TRT for beginners | What I wish I knew before getting on TRT

[Diogenes of Sinope]

I appreciate you wanting to show facts. The confirmation bias here is that you had your eyes on TRT from the beginning as a solution to your symptoms as do most patients who end up like that. Your comment about estradiol puts that perfectly into context. There are no certain levels or numbers in scientific research right now that would recommend synthetic testosterone intake . Its a fad in the US. There is a reason why we have next to no TRT recommendation in my country as it is seriously lacking of research and full of people just wanting a shortcut and in the US scetchy doctors wanting to make a buck.

The possible side effects are also not well researched but from what we know there can be very severe consequences. Your symptoms f.e. can lead to a number of other solutions / diagnostics / treatments without abusing synthetic testosterone and I would guess at a quite deeper level of understanding the origin of your problems then just "low testosterone". A dlinical depression f.e. will near always lead to a loss in libido but you dont cure that with testosterone. Thats like having an injured organ and only taking heavy opioids. You feel great but it doesnt cure anything and is long term harmful.

In general I do hope that people reading this thread stay very sceptical of TRT because if you are on long enough there is no going back and if you then develop an illness that makes TRT impossible to continue or the side effects get to be a problem your body will go into a downfall I guarantee you no one wants to experience. Not even mentioning you might mistreat yourself entirely and ignore annother illness. Its at first a money making machine and and an easy way out of symptoms that might otherwise take a much more serious look to uncover, understand and treat.

If you dont want to get on TRT then dont. You'll survive.

If you want improved quality of life in all aspects then give it a shot. If you dont like it then do a HPTA restart protocol and your levels are likely to return to pre therapy

The side effect profile on an actual TRT regimen is low.
The majority of people will be completely fine.

 

[listrahtes]

If you want improved quality of life in all aspects then give it a shot.

Well I only assumed your stance to TRT in my first post but that kind of clears it up. Sadly I was right on all accounts.

People with primary hypogonadism and other serious illnesses should get on TRT no questions about but its NOT as easy as you make it. Show me the qualified longterm studies on HPTA recovery. They dont exist. The point is. If you are able to restart your HPTA after taking TRT you NEVER needed it to begin with.

Like I wrote its a fad for most just like you. Only 2-3% of all men with these symptoms qualify for TRT based on illness. The huge danger no one talks about is that people dont get further diagnostics / treatment for which very well might be other threatening illnesses be that physical or especially mental.

There is no klimakterium for men. Thats a lie and the problems you also encountered have much much more to do with other illnesses but mostly lifestyle choices including mental health that have a price at that age.

Right now the medical research situation shows some conclusions but you wont like them.

Its inconclusive about the benefits and only studies financed by TRT companies were determined about it.
Testosterone drugs do not extend life,
they slightly improve sexuality,
they do not improve physical fitness,
they do not improve health in old age, mental health problems, or memory.
TRT is no anti aging drug.

Risks are high blood pressure, blood lipids, thrombosis, prostata malfunction, elevated risk for certain cancer. Experts are divided about elevated risk of blood vessel and heart damage. It is assumed it elevates apoplex risk.

We had a huge study in europe with 3300 men 40years old upwards and supposed "TRT" symptoms. The symptoms were not based on low testosterone with only a very small fraction qualifying for TRT.

This is not a summary by myself but the whole doctors association of Germany after extensive research for years and dated 06/2021

sources:

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.
  

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.
  

 

[Diogenes of Sinope]

Well I only assumed your stance to TRT in my first post but that kind of clears it up. Sadly I was right on all accounts.

People with primary hypogonadism and other serious illnesses should get on TRT no questions about but its NOT as easy as you make it. Show me the qualified longterm studies on HPTA recovery. They dont exist. The point is. If you are able to restart your HPTA after taking TRT you NEVER needed it to begin with.

Like I wrote its a fad for most just like you. Only 2-3% of all men with these symptoms qualify for TRT based on illness. The huge danger no one talks about is that people dont get further diagnostics / treatment for which very well might be other threatening illnesses be that physical or especially mental.

There is no klimakterium for men. Thats a lie and the problems you also encountered have much much more to do with other illnesses but mostly lifestyle choices including mental health that have a price at that age.

Right now the medical research situation shows some conclusions but you wont like them.

Its inconclusive about the benefits and only studies financed by TRT companies were determined about it.
Testosterone drugs do not extend life,
they slightly improve sexuality,
they do not improve physical fitness,
they do not improve health in old age, mental health problems, or memory.
TRT is no anti aging drug.

Risks are high blood pressure, blood lipids, thrombosis, prostata malfunction, elevated risk for certain cancer. Experts are divided about elevated risk of blood vessel and heart damage. It is assumed it elevates apoplex risk.

We had a huge study in europe with 3300 men 40years old upwards and supposed "TRT" symptoms. The symptoms were not based on low testosterone with only a very small fraction qualifying for TRT.

This is not a summary by myself but the whole doctors association of Germany after extensive research for years and dated 06/2021

sources:

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.

Those are selective studies using poor dosage protocols. There are plenty of studies showing the benefits on both cognitive and cardiovascular health.

Actually, If you look into the studies you referenced, most of them support the beneficial claims that TRT is said to encourage

 

[listrahtes]

Enough with the fear-mongering lol.

You are such a clueless idiot that it hurts to read your comment. That was a meta research by one of the worlds most profound group of experts in that field.

I dont form an opinion and then look for evidence. I research and accept the superior knowledge of unbiased endocrinologists whith dozens of years and research experience. I actually thought about getting on TRT and because of that started to research. I wouldnt even argue about this on sherdog with mental midgets like you but there are a lot of youths and in general athletes here who might get the wrong impression with how strong TRT marketing nowadays is.

The vast majority of trt users are cheats, mental midgets with a junkie mentality or misslead people by marketing. All said.

 

[Diogenes of Sinope]

You are such a clueless idiot that it hurts to read your comment. That was a meta research by one of the worlds most profound group of experts in that field.

I dont form an opinion and then look for evidence. I research and accept the superior knowledge of unbiased endocrinologists whith dozens of years and research experience. I actually thought about getting on TRT and because of that started to research. I wouldnt even argue about this on sherdog with mental midgets like you but there are a lot of youths and in general athletes here who might get the wrong impression with how strong TRT marketing nowadays is.

The vast majority of trt users are cheats, mental midgets with a junkie mentality or misslead people by marketing. All said.

The protocols in the sources you listed were pretty poor; the administration protocols that weren't therapeutic in any way whatsoever.

If I could give protocol advice on here I would, but its not allowed.

Regardless, I wish you the best in your endeavors. If you dont want to take it then dont; Im not advocating anyone to take it, just offering advice on what I wish I had known when I first started. Like I said, you'll most likely be fine if you have low T, although you wont feel as best as you potentially could.

I'm not sure why youre in here getting so worked up over this. TRT has improved my health and sense of wellbeing immensely.

Endocrinologists have actually been lacking in this department for a while now, considering they focus more on hormones as a whole and not the hepatic 17-ketosteroid pathway of Testosterone.

 

[1rawdog]

Well it was fun while it lasted. I'm not sure if you boys have some prior beef or something but the mood shifted towards hostile pretty quickly there.
I had a half a dozen comments to make that would probably be seen as negative and positive about TRT and this discussion but I'm just not down with squabbling at the moment so I'll just drop two and bow out.

Aside from whatever personal shit you guys seem to have going on -

1 - There is plenty of data available from studies showing the positive effects of a sensible program on all kinds of health markers including cardiovascular.

2 - I've just looked at four of the links provided randomly. Maybe I will look at the rest sometime but if they were posted with the intent to illuminate negatives on the subject that didn't happen. In fact while fairly neutral overall they tend to promote it IMO. Here are the conclusions of those four;

Conclusions: Our systematic review suggests that TRT is not associated with an increased risk of VTE. However, estimates were accompanied by a wide 95% CIs, and a clinically important increased risk cannot be ruled out.
Conclusion: Lower levels of testosterone may be associated with an increased risk of all-cause dementia or AD. Testosterone supplement treatment may or may not improve general cognitive function in patients with cognitive impairment/AD.
Conclusions: The effect of testosterone supplementation on BMD and the risk of falls or fracture remains inconclusive. However, supplementation may benefit patients in the areas of sexual function and quality of life without increasing the risk of cardiovascular events, all-cause mortality, or prostatic events. RCTs with a longer follow-up period are still required.
Conclusions: Data from RCTs suggest that treatment with T is not effective in reducing CV risk, however, when TTh is correctly applied, it is not associated with an increase in CV risk and it may have a beneficial effect in some sub-populations. ...

Now play nice fuckers

 

[1rawdog]

...

Right now the medical research situation shows some conclusions but you wont like them.
...

Ok now I'm not sure wtf is going on here. I read the rest of the conclusions. Are you trolling? Did not read them? And with absolutely no disrespect intended I wonder if this is just a misunderstanding due to not regularly speaking english or something because it's too bizarre.

With the exception of one of them the vibe they give is definitely more positive than neutral. Many of those studies could be used to promote or advertise for a TRT clinic. The tone of your commentary does not jive with the literature you use to back it up at all.

 

[Volador]

Well I only assumed your stance to TRT in my first post but that kind of clears it up. Sadly I was right on all accounts.

People with primary hypogonadism and other serious illnesses should get on TRT no questions about but its NOT as easy as you make it. Show me the qualified longterm studies on HPTA recovery. They dont exist. The point is. If you are able to restart your HPTA after taking TRT you NEVER needed it to begin with.

Like I wrote its a fad for most just like you. Only 2-3% of all men with these symptoms qualify for TRT based on illness. The huge danger no one talks about is that people dont get further diagnostics / treatment for which very well might be other threatening illnesses be that physical or especially mental.

There is no klimakterium for men. Thats a lie and the problems you also encountered have much much more to do with other illnesses but mostly lifestyle choices including mental health that have a price at that age.

Right now the medical research situation shows some conclusions but you wont like them.

Its inconclusive about the benefits and only studies financed by TRT companies were determined about it.
Testosterone drugs do not extend life,
they slightly improve sexuality,
they do not improve physical fitness,
they do not improve health in old age, mental health problems, or memory.
TRT is no anti aging drug.

Risks are high blood pressure, blood lipids, thrombosis, prostata malfunction, elevated risk for certain cancer. Experts are divided about elevated risk of blood vessel and heart damage. It is assumed it elevates apoplex risk.

We had a huge study in europe with 3300 men 40years old upwards and supposed "TRT" symptoms. The symptoms were not based on low testosterone with only a very small fraction qualifying for TRT.

This is not a summary by myself but the whole doctors association of Germany after extensive research for years and dated 06/2021

sources:

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.

• Ayele HT, Brunetti VC, Renoux C, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of venous thromboembolism: A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials. Thrombosis research 2021; 199:123–31. DOI: 10.1016/j.thromres.2020.12.029. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/33486321.
  
  
• Corona G, Rastrelli G, Di Pasquale G, et al. Testosterone and Cardiovascular Risk: Meta-Analysis of Interventional Studies. J Sex Med 2018; 15(6):820–38. DOI: 10.1016/j.jsxm.2018.04.641. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29803351.
  
  
• Diem SJ, Greer NL, MacDonald R, et al. Efficacy and Safety of Testosterone Treatment in Men: An Evidence Report for a Clinical Practice Guideline by the American College of Physicians. Ann Intern Med 2020; 172(2):105–18. DOI: 10.7326/M19-0830. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31905375.
  
  
• Junjie W, Dongsheng H, Lei S, et al. Testosterone Replacement Therapy Has Limited Effect on Increasing Bone Mass Density in Older Men: A Meta-analysis. Curr Pharm Des 2019; 25(1):73–84. DOI: 10.2174/1381612825666190206223244. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30727867.
  
  
• Loo SY, Chen BY, Yu OH, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy and the risk of stroke in men: A systematic review. Maturitas 2017; 106:31–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.maturitas.2017.08.013. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29150164.
  
  
• Tan S, Sohrabi HR, Weinborn M, et al. Effects of Testosterone Supplementation on Separate Cognitive Domains in Cognitively Healthy Older Men: A Meta-analysis of Current Randomized Clinical Trials. The American journal of geriatric psychiatry official journal of the American Association for Geriatric Psychiatry 2019; 27(11):1232–46. DOI: 10.1016/j.jagp.2019.05.008. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31296441.
  
  
• Vartolomei MD, Kimura S, Vartolomei L, et al. Systematic Review of the Impact of Testosterone Replacement Therapy on Depression in Patients with Late-onset Testosterone Deficiency. European urology focus 2020; 6(1):170–7. DOI: 10.1016/j.euf.2018.07.006. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30017901.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. The effects of testosterone on bone health in males with testosterone deficiency: A systematic review and meta-analysis. BMC Endocr Disord 2020; 20(1):33. DOI: 10.1186/s12902-020-0509-6. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32145741.
  
  
• Zhang Z, Kang D, Li H. Testosterone and Cognitive Impairment or Dementia in Middle-Aged or Aging Males: Causation and Intervention, a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry Neurol. 2020:891988720933351. DOI: 10.1177/0891988720933351. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32602403.

I personally wouldn't take hormones unless prescribed by a doctor due to hypogonadism or some other condition. Then again, I'm also pretty young. I was put on thyroid medication by a doctor at one point in my early 20s after a bunch of studies, and nothing bad or crazy happened, so maybe low dose TRT isn’t too big of a deal either, not sure if there are any long term studies. I do think there's a bit of a fad and an industry going on with TRT. It was hilarious when Andrew Schultz (who's like mid 30s and doesn't seem like he even lifts) was asking Rogan about getting on HGH or TRT. Lol. But to each their own.

@1rawdog Has a point that the conclusion for all those studies is neutral or inconclusive for the most part, with a couple being mildly positive and none of them conclusively showing any ill effects.

 

[1rawdog]

I personally wouldn't take hormones unless prescribed by a doctor due to hypogonadism or some other condition. Then again, I'm also pretty young. I was put on thyroid medication by a doctor at one point in my early 20s after a bunch of studies, and nothing bad or crazy happened, so maybe low dose TRT isn’t too big of a deal either, not sure if there are any long term studies. I do think there's a bit of a fad and an industry going on with TRT. It was hilarious when Andrew Schultz (who's like mid 30s and doesn't seem like he even lifts) was asking Rogan about getting on HGH or TRT. Lol. But to each their own.

@1rawdog Has a point that the conclusion for all those studies is neutral or inconclusive for the most part, with a couple being mildly positive and none of them conclusively showing any ill effects.

It certainly is true that many men seem to be being led by advertising. I would never encourage anyone to get on TRT if it was not medically necessary, frankly pinning gets old in a hurry. All the time and effort you need to manage it properly has a cost, especially since needs are ever evolving.
It's not a decision to be taken lightly, it's a lifetime commitment assuming you have an actual medical need and those that are just using it as a shortcut of some sort are asking for trouble. Sure if you change your mind you may be able to successfully get off and recover but often the nasty surprise will be that you are screwed now and you have actually created a medical need. Then I'm sure it sucks to deal with much worse, ooops.

 

[chosey whales]

somewhat inactive.
"we all walk a certain amount every day even if we are sedentary"













Similar:
sitting

seated

desk-bound

desk

inactive

still

stationary


Opposite:
active

mobile

• (of work or a way of life) characterized by much sitting and little physical exercise.
  "a sedentary lifestyle spells bad news for hips and thighs"
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Similar:
  sitting
  
  seated
  
  desk-bound
  
  desk
  
  inactive
  
  still
  
  stationary
  
  
  Opposite:
  active
  
  mobile
  
  
• (of a position) sitting; seated.
  "he spoke from a sedentary position"
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Similar:
  sitting
  
  

 

[wufabufa]

somewhat inactive.
"we all walk a certain amount every day even if we are sedentary"













Similar:
sitting

seated

desk-bound

desk

inactive

still

stationary


Opposite:
active

mobile

• (of work or a way of life) characterized by much sitting and little physical exercise.
  "a sedentary lifestyle spells bad news for hips and thighs"
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Similar:
  sitting
  
  seated
  
  desk-bound
  
  desk
  
  inactive
  
  still
  
  stationary
  
  
  Opposite:
  active
  
  mobile
  
  
• (of a position) sitting; seated.
  "he spoke from a sedentary position"
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Similar:
  sitting
  

 

[Diogenes of Sinope]

Well it was fun while it lasted. I'm not sure if you boys have some prior beef or something but the mood shifted towards hostile pretty quickly there.
I had a half a dozen comments to make that would probably be seen as negative and positive about TRT and this discussion but I'm just not down with squabbling at the moment so I'll just drop two and bow out.

Aside from whatever personal shit you guys seem to have going on -

1 - There is plenty of data available from studies showing the positive effects of a sensible program on all kinds of health markers including cardiovascular.

2 - I've just looked at four of the links provided randomly. Maybe I will look at the rest sometime but if they were posted with the intent to illuminate negatives on the subject that didn't happen. In fact while fairly neutral overall they tend to promote it IMO. Here are the conclusions of those four;

Conclusions: Our systematic review suggests that TRT is not associated with an increased risk of VTE. However, estimates were accompanied by a wide 95% CIs, and a clinically important increased risk cannot be ruled out.
Conclusion: Lower levels of testosterone may be associated with an increased risk of all-cause dementia or AD. Testosterone supplement treatment may or may not improve general cognitive function in patients with cognitive impairment/AD.
Conclusions: The effect of testosterone supplementation on BMD and the risk of falls or fracture remains inconclusive. However, supplementation may benefit patients in the areas of sexual function and quality of life without increasing the risk of cardiovascular events, all-cause mortality, or prostatic events. RCTs with a longer follow-up period are still required.
Conclusions: Data from RCTs suggest that treatment with T is not effective in reducing CV risk, however, when TTh is correctly applied, it is not associated with an increase in CV risk and it may have a beneficial effect in some sub-populations. ...

Now play nice fuckers

I have no idea who this gentleman is. We've never interacted on SD before.

 

[chosey whales]

Lol sedentary was in the op I googled it copy and paste but it was a longer post then I meant for it to be

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

I have no idea who this gentleman is. We've never interacted on SD before.

how long have you been on, whats your dose and how old are you?

and also, you are happy with it, and happy to stay on for life?

 

[Diogenes of Sinope]

how long have you been on, whats your dose and how old are you?

and also, you are happy with it, and happy to stay on for life?

28. was first prescribed about 3 years ago. Im pretty happy and will stay on. My mental health has never been better. Rumination and anxiety/depressive states have completely dissipated since TRT. I got off for fertility purposes for a while and the difference in mental health and energy was right and day.

 

[shunyata]

Taking zinc all the time is a bad idea though. I heard that it will throw off your copper and iron if you supplement it every day for months and months

If you overdose zinc it can run you into iron absorption issues, yeah.

It's not about frequency of use per se, more about over dosing and then continuing to overdose long term.

Regular lower dosages won't run into that issue.

 

[sweetviolenturg]

how long have you been on, whats your dose and how old are you?

and also, you are happy with it, and happy to stay on for life?

Myself, I've been on TRT for close to four years, I'm on 200 mg every 14 days & I'm 57-years-old.

And before my wife passed away three months ago, I was very happy with it. It worked wonders for me & I felt great. I performed very well & I've had no adverse side-effects whatsoever. And I have no issues with being on it for the rest of my life. I almost went off it after my wife died because I didn't think there was any reason to stay on it. Because keeping up with her was my primary reason for going on it, to begin with ( she was 21 years younger than me ). But my primary convinced me to stay on it. She said that my depression would only get worse if I stopped as would my energy levels which would adversely affect my overall health. So, I agreed that staying on it was a good idea.

 

[sweetviolenturg]

You are such a clueless idiot that it hurts to read your comment. That was a meta research by one of the worlds most profound group of experts in that field.

I dont form an opinion and then look for evidence. I research and accept the superior knowledge of unbiased endocrinologists whith dozens of years and research experience. I actually thought about getting on TRT and because of that started to research. I wouldnt even argue about this on sherdog with mental midgets like you but there are a lot of youths and in general athletes here who might get the wrong impression with how strong TRT marketing nowadays is.

The vast majority of trt users are cheats, mental midgets with a junkie mentality or misslead people by marketing. All said.

Sounds like you have an agenda and/or something against those of us who are on TRT, my friend. And you clearly didn't understand the literature featured in the links you posted. Either that or you didn't bother reading it.

 

[Diogenes of Sinope]

@listrahtes

 

[Smato_rules]

I’m curious about the 5% estradiol number you stated. I’ve had my testosterone tested twice in my life, but only once did they test for estradiol. My estradiol was 15% of my total test and at the time I was about 240lbs at 6ft, sedentary and recovering from inguinal hernia surgery. I’m just curious what the relationship between total t and estradiol is; I’m assuming my excess body fat at the time may have had something to do with it. I was tested two years earlier while being 50lbs lighter and my total and free were both quite a bit higher, unfortunately I did not get tested for estradiol. Also if it matters, both times my sbhg were 10 and 13. I appreciate this thread, it is a great source of information.