The rise of Boxing in MMA and the demise of Jon Jones

[Venom]

So-so strikers? Lyoto, Vitor, Gus, Shogun. All top LHW strikers (except Vitor, he's a roided up MW). All lost to a complete MMA arsenal, with an emphasis on Muay Thai strikes and wrestling. Jon Jones also went on to put a clinic on Glover and then actually beat DC (would've been Gus but injury bug was hungry). Jon would beat Gus again because he has more.

Jone's reach keeps them at bay

You win MMA by being complete. You guys are overhyping boxing b/c 2 current champs are strikers.

False.
BOXING or lack thereof has contributed to a bunch of 2016 losses.
My point.

But Conor has already been steamrolled and looked vulnerable af against Nate and Mendes, and Nunes isn't just a boxer. Nunes has also lost and Ronda and Miesha are just shit strikers. Remember when HH got choked tf out by Tate? Yeah.

NATE ISNT a bad boxer himself..has an iron chin1..and rolled with the punches well. Something a lot of people in the league lack.

Nunes still got to the top utilizing mostly striking + takedown def.

The thing so many people are lacking is polished boxing offense/defense.

It seems like it should be a big area of focus

 

[Gluhov]

a lot of people have predicted that the top/elite of mma would eventually evolve into mostly boxing + takedown defense.

 

[skullmaskkid]

a lot of sloppy kickboxers/grapplers will keep getting upset by equal sized boxers

we first saw it with Conor vs Aldo, then Stipe, then Conor vs Alvarez, now Cody vs Cruz, even Gus gave Jones fits

HEIGHT and BOXING are the 2 determinants of success on the feet

 

[Venom]

a lot of sloppy kickboxers/grapplers will keep getting upset by equal sized boxers

we first saw it with Conor vs Aldo, then Stipe, then Conor vs Alvarez, now Cody vs Cruz, even Gus gave Jones fits

HEIGHT and BOXING are the 2 determinants of success on the feet

The age of this everyone being a jack of all trades stuff is going to pass haha.

With equal TDD, it appears the better boxer is more dominant.

 

[platypus44]

Most of these high-profile fighters who lost this year had something in common: They either fought someone their own or larger size or they were outmatched with the hands.

Let's even go back to the Fall of 2013, when Jon Jones won by a hair against a superior boxer his size.

It's only a matter of time before Jones' relatively inferior hands get exposed by a large, fast, accurate, and powerful boxer.

A matter of time? I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

[Jedi Judah]

Come on now, I love boxing but boxings not even the best striking art. If you think that, all you need is boxing and takedown defense then your an idiot. Come at me

 

[Evangelion]

Stop making this about Ronda specifically.

The point is Jon has been tagged before by some mediocre strikers, St Preux for example...
There will come a guy that can make him pay for slipups in distance and sloppy probes.

Wow astute opinion "at some point said fighter will lose to someone who can expose his weaknesses".

What's next age or injury affecting a fighters performance?

 

[VAfan]

jones has that freak reach advantage though which is a real x factor. was almost painful watching DC try to get inside on that.

 

[BluntForceTrama]

Three words

DOO
HO
CHOI

 

[Venom]

A matter of time? I wouldn't hold my breath.

See I know my standards are high, but what we really do need is a guy at least 6'3" or with decent reach (78+) that has amateur, National Golden Gloves finalist-level boxing and let's say....Anderson Silva type power, to keep it from being too extreme for LHW.

I think the effects of that would show real quickly at LHW.

 

[Venom]

Wow astute opinion "at some point said fighter will lose to someone who can expose his weaknesses".

What's next age or injury affecting a fighters performance?

I'm talking specifically in standup. That hole can be exploited by a smart boxer.

There hasnt been one at LHW yet.

 

[Venom]

Come on now, I love boxing but boxings not even the best striking art. If you think that, all you need is boxing and takedown defense then your an idiot. Come at me

Maybe I should refine my point. Ofc every fighter train s to take into account the leg kicks and defending takedowns and such in MMA, but throwing the hands is something many of these people learn later in life...sometimes in their 20s. They never really get proficient enough to dominate people with it like McGregor or Shevchenko.

 

[FaTaL FaTaL]

jones hands are fine, his long arms protect his face and he collects points

i dont see his boxing being a negative except his lack of pop

 

[FaTaL FaTaL]

Lol, this thread made me want to write a 50 page essay like usual but I will say dis:

It's really not that easy.

Just because Jones' opponent has superior boxing, doesn't mean they're going to beat him. Jones has a lot of weapons that he uses very effectively that often neutralizes his opponents' entire game, no matter what aspect we're talking about.

He's already faced a few guys who are better boxers than him and he beat them. His boxing can definitely be better than what it is but the most skilled and technically sound boxer doesn't always beat the lesser skilled and technically sound boxer.

It's all about effectiveness and Jones is very effective in all aspects of the game. There's tons of fighters in the UFC/MMA in general that aren't very good strikers at all in terms of their technical ability and overall skill and such, but they're effective and that's all that matters - a good example of this is Khabib.

jones boxing is excelled by his threat of take downs and leg strikes

jones is the complete package as a fighter right now, if he had power it would simply be unfair

 

[Roop Holstry]

I think injuries and age are gonna catch up to Cormier. Johnson is gonna ko him and then ko jones. Johnson might be champ for a while unless someone exposes his Achilles heel again...the rnc.

 

[Sjb1888]

Yeah, hadn't really thought about it but UFC is currently littered with champions that have boxing as their main weapon.

 

[SlicerDM]

The age of this everyone being a jack of all trades stuff is going to pass haha.

With equal TDD, it appears the better boxer is more dominant.

Wait till we get a Karate Boxer who can move like Thompson but throw hands like Garbrandt.

 

[ewww21]

Jone's reach keeps them at bay



False.
BOXING or lack thereof has contributed to a bunch of 2016 losses.
My point.



NATE ISNT a bad boxer himself..has an iron chin1..and rolled with the punches well. Something a lot of people in the league lack.

Nunes still got to the top utilizing mostly striking + takedown def.

The thing so many people are lacking is polished boxing offense/defense.

It seems like it should be a big area of focus

How long do you think Stipe will be champ? I like Stipe, but he doesn't have much to offer Cain imo. He's a less polished Dos Santos.

Striking is a fundamental part of MMA, true, but there has been no rise of boxing. There are too many ways to get past TDD.

You can cage grind, clinch, throw, shoot, knee, elbow, etc. That's how Nate beat McGregor, that's how Jon beat people, how DC beat people who have better striking and more power, how Silva beat people, etc.

The time of striking dominating has been long gone. Incorporating TDD ain't gonna save you from knees, elbows, and clinches.

 

[dmwalking]

Most of these high-profile fighters who lost this year had something in common: They either fought someone their own or larger size or they were outmatched with the hands.

Let's even go back to the Fall of 2013, when Jon Jones won by a hair against a superior boxer his size.

It's only a matter of time before Jones' relatively inferior hands get exposed by a large, fast, accurate, and powerful boxer.

So you're saying Anthony Johnson is going to KO Jones?

 

[Th3PlainTruth**]

Most of these high-profile fighters who lost this year had something in common: They either fought someone their own or larger size or they were outmatched with the hands.

Let's even go back to the Fall of 2013, when Jon Jones won by a hair against a superior boxer his size.

It's only a matter of time before Jones' relatively inferior hands get exposed by a large, fast, accurate, and powerful boxer.

Dont be fooled.
If chad mendes haddnt have gased.
But all jones needs is a good double/single leg which i dont think he has. Its hilarious that youre painting doom and gloom.
Hes not dumb like rousey. Shes got you confused.