Trump goes after workers, unions again - gets slapped down by courts

DIDM said:
I’ve worked for two unions, literally neither did anything besides take dues.

Sure there may be a good union out there, but they are more of a political force than for their members
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What were your wages like compared to non union work in the field?
 
@luckyshot

Wages weren’t high, one was a co op, the other a book store. But the book store is Powell’s books, largest independent bookstore, when I worked there it was 2001 when I started, I know they were doing over a million dollars a month online, and the store I worked at was a whole city block in downtown Portland. ILWU was that union, but we weren’t paid shit, I can’t remember the other one, SIEU probably.
 
ultramanhyata said:
In Murica "right to work" means you can bleed your own union to death by not paying dues and also be terminated by your employer at any time for any reason.

Pure freedom, bro.
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I'm interested to know your take on police unions who step in every time a cop does something bad.
 
Damien Karras said:
There are many things to consider. First of all we know that measuring work performance can be, more often than not, a flawed process. Also 120 days is about right when you consider an employee needs a verbal warning and a written warning with a performance improvement plan to take effect.

30 days sounds like an insufficient amoubt of time to me. Moreover, 120 does sound like a lot but it's just 4 months when you think of it.

I said it once and I'll say it again, the best defense against poor work performance is having good hiring practices. More often than not however employers see HR as a needless cost. Some of my friends are business owners and come to me looking for advice on what to do with their underperforming employees. I immediately ask them about their hiring procedures and more often than not I get "oh someone I know referred me this person" or they didn't check references or they went with their instinct cause they liked the way he/she interviewed. SMH
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I agree 100% on the hiring.

I think the timing will be greatly effected by both the job and the issue. If the issue is, for example, failure to submit an end of day report, then 30 days is plenty to decide if it is going to happen or not. If, on the other hand, the issue poor leadership skills then longer is necessary.

Still, in my experience, 30 days is plenty of time to see if the employee is going to improve. I have never had an employee ignore a verbal and/or written warning for 3 weeks and then suddenly change. Those who want their job start making changes (or trying too) pretty quickly.

Further, I've not ever fired someone who had no idea they were not doing their job. The fact is, people know when they are not meeting expectations. A warning is, in my opinion, most often a courtesy to let them know that you know they dropping the ball. For some issues, improvement plans with the necessary support may be a good idea but in my experience unless they involve a specific fixable issue (for instance I paid for an employee to take a multi-day training course on our inventory software) then they rarely work. Typically, employees who slack off will continue to do so. Employees who arrive late will continue to so.
 
tehJameson said:
He said he's for workers so it must be true according to his stupid voter base. Just like he's the law and order president, and least racist person you've ever met lol.

His "worker" base won't care even if they see this. I know they are dumber than most but they actually think some shady businessman from new york city who outsources and treats his employees like shit gives a damn about them? Trump loves the poorly educated.
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Key point. Poorly educated, outright stupid, or vile human beings - the entire pie chart of his voters.
 
Richmma80 said:
I'm interested to know your take on police unions who step in every time a cop does something bad.
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Unions are just like governments and just like private businesses. Some can and do become "bad actors".

Personally, I consider unionization an extremely faulty method of addressing the exploitation of workers within the capitalist system. But, at this stage in history, at least in the US, it is the only game in town (though hanging on by a thread) and its positive aspects need to be emphasized, its corrupt components need to be reformed.
 
ryan3434 said:
“These executive orders will make it easier for agencies to remove poor-performing employees and ensure that taxpayer dollars are more efficiently used,” Andrew Bremberg, head of the White House Domestic Policy Council, said on a call with reporters in May.

Sounds like a good idea to me
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No Shit, of course the guy selling it will make it sound good.
 
franklinstower said:
Yeah but that is because you are dumb enough to buy the anti union propaganda. If there were no unions people would be totally fucked and many businesses would work people into the ground, use them up, and hire new people afterwards.
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Its 2018 you don't need Unions but I do agree I'm not the brightest bulb in the ocean
 
ryan3434 said:
Its 2018 you don't need Unions but I do agree I'm not the brightest bulb in the ocean
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That is wrong for sure. We don't appear to need unions only because there are and have been unions. If all unions cease to exist then bussiness interests would slowly degrade at workers rights and safety.

Also I am sorry I said you were dumb. That is rude and uncalled for.
 
franklinstower said:
That is wrong for sure. We don't appear to need unions only because there are and have been unions. If all unions cease to exist then bussiness interests would slowly degrade at workers rights and safety.

Also I am sorry I said you were dumb. That is rude and uncalled for.
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No need to be sorry but I do appreciate it.
 
I feel like given I'm in a public sector union I should have more control over what my union uses my dues for.
 
HockeyBjj said:
One of the only things I don't like about unions (been working engineering at a union plant) is that they make it damn near impossible to let go of someone even if they blatantly deserve it, and a better employee deserves a promotion to that position that he doesn't get or a new potential hard worker won't get hired to an open position.

We've had a guy with 6 lockout violations in the last 2 years. There's been 8 total in that time. He's gotten 3 days off and unpaid and 5 days off, but no matter the offense the union fights tooth and nail and this shitty ass millwright demoted to operator keeps keeping his job. We had to write a formal policy stating that if he does a lockout or is a verifier, a 2nd verifier is needed.

This guy is going to literally get someone killed at a manufacturing plant, but we can't legally fire him before he does. It's not like he an amazing worker at everything else but mentally checks out on lockout tagout process either.
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that really sucks man. I have worked for 2 legit unions and both actually dealt with shitty employees themselves. One guy was a boozer and constantly missing shifts and the union actually booted him before the company did(ibew). The other was recently with another booze hound who got fired (Ilwu).
 
DIDM said:
I’ve worked for two unions, literally neither did anything besides take dues.

Sure there may be a good union out there, but they are more of a political force than for their members
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I have worked for 3 now. The first two didn't do much at all but the one I am currently in is great. They got us great pay and benefits. They actually fight to try and make things better for the workers.
 
Even FDR didn't like the idea of government workers unionizing. And when you consider how much these people have been abusing the system with overdoing the work from home or using Federal networks to look at porn, or sleeping on the job, then its clear that they are overpaid and under managed.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/inves...hy-Government-Issued-Computers-481926621.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...pt-thousands-hours-job-report-says/830618002/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ng-boss-never-noticed/?utm_term=.acce2df03ddc
 
The problem with unions in the modern world isn't that they wouldn't be a positive force, its that they simply lack any real leverage in the modern world. Free trade ensures that a company can relatively easily just move to a foreign low cost district should unions actually ever become any real leverage.
 
Kindacrazy said:
The problem with unions in the modern world isn't that they wouldn't be a positive force, its that they simply lack any real leverage in the modern world. Free trade ensures that a company can relatively easily just move to a foreign low cost district should unions actually ever become any real leverage.
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That´s going to work really well for your restaurant.
 
I would rather workers be overly protected and have a little dead weight than be under-protected. I've experienced both.

Matter of fact, I'd rather worker coops with businesses run democratically and as horizontally as possible but that's a whole other thing.
 
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