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Of course there's room for a variety of very slight but important technicalities in boxing as well!
I just think that in sports like boxing and wrestling, you're (relatively!) fast at a point where progress will only come in super tiny portions from there on, whereas i'd say you could take any MMA champ and immediately point to an area in fighting where they've got a significant amount of room to improve, you know what i mean?
I find the archetype thing cool as well, though i can also appreciate fighters who more or less started in MMA/started in several combat sports to immediately achieve a certain level of well-roundedness.
I totally agree. The ruleset of MMA allows for so many more diverse attacks, gameplans, and types of opponents (not to mention the sport is still evolving), so there's always going to be more to work on and consider than in more "limited" sports. Conversely, boxing and wrestling fall into the "(theoretically) easy to learn, but very difficult to master" school IMO. That's not say MMA is in any way easy to master, either. If anything it's much harder (probably impossible, if we're being honest).
I guess what I'm saying is what you just addressed: there's still room for improvement even in these other sports, but they're more usually more evolutionary rather than revolutionary, i.e. incremental in nature and as such don't jump off the proverbial page. I think there's a certain beauty to that, too -- a boxer polishing up on his footwork and the timing of his jab isn't particularly sexy or even something that will come across to a lot of the fanbase compared to, say, if Francis Ngannou comes into the Stipe rematch and has an amazing ground game, a new arsenal of kicks, and/or improved cardio -- but it's one of those aspects of the sweet science that I can't help but respect. Mind you, I'm not saying MMA doesn't have any nuance. But I digress. I think we're in agreement overall
I don't blame you for wanting to see guys like Shabazyan fail too much, lol.<45>
Oh don't get me wrong. I have nothing against the guy on a personal level. Even as a fighter I think he's fairly talented, despite getting derailed by Brunson as I predicted he would. But without going too far into it, I have really weird preferences about fighters that I wholly admit are nonsensical wherein I have something of an unfair bias against those that don't have a "base" in extant martial arts prior to jumping into the MMA scene. I know it's silly, but...
This post explains it a bit more if you're curious.
100% fair mate.
I wouldn't advise any striker in MMA to use head movement to an extent where they'd lean back or so to crazy extents because i think it leaves you open for several things (basically also making it potentially super stupid in a RL scenario) though i absolutely love seeing boxers do it and very narrowly but in the end clearly dodging punches!
It's an interesting topic overall and there are a lot of arguments for viewing it through either lens i think.
Oh and i would love for knees to the head on the ground to be allowed!
Totally agreed. The rational part of me knows that a boxer who is using a peekaboo defense on a regular basis could get conditioned, timed, and subsequently murdered with a knee up the middle. I know for that reason it's not practical to use that kind of defense in a NHB setting, but when I'm watching a given sport for entertainment value, the sheer awesomeness of seeing this outweighs my demand for authenticity/realism/practicality on the streets. I can't help but admire the timing, practice, athleticism, and reflexes that goes into it.
Same here man. Enjoy the talk with you really i must say.
I can only imagine what those knuckle-conditioning-drills look like... ouch.
That's another reason why i'm a fan of open hand strikes or hammerfists, like you.
They provide the majority of characteristics that a regular punch does but with dramatically decreased risk to hurt your hands.
Those hammerfists from Dustin came out of nowhere, right?
Recently watched that fight and liked them too.
Oh boy, it's not even just knuckles. Kyokushin (and other Okinawan karate styles) do all sorts of hard-body conditioning drills that are downright cringe-inducing. Considering the amount of punishment they absorb in their tournaments and the ruleset they fight under, I'm not surprised though. It's worth a look on YouTube sometime if you get a chance.
Yep. It was actually enlightening watching the early UFCs and seeing damn near every fighter who punched another guy in the skull full-force end up having to drop out of the tournament at some point because he broke his hand. And yet they didn't seem to learn... It's interesting to think about what MMA boxing would look like in a world where MMA gloves had never become a thing. Aside from undoubtedly rampant eye-pokes, I'm sure there would be a bigger emphasis on knuckle/wrist conditioning, alternative hand strikes (palm, hammerfist, etc.), elbows, and a lot more hand-fighting/trapping like what we saw from DC against Stipe. Man... I'm making it sound they would fight like two guys in an Ip Man movie...
Appreciate the apology, i admittedly found it a bit strange the way you called me out, but i didn't take it personal or so, so no worries there man.
You're welcome and thank you too, as previously mention i really enjoyed it!
I appreciate it. Like I said, it was more a case of me not taking the time I should have to figure out what you were actually saying. That's on me, but I appreciate you being a gentleman about it nonetheless!