International To Fight Rising Rents, Berlin Considers Expropriating All Landlords With More Than 3000 Apt. Units

[EradiatedHaggis]

This seems insane to me as an american. So if i build up a real estate business, bust my ass and get to where i have 3,000 units, the government would just take them away? How does that work? What about my employees? What about my income from those properties?

This concept makes zero sense to me. Someone please explain like im 5.

There is an easy explanation for you mate.

Leftism. The inability to live in and deal with reality due to the belief that feelings dictate reality.

"You have more than me, I feel that is wrong and unjust, so give me some for the sake of equality".

 

[surrealworlds]

The vibe I get from this forum is that posters take sweeping generalised positions towards problems or policies in the world as if every country is America. What doesn't work in America might work in Germany and vice versa.

This seems a bit out of left field don't you think?

You say you believe in social housing but can't you have social housing provided by taxes without taking away personal property?

 

[surrealworlds]

There is an easy explanation for you mate.

Leftism. The inability to live in and deal with reality due to the belief that feelings dictate reality.

"You have more than me, I feel that is wrong and unjust, so give me some for the sake of equality".

Honestly i try to avoid the left vs right crap. The whole concept of picking a side and sticking with it no matter what always seemed dumb to me. Shouldn't we be identifying problems and finding solutions instead of worrying about who is on who's team?

Sorry about the rant.

 

[phoenixikki]

We should be grateful it isn't the jews this time at least

Look up who owns Deustches Wohnen.

 

[jamel]

Bet money they only go after the landlords that keep prayer rugs and have an aversion to swine.

 

[EradiatedHaggis]

Honestly i try to avoid the left vs right crap. The whole concept of picking a side and sticking with it no matter what always seemed dumb to me. Shouldn't we be identifying problems and finding solutions instead of worrying about who is on who's team?

Sorry about the rant.

How dare you say sorry...

In this instance its important to remember who is fighting for what and justifying what. No one outside of the far left is going to remotely try to justify taking such things away from people and instead would actually try to find the source of the problem in order to actually fix it.

 

[plataoplombo]

I would think that some kind of rent control legislation would make more sense but maybe they're smarter than us. Rent control in the U.S. did not result in better living conditions, for economic reasons, so I can't see it working any better in Berlin because the economics of being a landlord don't really change anywhere in the world.

It's crazy the one landlord can own 110,000 units. It really puts the city in a tough place.

It's a lot but not that crazy. You can scale up pretty quickly once you get your first multi-family. A lot of people shoot for 100, but once you reach it or even start getting close, new opportunities start springing up.

 

[brackis1]

Ever heard of the well-known economic model supply-and-demand? Apparently not.

lol what are you, 12?
I referenced a number of economic concepts such as inflation and (indirectly) GDP and your reply is "hey have you heard of supply and demand?" ??????????? bahahahhaha
That's like having a discussion about wind resistance and someone chiming in "HAVE YOU HEARD OF GRAVITY RETARD!?"

 

[GearSolidMetal]

“We are essentially saying goodbye to the market economy and replacing it with a different system, be it socialism or communism.”

After reading this, Bernie Sanders just got a boner without needing to take viagra.

 

[Cole train]

Prices are driven by demand and supply.

I see a huge but short 3 story building with a metric fuck ton of undeveloped land in that picture.

Want to lower rent? Make a bunch of 10-50 story frames and fill them with concrete on that open land. Replace the existing 3 story apartments with the same structures. Bam -- like 10,000 nice apartments in 3 weeks. Rinse, repeat. Then everyone's rent gets cut to like 20% of what they're paying right now.

I'm in a place right now where they do that and I live in a great apartment. The rent is like $300. It's in a first world country, in a huge mega city, where people, including laborers (this isn't a 3rd world mega city hiring cheap labor from its rural areas), make as much money as they do in the US or Germany. The difference is that the building codes for residence/ business zoning and building types (skyscrapers, stories, etc) are super relaxed instead of super restrictive. The safety codes are super strict though, just like over there.

American cities are all like "oh you can't build apartments in the same blocks as restaurants! No houses next to churches or schools! oh you can't build more than 3-4 stories in residential areas! No building next to stores! oh you need to get x amount of signatures from people already living in the area! It has to made out of the same materials and be the same style as the historic buildings around the area! blah blah blah" .

None of that BS here. So, you get gigantic, safe buildings springing up in like 3 weeks everywhere.

In the US or Europe, rent in a place like I'm living in the location I'm living in right next to a metro station would be like $2000. But it's just $300 here.

How about you share the name of this magical place where rent is cheap?

 

[tonni]

I imagine the people being targeted are the speculatiors who buy property and leave it empty, it’s rampant in Europe.

why do you hate suCcEs!!!

 

[Blowing Dixie]

We should be grateful it isn't the jews this time at least

First they came for the landlords, and I did not speak out, because I was not a landlord.

Hold on to your guns Germany.. The oppressors are coming!

 

[Rematch]

lol what are you, 12?
I referenced a number of economic concepts such as inflation and (indirectly) GDP and your reply is "hey have you heard of supply and demand?" ??????????? bahahahhaha
That's like having a discussion about wind resistance and someone chiming in "HAVE YOU HEARD OF GRAVITY RETARD!?"

Wow. You are insane.

 

[brackis1]

Wow. You are insane.

I mean fucking go for it genius. Show me how "supply and demand" is a legitimate answer to my question directed at some bigot crying about immigrants.
Again: are the immigrants paying for housing with money (and thus economic participants/contributors) and driving prices up.... or are they leaches abusing the system who aren't contributing economically and thus not paying for housing?

 

[cincymma79]

First they came for the landlords, and I did not speak out, because I was not a landlord.

Hold on to your guns Germany.. The oppressors are coming!

I own rentals so I’m paying attention. I’m sure it’ll stop at someone else though and they’ll never get to people like me

 

[panamaican]

It's a lot but not that crazy. You can scale up pretty quickly once you get your first multi-family. A lot of people shoot for 100, but once you reach it or even start getting close, new opportunities start springing up.

It's pretty crazy. 110,000 residential units in a major metropolis is a lot.

If you're talking multi-story, apartment complex size, multi-family, a modest 20 story building might have 400 or so units. Owning 275 20 story buildings is a substantial amount. Price wise that's even more substantial. There's only a very small percentage of organizations or landlords that have the capital and the access to financing to acquire that much real estate.

If you're going cheap, then you might get 50 units in a building worth ~$3-5 million in an outer lying region, but then you're looking at thousands of such buildings...again, in a single city.

No matter how you slice it, 110,000 residential units in a single metropolitan area is pretty crazy.

 

[val_lixembeau]

Honestly i try to avoid the left vs right crap. The whole concept of picking a side and sticking with it no matter what always seemed dumb to me. Shouldn't we be identifying problems and finding solutions instead of worrying about who is on who's team?

Not quite. The "side" you are on will affect what you see as an acceptable solution.

To me as an outsider, the American Right and Left appear as though they are approaching life from opposite viewpoints, and I don't mean conservative versus liberal.

I think the American Right starts from basic, simple principles or values (e.g. small government, limited taxation, law and order focus etc.) and attempts to apply that to everything in life. I think this fails because real society is complex. It's as though you approached engineering problems using only some formulae you learned in physics class. Sure the forumae hold true, but there are layers and layers of complexity layered on top of that which you have to take into account too. They want to apply those principles without any softening no matter how harsh society might end up for some people.

I think the American Left starts from wanting a particular outcome. They don't want people to suffer, or even have their feelings hurt. They want a caring society where those who have more share with those who have less. This fails too because it fails to take into account human nature, and doesn't really have any philosophical foundation other than "be nice".

Whichever camp you fall into, you won't easily be able to emotionally understand the solution the other side comes up with because it is so foreign to your way of thinking and everyday experience. It takes a lot of emotional energy and mental effort to be truly bi-partisan.

 

[plataoplombo]

It's pretty crazy. 110,000 residential units in a major metropolis is a lot.

If you're talking multi-story, apartment complex size, multi-family, a modest 20 story building might have 400 or so units. Owning 275 20 story buildings is a substantial amount. Price wise that's even more substantial. There's only a very small percentage of organizations or landlords that have the capital and the access to financing to acquire that much real estate.

If you're going cheap, then you might get 50 units in a building worth ~$3-5 million in an outer lying region, but then you're looking at thousands of such buildings...again, in a single city.

No matter how you slice it, 110,000 residential units in a single metropolitan area is pretty crazy.

Yeah totally agree. 110K units is a huge chunk of a city.

 

[panamaican]

This seems insane to me as an american. So if i build up a real estate business, bust my ass and get to where i have 3,000 units, the government would just take them away? How does that work? What about my employees? What about my income from those properties?

This concept makes zero sense to me. Someone please explain like im 5.

Okay, first 3000 units isn't that much.

As for the government taking them away, I can't speak for Germany but eminent domain is how we do it here. It basically allows the government to take private property for a necessary government purpose so long as they compensate you reasonably for it. Of course, the government's definition of "Reasonable" if usually below what the market would pay.

As far as a city goes, one of its primary responsibilities is providing housing to the people who live there. And part and parcel of that is making sure such housing is affordable. Why is it important? Because a city needs to ensure that the people who work in the city and pay the taxes that sustain the city can find housing that keeps them within its tax jurisdiction. Overly expensive housing pushes people into the surrounding areas reducing the tax base and impoverishing the city. It also reduces the vibrancy of your city's overall population.

So, to protect that, government is well within reason to step in and attempt to resolve that problem.

 

[surrealworlds]

Okay, first 3000 units isn't that much.

So you think people that have "not that much" should have to turn over property they worked for and paid for because the city says so?

As for the government taking them away, I can't speak for Germany but eminent domain is how we do it here. It basically allows the government to take private property for a necessary government purpose so long as they compensate you reasonably for it. Of course, the government's definition of "Reasonable" if usually below what the market would pay.

As far as a city goes, one of its primary responsibilities is providing housing to the people who live there. And part and parcel of that is making sure such housing is affordable. Why is it important? Because a city needs to ensure that the people who work in the city and pay the taxes that sustain the city can find housing that keeps them within its tax jurisdiction. Overly expensive housing pushes people into the surrounding areas reducing the tax base and impoverishing the city. It also reduces the vibrancy of your city's overall population.

So, to protect that, government is well within reason to step in and attempt to resolve that problem.

If the cost of housing is the only reasoning wouldn't rent restrictions do the same thing? Make max limits on what landlords can charge for rent and you have lowered the cost of housing for anyone that lives in the city. Why is taking one persons property for the benefit of others the only viable answer?