News UFC lawsuit docs reveal Joe Silva’s negotiation tactics with Nick Diaz, Jon Jones, Roy Nelson & plus

[TorontoTO]

Young man,

1. No. The companies should do that. If you don’t think it’s safe, don’t work there.
2. Are there 10 year olds fighting in the UFC? No. So quit asking dumb questions.
3. Do fighters train 12 hours a day, 6-7 days a week?

The point you’re trying to make isn’t going to work asking questions that don’t apply. Remember, the fighters are subcontractors anyway.

What incentive do companies have to do that? If it costs money, why would any company put safety equipment or regulations?

For the next two you really don't want to answer since I am not talking about just the UFC.

 

[RonMachineGunJhun]

Hi Ron.

Good to see you again.

-Phil

Aloha Phil,
Mahalos hope you and your ohana are well. *shaka*

 

[philweed]

Aloha Phil,
Mahalos hope you and your ohana are well. *shaka*

Likewise!

 

[philweed]

Cutting grass for the delightment of the adults in the neighbourhood once a week is not a job.

No! I worked after school (part time) until I was 17. Then I had to go full time.

 

[philweed]

What incentive do companies have to do that? If it costs money, why would any company put safety equipment or regulations?

For the next two you really don't want to answer since I am not talking about just the UFC.

You’re going waaaaay off, my friend. Let’s just stick with the UFC for now ok?

How the hell am I gonna get these stains off my fingers without getting up and washing it off?

 

[philweed]

how much do you have in your bank account?

THATS THE PROBLEM! You’re so damn concerned about the fighters’ salaries, my savings, the UFC’s finances. WTF? Worry about your own!

 

[avenue94]

“Expenses adjusted for inflation”….”Durrrr, just because there’s competition doesn’t mean a monopoly doesn’t exist…duuurrrr”

LMAO. Son, you need to re-read your post. It’s so cringe. You’re trying WAY too hard.

You haven’t a clue of the UFC’s expenses….not a smidgen. You know shit. You can keep acting like you do and we’ll keep laughing.

My sherbro, UFC had to hand over their expenses pre-WME for the lawsuit. They are public knowledge at this point. And for 2021, take your pick of either Moody's or Goldman Sachs, both haver info on the UFC's financials and projections.

I'm sorry you think having basic knowledge of the UFC's finances is trying too hard. I can't fathom how closeminded one must be to feel that way.

I'm still waiting for you to define "monopoly." Because it sounds like you are unfamiliar with its legal definition.

Don't strawman me. I am talking about Nick Diaz at that point in his career. You seriously believe that Silva was ready to stick him in a prelim fight? It was an empty boast or threat, depending on context. Utter nonsense.

You seem to have misconstrued my comment as some defense of Silva or the UFC. Try not being so emotional and actually reading people's posts.

Diaz? Probably not, but also not entirely impossible. I Can only go off what Silva's emails and deposition say and they aren't very flattering to say the least. And at any rate, if they wouldn't do it to Diaz, they would do it to a less tenured or well known fighter. Which is still a problem.

you're aware he's relaying a story from 2013 and he's been out of the org for 5 years.....

Ohhh, I see, so you're saying Sean Shelby between 2013 and 2021 found Jesus/some other higher power/changed his business morals and is a completely different man who wouldn't strongarm fighters anymore?

bellator and ONE together are close to 20% of the ufc. add in "regional promotions" like PFL, Invicta, Rizin, ACA, M-1, KSW before you get to real regional promotions....yeah, 80% is made up.

What year are you using?

nah, you put chatri's credibility as the only point here. why? you made it all about him. you twice in the same post called him full of shit when it's not his report.

Check your reading comprehension. My reasons for doubting in that thread were:

Nielson has been in hot water several times for sketchy data, take it with a grain a salt.

Some clear red flags with the data:
1. Nielson considers one viewer one min of viewing. That's it. It's like Netflix considering one view 5 or 10 seconds of a one hour program.
2. One is pushing viewership of the UFC with barely half the broadcast hours?
3. One's video and social engagement metrics are laughably artificial.
4. The data implies that Bellator is watched more than La Liga, which is comical.
5. Finally, I don't care how many of your viewers are nonpaying, if One had a fraction of the viewership they and Nielson claim, they wouldn't be hemorrhaging hundreds of millions of dollars and needing the shadiest possible accounting to turn a "profit"

Notice how most of it has nothing to do with Chatri.

 

[avenue94]

THATS THE PROBLEM! You’re so damn concerned about the fighters’ salaries, my savings, the UFC’s finances. WTF? Worry about your own!

I know, I know, mma fans wanting fighters they like to be paid more. What a strange concept.

 

[TheHeMan]

This Silva guy is a one big slimeball.

 

[kflo]

I'm still waiting for you to define "monopoly." Because it sounds like you are unfamiliar with its legal definition.

lol at you still playing the monopoly strawman game.

Ohhh, I see, so you're saying Sean Shelby between 2013 and 2021 found Jesus/some other higher power/changed his business morals and is a completely different man who wouldn't strongarm fighters anymore?

gee, it's not like his boss who was the ringleader of douchebag behavior left and his bad behavior made public from a lawsuit that increased the risk to the company......yeah, no chance anything changed. but keep quoting a story from 2013.......

What year are you using?

estimated based on bellators 2020 projection of 100m (mostly contractual) and ONE's 63m 2019 figure with high growth.....

Check your reading comprehension. My reasons for doubting in that thread were:


Notice how most of it has nothing to do with Chatri.

notice how i said here, where you mentioned charti being full of shit 2 times and left all of that out. and of course, your initial response in the other thread was about him. only him.

 

[avenue94]

lol at you still playing the monopoly strawman game.

Feel free to toss me whatever definition of monopoly you use, any day now.

anything changed. but keep quoting a story from 2013.......

Lol ok man. The UFC has let a corner man corner a fight on ESPN while said cornerman displays a prominent neo-Nazi tattoo. Yeah, I'm sure the UFC wouldn't strong arm fighters anymore. Even though Dana routinely shits on fighters and the UFC recently made an interim belt partly as a fuck you to a fighter asking for more money. Yeah, all lines up.

notice how i said here, where you mentioned charti being full of shit 2 times and left all of that out. and of course, your initial response in the other thread was about him. only him.

So you're focusing on the offhand sarcastic remark I made about Chatri even though I made a post directly after elaborating on why the ratings are suspect. What are you upset about here?

estimated based on bellators 2020 projection of 100m (mostly contractual) and ONE's 63m 2019 figure with high growth.....

Oh man, where to even start here.
-One's revenue for 2019 was under $50 million. Get back to me when you figure out the glaringly obvious error you made.
-Bellator projected $80 million off of 27 events in 2019. Please tell me how in the fuck you think Bellator hit their lofty $100 million in revenue goal in 2018 with only 18 events.
-Lol if you think Bellator's broadcast deals paid money for events that didn't happen.

Since it seems you want to use 2020 as the year, let's do the math.
-UFC revenue was $890 million
-I'll be very optimistic and say Bellator hit their 2019 estimate of $80 million.
-Income for the entire ONE group was $48 million.
-Again, I'm an optimist, let's say PFL, Rizin, KSW and every regional promotion combined for $100 million

That means the UFC accounted for 79.6 percent of global mma promotional revenue even if we're being extremely optimistic about how non-UFC promotions did in 2020.

 

[greatsantini]

Feel free to toss me whatever definition of monopoly you use, any day now.

Lol ok man. The UFC has let a corner man corner a fight on ESPN while said cornerman displays a prominent neo-Nazi tattoo. Yeah, I'm sure the UFC wouldn't strong arm fighters anymore. Even though Dana routinely shits on fighters and the UFC recently made an interim belt partly as a fuck you to a fighter asking for more money. Yeah, all lines up.

So you're focusing on the offhand sarcastic remark I made about Chatri even though I made a post directly after elaborating on why the ratings are suspect. What are you upset about here?

Oh man, where to even start here.
-One's revenue for 2019 was under $50 million. Get back to me when you figure out the glaringly obvious error you made.
-Bellator projected $80 million off of 27 events in 2019. Please tell me how in the fuck you think Bellator hit their lofty $100 million in revenue goal in 2018 with only 18 events.
-Lol if you think Bellator's broadcast deals paid money for events that didn't happen.

Since it seems you want to use 2020 as the year, let's do the math.
-UFC revenue was $890 million
-I'll be very optimistic and say Bellator hit their 2019 estimate of $80 million.
-Income for the entire ONE group was $48 million.
-Again, I'm an optimist, let's say PFL, Rizin, KSW and every regional promotion combined for $100 million

That means the UFC accounted for 79.6 percent of global mma promotional revenue even if we're being extremely optimistic about how non-UFC promotions did in 2020.

No way Bellator hit $80m. They were projecting $100m last year but they ended up having 18 instead of 26 events and only 4 of them had a live audience.

 

[avenue94]

No way Bellator hit $80m. They were projecting $100m last year but they ended up having 18 instead of 26 events and only 4 of them had a live audience.

I was doing kflo a solid by being super optimistic since he wanted non-UFC revenue to be as high as possible since he didn't believe me when I told him the UFC is about 80 percent of global mma revenue.

I'm doubtful Bellator hit 80 in 2019, let alone in 2020. But I'm sure kflo will be back later to tell me why I'm being unfair to the UFC and really PFL generates 50 million in revenue alone or something.

 

[kflo]

I was doing kflo a solid by being super optimistic since he wanted non-UFC revenue to be as high as possible since he didn't believe me when I told him the UFC is about 80 percent of global mma revenue.

I'm doubtful Bellator hit 80 in 2019, let alone in 2020. But I'm sure kflo will be back later to tell me why I'm being unfair to the UFC and really PFL generates 50 million in revenue alone or something.

I dont care what they made in a pandemic year that limited their shows. I care what their contracted revenue is on a go forward basis. Maybe you should use 2020 Major League Baseball revenue as their benchmark…….

 

[avenue94]

I dont care what they made in a pandemic year that limited their shows. I care what their contracted revenue is on a go forward basis..

If you didn't care about what they did during the pandemic, why did you pick 2020 then? lol Jesus. So should we use 2019 then, or? 2018? 2017? I asked you what year we should use since you disagree with the UFC's market share.

Maybe you should use 2020 Major League Baseball revenue as their benchmark…….

I thought the UFC was competing with and trying to be bigger than soccer, not stick ball.

 

[kflo]

If you didn't care about what they did during the pandemic, why did you pick 2020 then? lol Jesus. So should we use 2019 then, or? 2018? 2017? I asked you what year we should use since you disagree with the UFC's market share.

I thought the UFC was competing with and trying to be bigger than soccer, not stick ball.

I said estimated genius based on 2020 projection for bellator (mostly contractual) and 2019 actual for ONE.….

Lol at being another retard quoting Dana from 12 years ago about the sports reach (not revenue)…..

And I wasn’t comparing the ufc to baseball. I was pointing out that baseball’s revenue from 2020 is not a valid comparison point…obviously.

 

[avenue94]

I said estimated genius based on 2020 projection for bellator (mostly contractual) and 2019 actual for ONE.….

So you want to use projections and pretend covid never happened instead of using the data we have for 2015-2020? Like I said, pick a year we can probably other figure out the UFC's share or global mma revenue.

Or would you rather keep confusing Singaporean dollars with U.S. dollars?

Lol at being another retard quoting Dana from 12 years ago about the sports reach (not revenue)…..

And I wasn’t comparing the ufc to baseball. I was pointing out that baseball’s revenue from 2020 is not a valid comparison point…obviously.

Get tour sarcasm meter checked, friend.

 

[kflo]

So you want to use projections and pretend covid never happened instead of using the data we have for 2015-2020? Like I said, pick a year we can probably other figure out the UFC's share or global mma revenue.

Or would you rather keep confusing Singaporean dollars with U.S. dollars?

Get tour sarcasm meter checked, friend.

Who’s pretending covid never happened. Again, they had contracts in place and still do. You want to pretend they don’t? Again, you can be the retard that uses 2020 mlb revenue as their benchmark for comparison on a go forward basis… it’s retarded and meaningless.

I misread ONE FC’s revenue. It’s a minor change to the %.

When are you ever joking or sarcastic? Impossible to tell…..

 

[avenue94]

Again, they had contracts in place and still do. You want to pretend they don’t?

And ticket sales went down, and contract providers aren't paying out for events that never happened. Meanwhile, the UFC grew its share of the market during covid and solidified its position with consumers even more.

Remember this started because you took offense at me pointing out the UFC is 80 percent of the global mma market for promotions at least I did the math and showed you, and now you're insisting that market share should be based off future years and projections? Da fuq?

It’s a minor change to the %.

Minor? If overstating revenue by 30 percent is a minor change, I'd hate to see what a major change is.

 

[dmwalking]

Hi Ron.

Good to see you again.

-Phil

Aloha Phil,
Mahalos hope you and your ohana are well. *shaka*

Likewise!

i appreciate how this interaction occurred in the midst of all the debating.