There is no way you can watch Jones' last 3 fights and conclude hes the GOAT

Mixfight makes a big whiny thread after every single UFC PPV.

Have you ever considered therapy Mixfight? Surely 13 years of crying into your Pride DVD's on a nightly basis can't be healthy.
 
Mixfight said:
Fedor was way more impressive than Jones. The intensity and ferocity was on another level.
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Jones is superior to Fedor in every way possible. The thing is deep down you're well aware of this, which is why your overwhelming insecurities about Fedor's lack of ability results in you creating a big whiny thread after every single PPV.
 
thobra said:
but I am positive that Santos, Smith And Reyes Are better fighters than DC and Gus
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{<huh}

Lol what?

Arent you that clown who said Mark Hunt had better ground game in 2005 than he does now????
 
I had Jones losing to Reyes, but in what world is he not a GOAT contender? The guy has beaten several generations of the LHW division and it's only Reyes who has been a legit threat to him. And yes, Jones is a cheater, but since I think everyone is cheating I think it is naïve that only those that have not been caught yet are eligible to be in the GOAT consideration.
 
Mixfight said:
Khabib more impressive.

Anderson was more impressive too IMO.

I'd say GSP was more impressive as well.
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Silva popped too. Double standards
Silva didn't have the offensive and defensive wrestling jones has. He's less rounded
Silva did not fight the same level of competition.
The two goats are mm and jones. And I hate jones. Goats win at all costs. Not every performance will be dominant. It shows the step up in competition, new generation of talent and tactics, physical degradation and the fact that those two individuals are still able to do what they do at that level, have such a grasp on all the disciplines and still win every fight, regardless of how close they are, clearly shows that jones (alongside mm) is the goat.
GSP close second
 
If you get caught taking steroids you absolutely should not be in the GOAT conversation. In the vast majority of sports it wouldn’t even be in question, but for some reason he seems to get a pass from some fans of MMA. I think PED taking is probably less frowned upon in the US than the rest of the world.


The fact is, once PEDs are involved this sport becomes less about who the better fighter is and more about who reacts to drugs better, who can beat the testing, and who has the best doctor.
 
Night Slasher said:
GSP,Fedor and all the other “GOATS” had horrible fights aswell.
He has the best record in the sport
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Jon has had 3 back to back horrible fights, 2 of which people think he lost.

That's like 30% of his title defenses
 
Mixfight said:
Fedor was way more impressive than Jones. The intensity and ferocity was on another level. Juiced up Jones would have a chance against Fedor but current Jones would get killed by a prime Fedor. It woudlnt even be close.
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Prime Fedor would destroy any version of Jon Jones.
 
He's 32 and is in 12th year in the UFC... pretty amazing to be honest. During that previous 11 years he fought 21 times and with very few exceptions (Gusamo and maybe Jake O'Brien) he has fought some amazing competition. He has definitely slowed down and people can attribute that to whatever they choose; laying off the juice, age, overall MMA attrition (training and fighting wearing out the body), or a mixture of all.

He's easily one of the best MMA fighters to ever do it....end of story. ALL of the GOAT contenders have had some close fights where people claim they had gifted decisions. Fedor has Ricardo Arona, GSP has Hendricks, and Anderson kind of just fell apart after he met Chris Weidman in the cage. Others suggest that Mighty Mouse might be the GOAT but I can't see that at all...he had a chance to make his name known and he refused the fight (Dillashaw), and then he went to fight relative unknowns in Asia for the rest of his career.

The problem is that no one has definitively gone out there and whipped Jones for an entire fight, or finished him. Jones always makes a solid comeback and or finishes the fight, so it's hard to just dismiss him because you personally had him losing this fight. Reading this forum (and I looked at Facebook and Reddit) and it seems very mixed as to who people feel won the fight, and both sides feel that the judging criteria are on their side.
 
Mixfight said:
Its simply impossible to watch his last 3 fights and conclude that hes the greatest fighter to ever live.

The reality is that steroids make a huge difference. There is a reason for why Jones is unable to power through his shots like he used to. Why he isn't as fierce in the clinch. Why his intensity in general is nothing it like it used to be.

We are in a new era of Jon Jones where he isnt nearly as dominant as he once was. He plays it safe and controls the center of the Octagon and shows great endurance late in the fight and is good at stealing rounds but he isnt nearly as deadly and dangerous as he used to be and truthfully hes just not that impressive.

This is what we will be seeing from him for the rest of his career which is OK I guess and still somewhat impressive on some scale but its not GOAT like. I dont see the same level of dominance. No way in hell tonight's Jones finishes DC the way he did late in the fight with a high kick without the gear.

Reyes, Santos and Smith are good fighters but they arent better fighters than DC, young Rampage, Prime Glover or prime Rashad and Jones of today wouldnt have dominated DC, Rampage and Glover like he did when he was juiced up like a Christmas ham.

The conclusion is even without steroids Jones is still pretty good but hes not putting on GOAT like performances. Instead hes actually quite boring and competitive with guys he would have probably ran through when he was still on steroids..

We are now seeing what Jones would have really looked like without steroids. Good but GOAT??? Na son.

Jones last finish was against Gus who mentally quit the sport and got submitted by Anthony Smith in his very next fight AND Jones was pulsing in that fight and the event had to be moved to LA last minute because Nevada refused to sanction a fighter with steroids in his system.

Jones last 3 fights with no steroids: 3 boring decisions where he didnt look dangerous at all. Completely unimpressive. That's steroids for you...
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Completely Unimpressed.. So what are you saying about his past 3 opponents that he still won against even if it was close??
 
Mob69 said:
What I do feel confident saying about Jones after the last three fights:

[1] The performances have all been mediocre. His offensive potency has simply withered and evaporated. Jones is clearly either past his prime, or was a PED product to begin with.

[2] I scored Jones as losing both the Santos and Reyes fights. So he is 1-2.

[3] Irrespective of whether he should be classed as the all-time P4P GOAT, his last three performances [i.e. his most recent body of work] have been so technically poor that there is no way on earth Jones should still be thought of as a current P4P great. There are *lots* of fighters who have looked technically better, against superior opposition, than Jones has of late. He doesn't belong anywhere near the top of the rankings.
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No peds and matching size makes JJ look like a weaker version of GSP.
 
There's no way you can watch the last 3 UFC events and conclude that we're watching an actual clean sport
 
Jones has got 14 title fight wins.

Sure, his last 3 fights aren't as impressive as some current fighter's latest fights .

But if you look at Jones first half of his championship reign that most current fighter's records out of the water.

Do consider that your favorite fighter might also have a few weaker performances if they went 14 title fights in a row.

(I'm fine with dismissing Jones entirely because of doping though)
Mixfight said:
Khabib more impressive.
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Khabib has 3 title fight wins. When Jones had 3 title fight wins it was 2011 and he was finishing Shogun, Rampage and Lyoto.

I'm fine if you throw Jones out of the GOAT debate because of roids. But based on records I don't get it.
 
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Hummel said:
Everyone is good on sherdog until they decline or lose. Then they were never good in the first place. You name Khabib. What happens if he loses to Tony? I bet for 90% here he would not even be in the top 10 goat statistics...
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If Khabib loses to Tony he will be no better than the "Russian cans" he fought before coming to UFC according to Sherdog.
 
The only thing I'd argue is that half of the prime LHW's he fought were small LHW's.
He's facing massive LHW's that are his size now... this is the thing. not Shogun and Rashad and Lyoto who shouldve all been MW's
 
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