UFC Fight Night: Dern vs. Rodriguez

So I placed my bet on Winn yesterday, and watched a plethora of videos from cappers I respect this morning, and all of them are on Winn.

Glad I'm not on an island. That's why I post on here, and watch videos from various people -- I like to get as many perspectives as possible. I don't blindly tail anyone, but sometimes I miss things.

Cody Saftic who I posted a video of for the most recent DWCS(he went 5/5) is on him, MMA LOTN who I consider fairly sharp is on him, Dan Hardy is(Dan Hardy said he hasn't bet in forever and is actually going to make his first bet in a while on Winn), and Clint(but I disagree with Clint so much).

I'm not saying Winn is my lock of the month or anything, I just think the odds are way off and Hawes is super overrated, and I'm glad that some people I respect see the same thing.
 
bit late on this one, apologies. Was hard to find the motivation to tape this card, and the first two fights I did were the Staropoli and Hughes ones...Anyway my 2 cents:

Garcia/Onti: Bit of a shitshow fight. Ontiveros moving to LW first time in his career, going to be huge. The under is the only decent option here, Ontiveros gets Koed and quits for fun, and Garcia is constantly aggressive and has decent power. I still have some PTSD from playing the under in the Mana/Guido fight and last week's main. I think for it go over, Garcia will have to come out and fight, unlike his usual self, because Ontiveros is very hittable and fights with his hands down. Possibly the under 1.5 at plus money for less exposure.

Rosa/Jackson: Jackson is the side but I wish the odds were better. Jackson has some sneaky power, he is cracking some dudes on the regionals and has a one-punch KO as well. His aggressive pressure game where he hunts for takedowns is a perfect game plan against Rosa. He has to avoid getting subbed, which should be ok as Rosa's jits seems to be getting worse and worse. I don't like how Jackson keeps dropping down for the guilly. His takedown defense almost seems as bad as Rosas, which adds potential for a
sweaty scramble fest where judges have no idea who won. Jackson is also chinny but I think he should be fine here. Rosa is just a fade for me in general, not UFC lvl. I have a sprinkle on the decision just due to the odds being better. Hopefully, this isn't the first time Rosa gets subbed, I think his chin will hold up.

Romanov/Vanderaa: Rough matchup for Vanderaa. Big athletism advantage for Romanov, almost inevitable he will get a TD in round 1 at some point. Vanderaa is a turtle off his back. I think Romanov has the cardio to take Vanderaa down in every round. Espino is another big wrestler, he actually took Romanov down, mounted him and made him work his way up which I think is what tiered him out. Vanderaa doesn't have good wrestling, he usually just cage holds for ages until he gets some sort of trip. Also doesn't have much power, most of his KOs are from GNP against low-level opponents. He does have an iron chin though, so I was looking at the over 1.5 at plus money. You never know with Romanov though, he could pull off a forearm choke or he could just keep changing positions on the ground and doing stupid King Kong punches. Also, another ref stops that Roque fight in the first during the GNP.

Gutierezz/Corales: Think there is value in Gutierezz DEC, or RD3/DEC if you want to be safe. Gutierrez is a neutralizer, he sticks and moves and can't even finish an opponent he has been when they are there for the taking. Corales is also tough as shit, but very hittable and as he slows down he gets even more sloppy. Gutierrez stays very safe on the ground, dont see him getting subbed. Durden and Barcelos are more dangerous and both had his back for around at least. He also has underrated takedown D and getups. Other than a meme leg kick KO ( he has 2 now so possible ), I think he picks off Corales for 3 rounds.

Hawes/Winn: Awful matchup for Winn. Think Hawes is due for a KO again. Winn has better wrestling credentials I'm pretty sure, but means fuck all in MMA. He cant hold anyone down, so he always has to mat return fighters for 3 rounds, and he just doesn't have the cardio to do that. A half-dead Arroyo with 0 takedown defense kept getting up from under him. He got hurt by Stewart in the second, by GM3 in the third and Arroyo was tagging him in the first. You don't want to be taking punches from Hawes. Winn is durable but I think Hawes' cardio has improved so much he could even finish Winn late when he tires out, especially if he targets the body. Round 1 and the under have juicy odds, but if you want to be safe just the KO prop is plus money.

Agapova/Mazo: Easy dog or pass here, no way I can lay that kind of price on Mazo. She has lost RD 1 in 4 out of 5 of her UFC fights. She is still quite green, doesn't sit down on her punches, and has a trash ground game. She is going to be at a massive speed disadvantage early against Agapova. If Agapova comes out super aggressive, she might gas but that round is going to be a sweat. Agapova is also an opertunistic back taker. Mazo gave up her back twice to try to stand up against Davis and was stuck in that position for the rest of the round. Agapova can at least reverse ground positions and has some aggression about her. Also pretty good GNP. I have seen the craziness regarding Agapova and that Moroz interview. The photo in the interview is about 13 weeks ago, more than 3 months. She's at a new gym now and its hard to know if that stuff is still going on, but if its not that's plenty of time to get some solid training in. I think Mazo is tough so not sure if I can play Agapova either, live bet might be a good spot if she empties the gass in the first.

Elliot/Nicolau: Nicolau is a solid fighter, good everywhere. Great grappling and wrestling, technical boxing, and good power. Nice leg kick. Volume and cardio could be a bit better and I have questions about that chin. Although it held up against Kape who was landing some solid stuff. I had to go back to his TUFF days to see some takedown defence and how he is off his back. I liked what I seen in terms of technical get-ups and not staying on the ground long. The Efrain fight more recently in Brave was a bit more concerning, but I think he just decided to stay on the ground to ride out rounds that he was clearly winning. In the second he was hunting for a heel hook and also hurt his opponent with a solid upkick. I think he could be live for a sub here considering Elliot almost got his knee blown up by Beniot of all people. The fact that Elliot is going to keep coming and has better volume makes these odds a bit wide. But I still think Nicolau is a level above and im noticing improvements fight to fight.

Dern/Marina: Seems like a simple fight but something about it makes it hard to get a read on. I have half a unit on Dern by finish because I will be pissed if that result happens and I had no money on it. Otherwise, in a 5 round fight and with no finish I favour Marina all day. She always has one takedown in her in each fight, but she still hasn't been subbed by black belts like Calvillo and Ribas. I know Dern is on another level, but I just have a bad feeling Marina could survive by just holding on till the next round. Not playing props here as I recon Dern is durable and the only KO Marina has in the UFC is against Ribas who in my opinion is a bit chinny. But out of principle I will keep that Dern finish play at plus money


Just for reference, I doubt Calvillo or Ribas would last more than a few minutes on the ground with Dern. She's not just a level above them, she's literally WORLDS better than they are on the mat.

If Dern gets Marina down with more than a couple minutes in a round to go, your itd bet likely cashes. Dern's challenge will be navigating the distance to get her hands on Marina and then actually dragging her to the mat.
 
So I placed my bet on Winn yesterday, and watched a plethora of videos from cappers I respect this morning, and all of them are on Winn.

Glad I'm not on an island. That's why I post on here, and watch videos from various people -- I like to get as many perspectives as possible. I don't blindly tail anyone, but sometimes I miss things.

Cody Saftic who I posted a video of for the most recent DWCS(he went 5/5) is on him, MMA LOTN who I consider fairly sharp is on him, Dan Hardy is(Dan Hardy said he hasn't bet in forever and is actually going to make his first bet in a while on Winn), and Clint(but I disagree with Clint so much).

I'm not saying Winn is my lock of the month or anything, I just think the odds are way off and Hawes is super overrated, and I'm glad that some people I respect see the same thing.
I’m on hawes

think he rolls
 
I’m on hawes

think he rolls

If Hawes starches him in round 1 I won't be shocked.

But if round 1 ends, and a lot of energy was expended on both sides(and Winn isn't hurt), I see him getting a sloppy decision, and maybe dare I say it, even a late r3 finish.

Winn pushes through his cardio issues and still manages to win rounds gassed. Hawes looks like absolute shit when he's gassed, and with the pace Winn sets, Hawes will gas if we get to the 7 minute mark or so.

While Daukaus has a better pure grappling game than Winn, his takedowns are not even in the same stratosphere. And most people betting on Hawes are high on him because of that win. Styles make fights.
 
If Hawes starches him in round 1 I won't be shocked.

But if round 1 ends, and a lot of energy was expended on both sides(and Winn isn't hurt), I see him getting a sloppy decision, and maybe dare I say it, even a late r3 finish.

Winn pushes through his cardio issues and still manages to win rounds gassed. Hawes looks like absolute shit when he's gassed, and with the pace Winn sets, Hawes will gas if we get to the 7 minute mark or so.

While Daukaus has a better pure grappling game than Winn, his takedowns are not even in the same stratosphere. And most people betting on Hawes are high on him because of that win. Styles make fights.
Hawes showed me everything I needed to see in his fight vs daukaus. He fought through being hurt and came back and dominated. Daukaus was the one who was gassed in the third.

winn hasn’t showed me much of anything. It’s a bad matchup for him
 
So I placed my bet on Winn yesterday, and watched a plethora of videos from cappers I respect this morning, and all of them are on Winn.

Glad I'm not on an island. That's why I post on here, and watch videos from various people -- I like to get as many perspectives as possible. I don't blindly tail anyone, but sometimes I miss things.

Cody Saftic who I posted a video of for the most recent DWCS(he went 5/5) is on him, MMA LOTN who I consider fairly sharp is on him, Dan Hardy is(Dan Hardy said he hasn't bet in forever and is actually going to make his first bet in a while on Winn), and Clint(but I disagree with Clint so much).

I'm not saying Winn is my lock of the month or anything, I just think the odds are way off and Hawes is super overrated, and I'm glad that some people I respect see the same thing.
I never really understood why people consider the value of the odds when determing the likely outcome of the fight, you should bet based on what YOU think will be the likely outcome will be.
Winn is the underdog for a reason. He is going against an experienced strong rangy opponent. Winn is no khamzat or khabib, he might score a few takedowns but takes so much time off in between shots to reload its comical.
 
Mazo vs Agapova under 2.5 @ +170 is pretty good. I think both chicks are defensively flawed. Agapova is retarded so she's live to get finished or get a finish and Mazo has suspect ground game. I'm willing to put half a unit on +170
 
I'd be a little hesitant in betting Garcia to finish Ontiveros, at least early. Ontiveros is a can but Garcia recently fought at featherweight & bantamweight not too long ago, so I'm not expecting his power to be too devastating at lightweight.
He pretty much broke Peña's face with no-look punches while his back was taken, his power should be enough for a crumble merchant in Ontiveros.
 
what books do you guys use for MMA betting? or is what is the general consensus best book for MMA?

preferably ones with live betting and alt lines or alt props (NSC, fight doesn't start X round, etc)

may finally make the switch from local to an offshore. recs appreciated. TIA
 
doesn't want to cut ANY weight.
Wouldn't argue he's undersized at all but Winn fought at LHW until he debuted in the UFC. Weighed in at 205.6 Vs Tom Lawlor so he's cutting something.
 
Mazo vs Agapova under 2.5 @ +170 is pretty good. I think both chicks are defensively flawed. Agapova is retarded so she's live to get finished or get a finish and Mazo has suspect ground game. I'm willing to put half a unit on +170
yea I like that. Although I wish Mazo was more of a finisher
 
Just for reference, I doubt Calvillo or Ribas would last more than a few minutes on the ground with Dern. She's not just a level above them, she's literally WORLDS better than they are on the mat.

If Dern gets Marina down with more than a couple minutes in a round to go, your itd bet likely cashes. Dern's challenge will be navigating the distance to get her hands on Marina and then actually dragging her to the mat.
Eh, like I said just a bad feeling. Ribas was on the ground with for small periods and was able to disengage. She should have rolled through Spider monkey too, I understand thart was old unmotivated Dern. Maybe im overthinking it
 
Wouldn't argue he's undersized at all but Winn fought at LHW until he debuted in the UFC. Weighed in at 205.6 Vs Tom Lawlor so he's cutting something.

Okay but that's not really "weight cutting". He lost some fat sure, but there's a big difference in just losing some weight and actually cutting weight. It's not safe to cut too much weight and some of these guys cut muscle (which is brutal) and then dehydrate themselves to an absurd level (which is dangerous). I'm not advocating he go to that extreme to try to make 155 or whatever. But cutting out his daily McD's trip or whatever he did isn't "cutting weight". That's just deciding to look like SOME semblance of a professional. The reality is that the eye test says he could make 170 with some basic nutritional changes along with minimal actual weight cutting. He's still a short pudgy guy who is fighting a division up because he doesn't want to go through the grind of getting in the best shape he can.

I fought my 2 fights at 205. And I did grappling tourneys where I had to be <200 lbs. I got to 205 mostly by being diligent about my diet and not slacking on treadmill/road time (these were regional level "bum fights", I probably could have missed weight and they'd have found a way to sanction them so the promoter could keep the card filled). I had to sweat a little on weigh in day, but it wasn't miserable. But the extra 5 lbs for the couple grappling tournaments where I needed to be under 200...that was a lot tougher. I was pretty shredded so it wasn't 5 extra lbs of fat. But I didn't kill myself or look like death like some of these guys do. Winn might be uncomfortable for a bit as he cut to 170, but he could easily do it and likely be a much better fighter at 170.
 
Eh, like I said just a bad feeling. Ribas was on the ground with for small periods and was able to disengage. She should have rolled through Spider monkey too, I understand thart was old unmotivated Dern. Maybe im overthinking it

Yeah, if you watch that version of Dern she was kinda like a zombie. Go figure, you miss weight by 7 lbs because you're on the beach every day and not in the gym and you look like a drunk chick at a bar swinging wildly and have about 90 seconds of actual cardio.

Maybe I'm overselling the transformation...but I don't think so.

There is a PTV for Marina here for sure, imo though part of it cannot be getting taken down and expecting to hold on for dear life for 2 and a half, 3 minutes and ride out the round. Dern (now that she won't gas within 2 minutes) is too good at taking a few inches at a time until she can pass to a dominant position. She's very much like Maia in how she operates that way. Unfortunately for her, unlike Maia she hasn't come close to perfecting her entry to get to a single like he did. At his best, he was brilliant at doing that and then running the pipe to get the body lock. Dern's entries are still sloppy. She's basically admitted as much, saying she's prepared to get bloodied up as she closes distance. But that's actually a good thing for her in that she knows her limitations and has the correct mindset: Whatever it takes to get ahold of Marina, even taking some damage.
 
Winn is a can.He can't hurt anyone,on the feet or after a takedown.He couldn't keep Stewart down and lost that one,he barely squeaked by Arroyo on takedowns although Arroyo was also getting up.Hawes has a wrestling background,was a junior college champ then a D1 wrestler.If Winn takes him down he'll get up.He's a lot better on the feet.This is a bad match up for Winn,I,ll be very shocked if Hawes loses.
 
Winn couldn't even make it to the cage, let alone beat Phil Hawes. Chris Curtis is stepping in against Hawes on a couple of days notice
 
Winn couldn't even make it to the cage, let alone beat Phil Hawes. Chris Curtis is stepping in against Hawes on a couple of days notice
Ugh. The first time they were scheduled to fight I had him at -120.

now I just had him in parlays and prop bets
 
Winn couldn't even make it to the cage, let alone beat Phil Hawes. Chris Curtis is stepping in against Hawes on a couple of days notice

Very interested in what odds we'll get on Curtis. That guy always stays ready, has been waiting for this for years and is a skilled and massively experienced martial artist in all facets of the sport. If he's a decent sized dog I'm playing him.
 
Very interested in what odds we'll get on Curtis. That guy always stays ready, has been waiting for this for years and is a skilled and massively experienced martial artist in all facets of the sport. If he's a decent sized dog I'm playing him.

He was in camp for a fight early November, but I doubt he's going to be in amazing shape
 
He was in camp for a fight early November, but I doubt he's going to be in amazing shape

He's an extremely active fighter though, this is his 5th fight this year so he's always training.
 
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