely insane, nobody except GSP is ahead of him imo, regardless of nº of tittle defenses.
 
Usman has worked his tail off to be where he s at and his size and lack of real stylistic elite opponents puts him in a good position. I hope a wild card like ponz can pick up where he left off with momentum or maybe a middleweight can drop down. Hes a beatable fighter but I cant take away the road hes climbed .

Btw- If Lima was in UFC , itd be curtains for Usman. Marty would win first round on TDs but then I see the BETTER FIGHTER( and actually bigger ) taking over. Unlike sassy, Usman one dimensional and Lima could throw caution to wind.
 
lack of real stylistic elite opponents puts him in a good position. I hope a wild card like ponz can pick up where he left off with momentum or maybe a middleweight can drop down. Hes a beatable fighter but I cant take away the road hes climbed .

Btw- If Lima was in UFC , itd be curtains for Usman. Marty would win first round on TDs but then I see the BETTER FIGHTER( and actually bigger ) taking over. Unlike sassy, Usman one dimensional and Lima could throw caution to wind.

What doest "lack or real stylistic elite opponents" mean exactly? How many of those did Lima beat in Bellator in your opinion?

Masvidal said after the fight that what impressed him the most about Usman was he was able to maintain his strenght and pace levels through the 5 rounds...and his craft at forcing the clinch off exchanges.
We see Lima with his back against the fence in any of his fights - loves that approach for his counters - get stuck in cllinch positions plenty of times, or struggling to avoid the TD or separation from the clinch.

You definitely underrate Usman - talking about "stylistic" match up btw - if you dont acknowledge he could very well exploit those holes to a decision. The fact you dedicate the "one dimensional" label to Usman - who has shown way more versatiliy in the elite than Lima - is pretty telling. Wonder about the "real stylistic elite opponent" concept but im predicting more downplaying to be honest with you, friend
 
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What doest "lack or real stylistic elite opponents" mean exactly? How many of those did Lima beat in Bellator in your opinion?

Masvidal said after the fight that what impressed him the most about Usman was that he was able to maintain his strenght and pace levels through the 5 rounds...and how crafty he was at forcing the clinch off exchanges.
We see Lima with his back against the fence in any of his fights, he loves that approach for his counters - similar to Woodley, but more tricky and less powerful - get stuck in cllinch positions plenty of times, or struggling to avoid the TD or get the separation from the clinch.

You definitely underrate Usman - talking about "stylistic" match up btw - if you dont acknowledge he could very well exploit those holes to a decision. The fact you dedicate the "one dimensional" label to Usman - who has shown way more versatiliy in the elite than Lima.
First off - theres has been a negative run off on most classes 170 and above ( just my personal theory). I've been watching since 99 and I dont like what I see downstream. I'll even go as far as saying ( and I hope I'm wrong- God ....I hope I'm wrong), I see an expiration date on this sport that was / is a global phenomenon.

As far as Lima goes , the way he put out MVP speaks volumes and I don't see much " realistic comp" for himas well( at 170).

Glad u brought up masvidal - Lima is just a flat out BIGGER BADDER BETTER version of masvidal . I'll keep on saying it ....and just my God given opinion .I think D.Lima has evolved to the #1 welterweight in world. Lima has the size to neutralize Usman. Marty ain't hurting him standing- hence- Lima can throw caution to the wind at some point in fight ( if they ever fought ). I could see Marty having some lay n pray success early but it would come at a laborious price.

You don't have to agree and I respect your take but there are 4 - maybe 5 - Bellator fighters that could be top 3 and up. Of course, UFC trumps quantity.

Did you take advantage of Syracuse + 15 ?( last week).

I have more winners for s-doggers if they want ( I won't push anything on anyone )
 
LOL @ people who claimed to watch GSP in his prime and consider him the goat calling Usman boring.
 
Depends on what the champion brings to the table to the list of challengers in his division + the skill and overall game disparity between the champ and the rest of the division (particularly the top 10 contenders).

GSP at his heyday was significantly greater than the majority of the top 10 roster during his time until pre-USADA Hendricks matched him. But by that point you could argue that GSP was on the verge of being burnt out due to the pressure of defending his title so many times that it wasn't really the best GSP we've ever seen in that fight.

As for how this relates to Usman? He's kind of sitting between a rock and a hard place here because on one side, he needs at least 4-5 title defenses to be in the talks with GSP (maybe 3 if those are finishes). On the other side, he could grab a MW belt and defend that too alongside his WW belt but then Izzy is there so he's pretty much blocked on that division anyways.

While GSP was pretty well-rounded with everything in his MMA game since he had great striking, wrestling, etc, Usman's skillset primarily relies on his wrestling and all of his other skillsets are secondary to that (good standup at times against Colby and Woodley though). Someone who can neutralize his wrestling and his pressure immediately (Gilbert Burns comes to mind since going to the ground against him is never a good idea) and has strong stand-up can arguably give Usman his toughest fight, if not outright beating him.

Maybe Usman can stand out by displaying better fight IQ in comparison to GSP, who more or less relies on tremendous athletic ability (He trains twice a day even during his offseason) in order to supplement his performance?

Usman is tremendously gifted though (athletically), I can say that much.
 
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