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The most overlooked P4P great

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by BlessYourHeart, Sep 20, 2021.

  1. BlessYourHeart Orange Belt

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    Dan Henderson.

    The guy fought in 3 different weight classes and has significant wins in all of them. And when he did lose, a lot of them were to top fighters.

    Notable wins:
    Fedor, Wanderlei, Shogun, Newton, Lil Nog, Bisping, Franklin, Yvel, Sobral, Ninja Rua, Vitor, Palhares, Chonan, Gono, Calvacante, Lombard

    Notable losses:
    Anderson, DC, Rampage, Big Nog, Lil Nog, Bisping, Machida, Wanderlei, Arona, Mousasi, Shields, Vitor, Evans
     
  2. hohner Titanium Belt

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    One of those guys that could win or lose against anyone.
     
  3. SokoudjouFanboy 39 tried, just 19 succeeded

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    Maybe if you're new to the sport he's overlooked but those watching back in Hendo's prime know that he was an ATG.
     
  4. Sweater of AV Gold Belt

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    Top 5 in the GOAT discussion. War Hendo.
     
  5. 13Seconds Gold Belt

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    One of the most competitive dudes in the history of this sport. IIRC Every loss he had was competitive until Vitor finally starched him.
     
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  6. Mavrilicious Green Belt

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    One of the GOATs but not THE GOAT
     
  7. I_IZ_BACK Brown Belt

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    Hendo was great, not overlooked at all (maybe only by the casuals). He had fun fights in Pride and was fun to watch
     
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  8. WHITE ANDERSON Yellow Card Yellow Card

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    PED user though so he is disqualified, sorry!
     
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  9. ThunderStruck Silver Belt

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    Top 15 certainly.

    Top 10 arguably.

    Not nearly dominant enough to make the top 5. Too inconsistent. Top 5 are guys who absolutely dominated a weight class for years. Hendo never did that.

    Also, his career longevity was mostly due to his TRT abuse.
     
  10. Sweater of AV Gold Belt

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    Thread asks for P4P and this is your reasoning.

    <36>

    Always good for a laugh.
     
  11. SavageAngel Brown Belt

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    Hendo is a legend and hasn't gotten his dues during his day, only trully after he retired do people actually put him in the top 10 all time. During his time, there where a lot of fans from the fighters he defeated, and a lot of times Hendo was put in a situation of "He is a legend but he loses too often during his PRIME" or something like that. Still, he is and should be a top 10 legend, atleast of the older guard like Anderson, GSP, Fedor...etc...
     
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  12. Moro Brown Belt

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    Screenshot_20210920-102207~2.png

    WAR HENDO!
     
  13. Kvothe_the_kingkiller Brown Belt

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    Naw. He's one of the few that aren't a GOAT in any division, but is sometimes in top 10 and almost always in everyone's top 20. Others in that short list include DC, Max, Couture and Stipe.

    He's not overlooked whatsoever.

    As far as most overlooked, I would say Bas or Pequeno Nog. Then again, neither are on this ELO list - which isn't a definitive answer merely a reference - so maybe they aren't overlooked either.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2021
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  14. ThunderStruck Silver Belt

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    That applies to p4p as well. GOATs discussions are inherently p4p.
     
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  15. Sweater of AV Gold Belt

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    No, it doesn't.

    You are basically disqualifying people that don't care about weight, which is hilarious considering what martial arts represents.

    How about this, if someone dominates a weight class for years but never faced anyone even slightly bigger than them then they shouldn't be in consideration for top 5.

    <seedat>
     
  16. ThunderStruck Silver Belt

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    Look up at the definition of p4p. The concept was created to compare fighters from different weight classes without forcing the smaller one to fight the bigger one, which would skew the result as to who is better p4p anyway.

    Hendo had success against bigger guys but he also lost against many guys of his size and even smaller guy like Shields. P4P greats means they are the best pound for pound. As in they dominate a division. Moving up and winning does help, but not if you're inconsistent in your actual natural weight class.

    Is Aldo not a p4p great because he only moved down, never up? Is Jones not a p4p great cause he never moved up? Hopping between weight classes has no bearing on p4p rankings. Why do you think khabib was ranked #1 before his retirement? Why do you think Jones was ranked #1 for so long? Why do you think Usman is currently ranked #1 p4p? None of these guys ever moved up. Im pretty sure that all these guys working for mma medias and making rankings and getting paid for it knows better than you.
     
  17. Kvothe_the_kingkiller Brown Belt

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    So, DC, Hendo, Penn, Conor and Couture, not necessarily in that order?

    I've never actually heard that criteria before, and I like it :) don't 100% agree with it, but I like it!

    GOAT criteria is a much more interesting conversation than GOAT answers.
     
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  18. Sweater of AV Gold Belt

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    You're confused as usual. My argument is against you disqualifying fighters based on not dominating a weight class. That's idiotic and not surprising considering your level of intelligence.

    As for MMA media and people that make rankings knowing better...yeah you should definitely listen to MMA media for all of your opinions.

    <36>
     
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  19. Sweater of AV Gold Belt

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    Agreed, criteria is a much more interesting discussion.

    People like Hendo, BJ, Big Nog, Saku, Fedor should all be near the top imho. Of course, people will have different opinions based on the criteria they value.
     
  20. RogerB08 Red Belt

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    If Bas gets overlooked it's only because his real legacy is in Pancrase with their silly pro wrestling style rules and those stupid boots that favored leg lock guys.
     
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