Top 10 HWs ever from their backs.

[kikikhan]

It is a dropoff after the first 4 guys on the list, beyond that I would suggest Yoshida probably deserves to be there somewhere.

As far as the top goes I would say Werdum and Nog are very close, in terms of looking for triangles and armbars from their backs I think both are excellent. I would say though that Nog was a bit better at hitting sweeps from his back and in grabbing subs during transitions. Werdum's edge in BJJ overall is IMHO based on also having an excellent positional game when ontop.

I put Werdum on nr. 1 because he is less predictable and more sneaky, because he isn't as active. And he seems like he always knows something that his opponent doesn't.

But yeah, very close.

I agree that it's very hard to rate from 4. on.

I tried.

 

[LogicalError]

That is, indeed, a great call. Very few people have ever mounted crocop. Same goes for Wanderlei. Barnett, with his foundation in catch, is more mountable than both (crocop even mounted him quite easily), but his submissions are so good that he's just much better overall.

Werdum is easily the best. Nog has beautiful bjj- subs and sweeps- but Werdum is just simply the best... he's a stronger, better Nog.

I don't think it's fair to rank positional priority the same for catch guys. It's amazing how fast they'll give up their backs to attack your legs or try to Kimura you.

 

[kikikhan]

Ricco was decent off his back

Ricco. Damn. Ricco was good, yeah. Thanks, forot about him.

 

[kikikhan]

Schilt was surprisingly decent, good call.
Also agree with Herring. I think the metagame was more focused on scrambling than takedown defense, also takedown defense in higher weight classes is highly dependent on the cage and fighting for underhooks there, something that wasn't viable in the Pride ring.
Overeem had a decent guard when he was a LHW, I wonder if that part of his game is still there now that he's huge and doesn't get taken down.

Yup.

As for Overeem. He was pretty big vs Hunt, but yeah. Agree.

 

[kikikhan]

Wow, no takedowns ? You have a source on that ?

Wikipedia and from what I've seen I believe it.

Why would he attempt TD? He was never even dropped

 

[Supereem]

Barnett is a top game guy, his guard was not very good

He used to pull guard in his early UFC career. He doesn't seem very keen to emphasize that past.

His guard is what led him to gaining top position on Randy and winning the UFC HW title.

 

[Taric]

I would say though that Nog was a bit better at hitting sweeps from his back

There is no fighter in the history of MMA that had better half guard sweeps than Nogueira imo. If he wanted to sweep you, he did (and that includes doing it to Werdum).
By far his best quality in terms of grappling.

 

[Supereem]

Also Marcio Cruz was a triangle God.

 

[Supereem]

There is no fighter in the history of MMA that had better half guard sweeps than Nogueira imo. If he wanted to sweep you, he did (and that includes doing it to Werdum).
By far his best quality in terms of grappling.

Most of the current HW forum posters never watched his old school Pride fights other than the Fedor ones. They did not witness his brilliant grappling. Many think the stiff hipped man who got submitted by Mir is the prime grappling Nog.

 

[kikikhan]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1cduh_josh-barnett-vs-yoshiki-takahashi_sport

12:10, for Barnett's sub.

Barnett could do it all.

 

[ALAN PARTRIDGE]

top5 would worked for me

 

[kikikhan]

Most of the current HW forum posters never watched his old school Pride fights other than the Fedor ones. They did not witness his brilliant grappling. Many think the stiff hipped man who got submitted by Mir is the prime grappling Nog.

Yeah. I had a hard time deciding between him and Werdum.

But Werdum seems more efficient and harder to hit.

 

[Human Bass]

I like Condit.

 

[kikikhan]

I like Condit.

That's nice

 

[pridefc33]

👍👍 👍 👍

 

[kikikhan]

I forgot to mention Kohsaka.

The man had a very good guard.

 

[Grijswaarde]

Good list no doubt. Some could be swapped but all in all i agree.

 

[kikikhan]

Good list no doubt. Some could be swapped but all in all i agree.

Yeah. It's hard to decide after the first 4. But I tried.

 

[ligthandshadow]

I think in PRIME Ricco Rodriguez was very agile and effective for a big man on his back.

 

[kikikhan]

Ever wondered why Fedor's ground game and strength went to sh*t trough the years?

Here are some photos that would explain why.

Fedor used to lift, a lot and was a beastly grappler in his early career

and also trained how to overcome this 270+ grappler in training:

Then he trained with these 2 guys and Zentsov too, so he was used to deal with size and top quality:

After 2005 his training partners went to sh*t and he started to slowly go to sh*t himself (for Fedor's standards. He was still a beast).